Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaorange
The guy has been absolutely horrible at coaching. Larry Brown won more games than we have now and he didn't have the talent that is here now. You people crucified him. Thomas is not a good coach by any stretch. As far as his judge of ability and talent, and his GM prowess.....please. There are few moves he made that are real pleasant surprises. Frye over Bynum? Lee I like. Nate over Jack, Kleiza, Ewing, Turiaf, Ellis, Blatche, and Gelebale? Take a look. He blew the Balkman/Collins draft as well. Now we can talk about his trades. The Curry trade? Gave WAY too much. Randolph? That may end up a real killer. FA signings? Gave up far too much money for the players he signed. The man is way overrated in every capacity. He may have a great Bball mind but it's overshadowed by all his failings.
With regards to where we are now as compared to where we were when he got here? Let's see...we have had 3 years of 20+ wins with no top picks to show for it. We have perhaps more talent, but it doesn't mesh and we can't trade it for good talent that does. We still are cap bound and only by finding a trading partner to take Randolph for shorter contracts will be be able to do anything by '09. We are still a crappy team....crappier than we were, even. We still have no definite future as far as young guys (sans Lee), and we have no cap flexibility. Tell me again how the franchise is better because of his time here?
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I think you clearly do not completely understand how well Isiah did in bringing in talent. Let's critique each one of the moves he made.
The first was Channing Frye over Andrew Bynum. In retrospect it's always easy to criticize individuals for these sort of moves but Isiah made the right decision. At the time, as he pointed out, the Knicks were in no sort of position to use assets to develop players (his rationale behind cutting Slavko Vranes). We still had a roster composed of veterans and still into the concept of "win now." Frye presented us with a 6-11 shot blocker at the 5 position which we desperately needed to upgrade. He could have stepped in and immediately help put us into the playoffs. That ambition changed when we realized that we could acquire a 3rd first round pick and Eddy Curry.
Everyone agreed with Isiah at the time and many (including probably yourself) was on the Frye bandwagon. In fact, many bashed Isiah for wanting to go after Charlie Villanova had he not been taken by the Raptors. I recall just how smug many Knick fans were about that with Raptor fans, thanking them for delivering Frye to us. Frye was just that good a prospect; even following the draft many felt there was a conspiracy because they thought that he was too good to go as low as he did and supposedly told Utah not to draft him after trading up to the 3 spot.
Long story short, Bynum might have not been the Bynum he is now had he come to the Knicks considering the emmense pressure to win and the absence of Kareem Abdul-Jabber.
As for Nate, he's better than all the players you mentioned. The Blazers don't even want Jarret Jack anymore and neither did Atlanta when the Blazers were offering him up this offseason. Daniel Ewing is nothing more than a defensive stopper, Galebele can't even get playing time in Seattle and might not even be in the league in a couple years and Andray Blatche has shown nothing but promise. Ronny Turiaf is nothing more than a bigger, less talented David Lee and Monta Ellis might be the only guy that you might have an argument for. The thing is that at the time and even today, Ellis had serious health concerns which caused him to drop. He's shown he can still perform in spite of them but I don't think he's clearly better than Nate Robinson. If Nate got as much playing time and played in the same system, I bet he'd be having as much if not more than the impact Ellis has.
I think in retrospect the Eddy Curry trade is still a little even in my book. The players we gave up were all irrelevant. As for the draft picks, Tyrus Thomas is a bust waiting to happen in my book and I'd rather have Curry than Noah (or anyone else after) at this point because of the mismatches having a scoring center presents.
Zach Randolph was had for a nickel on the dollar. In spite of all the off the court issues, he's still a 20 and 10 big man that is just 26 years old. Some playoff aspiring team will take a chance on him, as have countless others on similar players. Chances are those returns will be much more valuable in the long run to us than Steve Francis or Channing Frye.
I think we need to stop worrying about talent at this point and trade for the unheralded role players that will help mix and match the pieces together. Look at how much of a difference that made for Toronto the year Colangelo was hired. We already have the pieces to be competitive in the Eastern Conference.