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Old 01-04-2013, 10:24 AM   #751 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

Quote:
Originally Posted by xu95 View Post

I think the coaching staff is doing the right things to get good players back in the fold and in a year or two things will get back to where they were.
This is nothing more than hopeful speculation.

It's far too early to say if any of Chris Mack's new recruits will be 'good players' in 2013-14 or if things will get back to where they were in a year or two.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Muddy Waters on November 20, 2012 View Post

Randolph: "Xavier it is!" (Shannon Russell - November 20, 2012)
Class of 2013 point guard Brandon Randolph announced via Twitter that he has chosen Xavier as his college destination.

It’s also expected to announce Kamall Richards as the other member of the 2013 class.

Six-foot-one Randolph is from Inglewood, Calif., a short hop from XU’s destination (Anaheim) later today.

Richards is a 6-5 forward who attends the South Kent School in Connecticut.

Xavier Musketeers 2013-14 Roster:

Code:
    Player             Yr. Position   Ht.   Wt.   

 1. Philmore, Isaiah   SR  Forward    6-8   230    
 2. Cantino, Chris     SR  Forward    6-7   240    
 3. Stenger, Erik      SR  Forward    6-7   207    

 4. Stainbrook, Matt   JR  C          6-9   263    
 5. Martin, Justin     JR  Forward    6-6   205    
 6. Davis, Dee         JR  PG         6-0   160    

 7. Farr, James        SO  Forward    6-9   222    
 8. Christon, Semaj    SO  CG         6-3   182    
     
 9. Reynolds, Jalen    FR  Forward    6-9   220    
10. Richards, Kamall   FR  Forward    6-5   210    
11. Davis, Myles       FR  SG         6-2   200    
12. Randolph, Brandon  FR  CG         6-1   190

Scholarships available for HS Class of 2013 recruits or transfers: 1.

Xavier Musketeers 2012-13 Stats (Yahoo!)
James Farr 2012-13 Stats and Game Log (Yahoo !)


Erik Stenger 2012-13 Stats and Game Log (Yahoo !)


3-Star SF Kamall Richards (Rivals HS Class of 2013 Profile)


3-Star SG Brandon Randolph (Rivals HS Class of 2013 Profile)

Next year, Xavier will return only 6 players who have already played a game for Xavier, assuming that everyone returns, which far from a certainty.

Chris Mack will have 6 or more new players on his roster who have never played a game for Xavier.

That's not nearly enough information to make a substantiated claim that Xavier will have a better team in 2013-14 than in 2012-13.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingElvis View Post

Strip away the double-talk and it is "Wait until next year".

It's only taboo because you have chosen to make it taboo as a criticism of your foes. If you know your team is pretty bad, and you are likely to be better the following year, it's OK to think and say "Wait till next year". Circumstances will force you to wait, whether you like it or not.

I do believe that X will improve significantly next year. I have confidence in that because some of the players for X right now are freaking walk-ons and div 2 transfers. The line-up was just decimated over the summer.

You have to wonder, though, if someone else will be ineligible next year after the pattern that has been established.

I don't expect the X back-ups (meaning this years starters due to defections and ineligibility) to compete for an A10 Championship like has been advertised in the past on this board.

I would be very surprised if Xavier has no more roster 'surprises' before their first game of the 2013-14 season.


Last edited by Muddy Waters; 01-04-2013 at 10:37 AM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:05 AM   #752 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by Muddy Waters View Post
This is nothing more than hopeful speculation.

It's far too early to say if any of Chris Mack's new recruits will be 'good players' in 2013-14 or if things will get back to where they were in a year or two.
But that is exactly what you do about Dayton's recruits all the time.....

Why is it OK for you to do it and not X??????
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:38 AM   #753 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by xavierhoops View Post
It only becomes taboo when a program’s fans have to use the “wait till next year card” year after year after year after year after year because of their program’s results and (lack of) success.
BOOM!
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:57 AM   #754 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by a10nick View Post
I seem to recall that just 2-3 years ago a fairly decent player by the name of sophomore Jordan Crawford was the acclaimed leader of the Musketeers --- so good in fact that he is now doing quite well in the NBA.

The point is, you don't necessarily have to be a 4th-year player to lead your team to the promised land in D-1 college basketball, at Xavier or anywhere. All the former players you mentioned were very important players in the Muskie program even during their early years with XU. Why can't we imagine (or even assume) tha some of our non-seniors like Christon, Randolph, Stainbrook, Martin, Reynolds, the two Davises, etc... could lead Xavier to successful seasons next year and beyond?
Jason Love was on that team.
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:23 PM   #755 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

Xavier's biggest issue is obviously talent, they just don't have much. Semaj is exactly who I thought he would be, dynamite in the open court but can get bogged down in the half court. He doesn't shoot well outside of the paint (and has been missing a ton in the paint, too). Davis is decent but limited in what he can do by his size and average quickness. Travis Taylor has been outstanding, but other than him, there is no one to fear inside. Philmore is decent, but not good enough to beat you. Robinson is Robinson. Stenger plays harder than anyone but is extremely limited in what he can do.

All in all, this is a borderline NIT roster playing like a borderline NIT team. A few games have turned out differently than you would have thought, but overall, they are in about the same spot most thought they would be.

I also think there have been some schematic issues. Against Wake Forest, Travis Taylor was dominant inside all first half. Second half Wake gives more help on him, and Xavier just ignored him the rest of the game. They didn't even try to play off that by attacking the weak side, they just kept running the same stuff but didn't pass him the ball. Ended up with a ton of dribbling and a ton of tough looks. It was confusing to watch.

They also don't work triangles very well. Rarely will you see Semaj, Taylor, and Martin/Redford all on the strong side. Their shooters tend to set up weak side, and I don't think any of their ball handlers are good enough to make that work consistently, nor are their posts good enough to handle the attention that slides over to meet their moves to the paint. If they want good looks inside they have to turn baseline, which is a much more difficult shot to make.

As for next year, it's entirely possible that the newcomers have few if any limitations and they immediately get back to where they were. Possible, but very unlikely. More likely is what someone mentioned on the last page, they will climb the ladder rung by rung over the next couple of years before they get back to the Xavier we all know.
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Last edited by AdamtheFlyer; 01-04-2013 at 12:31 PM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 01:59 PM   #756 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by TheCobra View Post
Jason Love was on that team.
Are you seriously trying to convince anybody that Jason Love was the reason people went to see Xavier basketball the year Jordan Crawford played for the Muskies?

Jason was a fine player in his senior year and was one of the top contributors on the team. But whenever Xavier needed a shot to drop to get us out of a funk, a steal, an offensive rebound from the shooting guard position, an acrobatic play to excite the crowd, or a key "find" of a teammate in scoring position, it was Crawford to the rescue.
\
People loved Jason Love because of his work ethic in making strides in his game season after season. But it was Jordan Crawford who most of them came to see for his oohs and aahs factors!
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:34 PM   #757 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by Muddy Waters View Post
This is nothing more than hopeful speculation.
Can't the same be said for every post you make about Dayton? time will tell if any of these guys pan out, but it is my personal belief that they will be better next year and better still the year after that.

It is your personal opinion that Dayton will someday beat Xavier in Cincinnati. Maybe we are both wrong.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:35 PM   #758 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by AdamtheFlyer View Post
Xavier's biggest issue is obviously talent, they just don't have much. Semaj is exactly who I thought he would be, dynamite in the open court but can get bogged down in the half court. He doesn't shoot well outside of the paint (and has been missing a ton in the paint, too). Davis is decent but limited in what he can do by his size and average quickness. Travis Taylor has been outstanding, but other than him, there is no one to fear inside. Philmore is decent, but not good enough to beat you. Robinson is Robinson. Stenger plays harder than anyone but is extremely limited in what he can do.

All in all, this is a borderline NIT roster playing like a borderline NIT team. A few games have turned out differently than you would have thought, but overall, they are in about the same spot most thought they would be.

I also think there have been some schematic issues. Against Wake Forest, Travis Taylor was dominant inside all first half. Second half Wake gives more help on him, and Xavier just ignored him the rest of the game. They didn't even try to play off that by attacking the weak side, they just kept running the same stuff but didn't pass him the ball. Ended up with a ton of dribbling and a ton of tough looks. It was confusing to watch.

They also don't work triangles very well. Rarely will you see Semaj, Taylor, and Martin/Redford all on the strong side. Their shooters tend to set up weak side, and I don't think any of their ball handlers are good enough to make that work consistently, nor are their posts good enough to handle the attention that slides over to meet their moves to the paint. If they want good looks inside they have to turn baseline, which is a much more difficult shot to make.

As for next year, it's entirely possible that the newcomers have few if any limitations and they immediately get back to where they were. Possible, but very unlikely. More likely is what someone mentioned on the last page, they will climb the ladder rung by rung over the next couple of years before they get back to the Xavier we all know.

what do you know? You are a Wright State Raider fan.

Actually this is a very well thought out post. Some of your brethren could look at this as a way to have a reasonable conversation.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:38 PM   #759 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by a10nick View Post
Are you seriously trying to convince anybody that Jason Love was the reason people went to see Xavier basketball the year Jordan Crawford played for the Muskies?

Jason was a fine player in his senior year and was one of the top contributors on the team. But whenever Xavier needed a shot to drop to get us out of a funk, a steal, an offensive rebound from the shooting guard position, an acrobatic play to excite the crowd, or a key "find" of a teammate in scoring position, it was Crawford to the rescue.
\
People loved Jason Love because of his work ethic in making strides in his game season after season. But it was Jordan Crawford who most of them came to see for his oohs and aahs factors!
I am not trying to convince anyone that Love was "the reason people went to see Xavier basketball." But, I am trying to convince people that Jason Love was a senior and a leader, which I thought was what we were talking about. Right?

Jason was a player who, as you said, worked hard and improved every year. He grew in his role, going from role player to a more featured player. He was a total team guy. He had that winning mentality that the poster mentioned Sato, Cage, Doellman, and Raymond having. I thought that was what we were talking about? I honestly thought it was.

I am not disputing that Crawford was the best player on the team. But, I think Love played a vital role on that team and they wouldn't have been the same without him.

And no, I suppose Love never provided "an offensive rebound from the shooting guard position," but he did provide offensive rebounds.

Try again.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:48 PM   #760 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by xu95 View Post
what do you know? You are a Wright State Raider fan.

Actually this is a very well thought out post. Some of your brethren could look at this as a way to have a reasonable conversation.
Yes, its all Dayton fans who don't know how to have a reasonable conversation. The post you just made on the Dayton recruiting thread related to the topic being discussed (Dillard's clutchness and replacing him) and was not an attempt to provoke at all.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:57 PM   #761 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by AdamtheFlyer View Post
Semaj is exactly who I thought he would be, dynamite in the open court but can get bogged down in the half court. He doesn't shoot well outside of the paint (and has been missing a ton in the paint, too)
Semaj is obviously fun to watch in the open court, but he also can create for himself in the half court. His first step is just so quick. He's getting looks and good drives in half-court sets, he just can't finish worth shit right now, from the floor or free throw line.
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Old 01-05-2013, 03:18 AM   #762 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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Originally Posted by xavierhoops View Post
And please, continue with the multi-year rough patch predictions and essays on how it will take years for X's recruiting to recover.
Are UD fans the only ones talking about this as a possibility for X? I see it among a good number of X fans on this board and others boards. Even in this thread, I see some mention of it from X fans. I think it's very sensible to expect the players coming in after graduations this year to take some time to get back to previous levels of play/success.

I don't know if it's necessarily the raw recruiting that needs to recover for X, but their ability to recruit good players who have a high probability of elgibility and that X can retain for more than a year or two. The line-up has been really volatile under Mack so far. He goes with a high-risk, high-reward strategy. All programs have some turnover for various reasons, but Mack has had more than his share, even among his coaches.

The best thing going for X next season is that they are losing some bad players to graduation and probably getting the depth that they won't need to play Stenger and a walk-on for any significant minutes.

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Old 01-05-2013, 07:04 AM   #763 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

i remain stumped that Dayton fans are so obsessed with XU.
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:26 AM   #764 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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I don't know if it's necessarily the raw recruiting that needs to recover for X, but their ability to recruit good players who have a high probability of elgibility and that X can retain for more than a year or two.
Have you noticed the 2 major pick-ups X got over the past couple months?

I know nobody posts daily, lengthy articles about any story written about these two from high school, but I think Brandon Randolph and Melvin Swift are OK players.
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:30 AM   #765 (permalink)
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Re: 2012-2013 Xavier Musketeers

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The line-up has been really volatile under Mack so far. He goes with a high-risk, high-reward strategy.
Give me Sean Miller and Chris Mack's high-risk, high-reward strategy and the results it produces (you really don't need me to list all those out again, do you Elvis?) and one bad year within a decade, as opposed to UD's overarching philosophy of accepting mediocrity in men's basketball which leads to middle-of-the-pack A-10 finshes, NIT losses and national irrelevance year after year after year after year after year.
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