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Old 01-19-2013, 12:05 PM   #646 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Zero and three is tough to take, but as bad if not worse is that the guys expected to lead have for whatever reason, not done so.
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:01 PM   #647 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Any Flyer fans on here thinking they still have a run in them?

I think we can run off a few in a row, but any hopes of the NCAA tournament were almost completely dashed by the 0-3 start. I hope Archie is working like crazy to get the team to value the ball over this 'bye.'

I also hope he is trying to re-allocate the shot attempts. Dillard and Sanford take the most shots of anyone, which is to be expected. However, after the two starting guards, Oliver and Benson are taking almost twice as many shots as the next group (Robinson and Pierre, with Derenbecker on their heels).

If Pierre, Robinson and Derenbecker were taking 6-8 more attempts per game between instead of Benson and Oliver taking those shots, we might see better results. Of course, scoring hasn't been the primary problem.
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:52 PM   #648 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Any hope for an NCAA berth was dashed when Kavanaugh was kicked off the team. The Flyers need to focus their energies on giving the underclassmen experience so they'll be ready to go next year. This year is a wash.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:35 PM   #649 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

I think the Flyers are going to pull it together. This is not going to end up being a great season, but they're not going to embarrass themselves. At this point, I'm just hoping they peak around the A10 tournament. It's hard to imagine them winning it due to the ridiculous quality of the conference this season, but they can make a run.

And I know that Benson has really been struggling defensively, but he's still shooting 54% from the floor. I am perfectly happy with him getting shots. I definitely want to see Pierre get more shots, as he can seem to drift in and out of the center of action.

I always thought that Oliver just had to get over his confidence problems, but at this point, I only want to see him shooting near the rim. 21% three point shooting is for real, and it's not going to change this season. I still love the guy and all that he brings, but he's a Brian Cardinal type hustle guy with less range. He needs to play within his skill set. I'd love for Derenbecker and Pierre to get his 3 point attempts. However, the reason he gets all these open looks is that opponents know they can sag off him without concern. Those looks just aren't there for other, more accurate players.
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:51 PM   #650 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

I think UD guys don't want to admit it but Benson is still at least a half step slow due most probably to the acl. Everybody with an acl sez they are fine after a year. It takes 2 unless you're Peterson. Lot of guys going right at him and by him and he can't make the quick cut to stop them. Quite evident in the LaSalle game.
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Old 01-21-2013, 08:08 PM   #651 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

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I think UD guys don't want to admit it but Benson is still at least a half step slow due most probably to the acl. Everybody with an acl sez they are fine after a year. It takes 2 unless you're Peterson. Lot of guys going right at him and by him and he can't make the quick cut to stop them. Quite evident in the LaSalle game.
You're probably right on that, but I think his defensive problems are more fundamental. He's not strong enough to push guys out of position, and he doesn't seem to play very aggressively. I think on offense, he has made up for the lack of burst caused by the ACL injury with some sneaky moves. (I love his long stride across the lane move, which I'd like to see more of.)

I wouldn't mind see him and Gavrilovic play together more, but Gavrilovic seems planted on the bench. He's been playing with Robinson quite a bit, though, so I guess it's not all that different. Then again, if he is lacking quickness, it might be hard for him to guard some of the smaller forwards of the A10.

I would also like to see Benson stop taking 18 footers. It's a pretty low percentage shot for him. And how about making some free throws?
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:32 AM   #652 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

I hear you that Benson is shooting 54%, but fewer shot attempts for him hopefully means fewer minutes, fewer touches, and fewer turnovers. He turns the ball over at a high rate for a big man, and those don't count against his shooting percentage. Benson's 54% comes at a cost.

bprichard, you like the travel across the lane? The main problem with that move is that he is called for a travel on it at least 50% of the time. It definitely works if he isn't called for traveling, but how do you keep doing something that is called for traveling at such a high rate?

As you mention, its the 18 footers and a couple of forced shots per game that I wish Benson did not take - if he didn't he would probably shoot over 60%. Similarly, for Oliver, he should steer clear of the outside jump shots. If those two guys did that, they would each take 3 less shots per game -- opportunities that would likely go to Pierre, Robinson, Vee, etc.

I agree with both bprichard and Mudflap regarding Benson's defense. He is making fundamental/mental lapse mistakes on defense, but he is also slower and lacks explosiveness. I even think it hurts him in the low post shoving matches, because he just doesn't trust that knee enough. Its time for him to play 12-15 minutes per game.
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Old 01-22-2013, 06:07 AM   #653 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Hahaha, I absolutely love it when they don't call the big sweeping travel. Benson is averaging the exact same amount of turnovers per game as last season (2.2 per game in about the same number of minutes), though. I'm much more concerned about the defensive issues. He's clearly been slumping the last few games, but I'm an unabashed Josh Benson apologist. I love that he's a local guy. I love the resolve he's shown in coming back from two serious injuries. I'm really sad to see him not playing his best of late, despite the fact that more minutes for the freshmen would help their development.
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:24 AM   #654 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

The Cobra mentions the travel across the lane on offense. Another weakness of Benson's game which hasn't been mentioned is the charge-flop. He does that at least twice per game and it usually is called a block. Such a move is not becoming of a big man and often amounts to him getting a cheap foul or two called on him early in the game. It's one thing if Price does it, but it is aggravating when a 6'10 man does it.
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Old 01-22-2013, 10:36 AM   #655 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Could not agree more, John. Why are you trying to draw a charge on someone who is quicker than you but 6 inches shorter? That is not playing to your strengths.

Another thing that bothers me about Benson's D is that he never battles for position before the ball arrives. As a weaker big man, he needs to do his work early and make guys work to put their foot on the block, because once they do, you are toast. Even I do this in pickup games! But he seems to just stand behind guys and let them catch it on the block. Obviously, Jerell Wright was able to do this and had great results.

He isn't rebounding, he isn't defending, and he is turning the ball over. I say give the younger guys more minutes, and not for development's sake. For this year's team's sake. Who knows, maybe getting benched will light a fire under him.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:17 PM   #656 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Speaking of: http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/...preview/nT4Ph/

UD coach Archie Miller told his players after coming home from a 72-70 loss at La Salle last Wednesday that no one should feel secure over his playing time. “We approached it after La Salle that some things had to change with certain individuals or we would change the minutes and the rotation,” Miller said.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:18 PM   #657 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Also, on a brighter note, congratulations to Chris Johnson for signing a 10-day contract with the Memphis Grizzlies!

http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/...izzlies/nT4Xc/
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Old 01-22-2013, 06:16 PM   #658 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

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Any Flyer fans on here thinking they still have a run in them?

I think we can run off a few in a row, but any hopes of the NCAA tournament were almost completely dashed by the 0-3 start. I hope Archie is working like crazy to get the team to value the ball over this 'bye.'

I also hope he is trying to re-allocate the shot attempts. Dillard and Sanford take the most shots of anyone, which is to be expected. However, after the two starting guards, Oliver and Benson are taking almost twice as many shots as the next group (Robinson and Pierre, with Derenbecker on their heels).

If Pierre, Robinson and Derenbecker were taking 6-8 more attempts per game between instead of Benson and Oliver taking those shots, we might see better results. Of course, scoring hasn't been the primary problem.
If they have a run, it will be in the last seven games. Barring something stupid, they will win both home games this week. That leaves them with a stretch of at Xavier, at SLU, home St Joe and home Temple. If they could get through that 2-2, putting them at 4-5, they could finish 10-6 by protecting home court, winning road games against lesser teams, and pulling a small upset at Charlotte or UMass. Unlikely? Perhaps. But reasonably doable.

I figured UD would go 10-6, but that's with a 1-2 start. A game behind now, I don't see any reason to think they can't get to 9 wins. Wouldn't be cause for a celebration, but it wouldn't be terrible, either. This league is much tougher than it has been recently.

As for Benson, he has always been a half step slow on defense. He has always gotten beat by quick bigs and always gotten plowed over by strong bigs. He has always tried to slide in to draw a charge instead of waiting, forcing the guard to commit to a shot, and then using his wingspan to block or alter the shot. All that does is allow and easy dumpoff pass and a dunk. Happens every game, several times in some games. Always makes me shake my head. Guy could be a weakside monster, blocking 3 shots per game, but he'd rather try to be goddamn Wojo drawing charges. Very low IQ player on defense.

Conversely, Devon Scott barely plays and when faced with that scenario, he invited Roosevelt Jones to try to dunk on him. He gave a foul, but he made the correct play. Let the smaller guy come to you, don't go meet him out of your house. Jones certainly wasn't going to score over or around Scott. That's the attitude a big needs on defense. Come get some. Unless a dribbler is completely out of control you should never try to draw a charge if you are over 6'7".

Benson, like so many other BG recruits, will graduate being pretty much the exact same player he was as a sophomore. Hopefully we're seeing the end of that trend with Archie overseeing the development of every player after this class, including Oliver (the last BG player).
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:07 PM   #659 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

Funny. I remember you singing the praises of these guys not too long ago. Gotta agree on the Archie's recruits. They will be C7 ready.
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Old 01-23-2013, 09:04 AM   #660 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Dayton Flyers

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Originally Posted by AdamtheFlyer View Post
If they have a run, it will be in the last seven games. Barring something stupid, they will win both home games this week. That leaves them with a stretch of at Xavier, at SLU, home St Joe and home Temple. If they could get through that 2-2, putting them at 4-5, they could finish 10-6 by protecting home court, winning road games against lesser teams, and pulling a small upset at Charlotte or UMass. Unlikely? Perhaps. But reasonably doable.

I figured UD would go 10-6, but that's with a 1-2 start. A game behind now, I don't see any reason to think they can't get to 9 wins. Wouldn't be cause for a celebration, but it wouldn't be terrible, either. This league is much tougher than it has been recently.

As for Benson, he has always been a half step slow on defense. He has always gotten beat by quick bigs and always gotten plowed over by strong bigs. He has always tried to slide in to draw a charge instead of waiting, forcing the guard to commit to a shot, and then using his wingspan to block or alter the shot. All that does is allow and easy dumpoff pass and a dunk. Happens every game, several times in some games. Always makes me shake my head. Guy could be a weakside monster, blocking 3 shots per game, but he'd rather try to be goddamn Wojo drawing charges. Very low IQ player on defense.

Conversely, Devon Scott barely plays and when faced with that scenario, he invited Roosevelt Jones to try to dunk on him. He gave a foul, but he made the correct play. Let the smaller guy come to you, don't go meet him out of your house. Jones certainly wasn't going to score over or around Scott. That's the attitude a big needs on defense. Come get some. Unless a dribbler is completely out of control you should never try to draw a charge if you are over 6'7".

Benson, like so many other BG recruits, will graduate being pretty much the exact same player he was as a sophomore. Hopefully we're seeing the end of that trend with Archie overseeing the development of every player after this class, including Oliver (the last BG player).
I actually think this is very realistic. No one would have wanted the A-10 schedule that UD was handed to start the season. 10-6 doesn't seem that far fetched to me.
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