jpschmack

The NCAA always has had the right to suspend a program for lack of institutional control even if they're not a repeat violator.

The NCAA is also too scared to give the death penalty out again. They compare it to a nuclear bomb: We saw what it did, and the threat of it is so terrifying that everyone backs down before it's used again.

But I think a big time BCS program like Penn State would survive just fine.

SMU had 30 years of terrible football after the death penalty because of four reasons that don't affect the big boys:
-- SMU isn't a school that draws 70,000 no matter who they play.
-- SMU was a tenant at Cowboys Stadium. Their 23,783-seat on-campus "stadium" had been neglected as a venue for 40 years.
-- SMU downgraded from a prestigious conference.
-- SMU didn't get in on the TV contracts the big boys got when the NCAA ceded control to conferences and ESPN/ESPN2 led to a quadrupling of TV timeslots.

I don't think the SMU Death Penalty made the SWC break up at all. It was the TV rights that led the Big Eight to try and land the Texas market, and the selling of the SEC Championship Game that led the SEC to add Arkansas and South Carolina.

Penn State (or Ohio State, who had 52 athletes getting the Buckeye discount on cars) would survive the death penalty no problem:

When they came back, they wouldn't have to play in 25,000-seat "stadium" that had been neglected for 40 years, they'd go right back to selling 400,000 tickets a season. Right back to having the weight rooms, support staff and all the infrastructure that lets them generate $60 million a year in the first place. And right back to collecting their BCS/Big Ten Network money cause no one's gonna kick them out.

Actually, Ohio State getting the death penalty for one year would probably be the single worst thing ever to happen to the Mid-American Conference. All the kids who dream of playing for Ohio State and end up in the MAC would immediate consider going out of state and might find a school they like. And when Ohio State came back, practically the entire MAC All-Conference teams would transfer to OSU.

It would knock PSU/OSU/whomever back 7-10 years. Then they'd be right back where they started. USC lost 20 scholarships and were #5 in the country last year.

jpschmack

Scholarship reduction does nothing and is a stupid way to punish.

It baffles me that they don't use the "No home out of conference games" penalty much. (Only Baylor men's hoops has gotten it in the last 25 years).

Docking home OOC games would hurt the school financially. PSU would lose revenue from 280,000 tickets sold. But the STUDENTS who didn't do anything wrong can still play and go to a bowl. It would also HELP financially all the small schools who play by the rules without the recruiting advantages of big schools.

You tell Penn State they have to play their scheduled games against Akron, Buffalo, Temple, UMass, Bowling Green on the ROAD (and not give back the guarantees) and every single one of those schools wouldn't sell out a home game against PSU?

X-band '01

For all intents and purposes, the Freeh Report was the result of a comprehensive investigation that was much more detailed than your average NCAA investigation. The Miami investigation is still ongoing in that regard - that's why the NCAA was able to make their ruling (which, I might add, won't be appealed by the current Penn State administration).

X-band '01

If my understanding is correct, Penn State is ineligible to receive the bowl revenue from the conference - that money will also be diverted to charities that deal with helping prevent child abuse.

I have NOT heard anything saying that they would be deprived of their share of other Big 10 revenues, most notably their share of the conference TV deal. That is revenue that they will still receive this year; keep in mind that not all of the TV network revenue is football-related.

Point #2 - they will not be booted from the conference anytime soon. The Big 10 conference is not about to jeopardize their newest cash cow that is their football championship game. They would have to have a replacement lined up, whether it's Notre Dame or Maryland or Virginia or Rutgers or whoever else.

X-band '01

Now that Penn State is having their records vacated, will their YouTube famous moments also be vacated? (besides JoePa's bowels)

Mac539

I am sure there are many in the legislature who are smiling. JoPa ran Penn St. Whatever money they wanted, they got. No one wanted to make enemies of Paterno's friends. Now maybe the state can rein in PSU wasteful budget.

ExplorerSteve

Your ignorance knows no bounds. What evidence do you have to back your claim? None, because there is no internal or external report to prove your allegation. You hate the Catholic Church and the Pope, I get that. I don't condemn an entire religion for the actions of a small percentage. Unfortunately the media covers up similar behaviors by protestant ministers, rabbis and others in other religions.

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ExplorerSteve

1. The NCAA needs to fine the Paterno estate for the equivalent of the past 14 years of his salary. This money needs to go to protecting children through real charities.

2. The NCAA needs to fine Pete Carroll at least $3 million for repeat violations at USC that he should have stopped.

3. The NCAA needs to impose steep financial penalties against all coaches that repeatedly cheat including Calipari and Calhoun. Also suspend them for a full season without pay or benefits to send the message.

4. Renegade schools like ones in the SEC and Miami need to be punished harshly by losing scholarships for recruiting violations.

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UMass87

ExplorerSteve - You know and I know that you are unable to accept anything as fact if it indicates/proves/suggests that the Catholic Church, the Pope, or priests had anything to do with pedophilia. For instance: http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-731683.html asserts that it is simply not credible that Ratzinger was unaware of the pedophile under him.

ExplorerSteve

Someone's assertion does not make it a fact. The Pope was far removed from anyone involved and has demanded that the U.S. Bishops and Bishops in other countries do a better job of screening out actively gay men from the priesthood and also that they must remove and report any priest who is known to have acted immorally.

American society in general, needs to have more safeguards in place to prevent abuses of children. Those convicted must face long jail sentences that include tough physical labor (building, cleaning up litter, and assisting maintence of roads and bridges) during the day and solitary confinement during the night with just basic food and water. No television, books or any special treatment.

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AdamtheFlyer

You are forgetting that SMU wasn't allowed back on TV until 1991. Their "death penalty" wasn't just a 1 year suspension. It was that, plus no home games in 1988 (and they just chose not to play any games), plus no TV games through their probation. Back then, no team on probation could be on TV. That had a large part in Arkansas looking to the SEC and a few years later, the bigger Texas schools looking toward the Big 8/12.

Yes, the bigger schools survived and even thrived. But the SMU penalty not only killed SMU, it knocked Rice and Houston into the dark ages, and set TCU back a couple of decades as well. There is no denying the correlation. The SWC was a strong, thriving league up to 1987. It died with SMU.

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Sure, I've been called a xenophobe, but the truth is, I'm not. I honestly just feel that America is the best country and the other countries aren't as good. That used to be called patriotism.

X-man47

Here is a link to today's contribution to the LONG list of Catholic pedophilia issues covered up by the Church (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/25/us...e-case.html?hp), and it's right in your own back yard! Who knew?

__________________
Xavier always goes to the NCAA tournament, and almost always makes some noise while there. Projecting anything less than that this season feels like folly.
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jpschmack

Probation and TV bans weren't automatically tied together. They were under the NCAA's TV monopoly, but that went away in 1984. That was one or two TV timeslots and no one getting paid. 7 of 9 SWC schools were on probation or under investigation in the 80s. No one would be on TV in that league.Here's Texas getting probation and no TV ban in 1987: http://www.nytimes.com/1987/06/18/sp...probation.html

Blaming the breakup of the SWC on SMU's death penalty would be like the A-10 folding because of the Bonnies' welding scandal. With Xavier and Temple and St. Joe's and everyone else, the league was just fine with the Bonnies in last place and not on TV.

The whole reason SMU was cheating was because their boosters were sick of getting creamed. They had 21 losing seasons from 1949 to 1979. They weren't the power of the league. The SWC was doomed whether SMU got the death penalty of not.

Once Notre Dame and the SEC broke ranks on the CFA and got their own TV deals, the SWC was toast. They had virtually no negotiating power with TV because their entire conference was confined to two markets (Dallas and Houston). Six of the eight members after Arkansas left (for TV reasons) brought nothing to the table, TV wise.


From 1995's Athlon Sports Big Eight magazine:
(SWC commissioner Fred Jacoby (1982-93) on pitching a merger with the Big Eight)
"If we could merge the Southwest and the Big Eight conference, we could take our 7 percent of the market, then with the Big Eight's 8 percent, we could have 15 percent of the nation's television sets. And we could literally control the whole central time zone from Minnesota and the Dakotas all the way to the Gulf. That was our vision."

"When I got through, they looked at me like, 'What the hell are you talking about?"

(SWC Associate commish): "As a league, you went in trying to create three packages: national, syndicated, plus they (the members) wanted to hold something on their own. The conference wasn't deep enough to support it."

(Texas AD: DeLoss Dodds): "For a long time in there," Dodds says, "and I can't define it--two or three years--it was obvious (the SWC) was going to have to break up. But politically, it couldn't. The SEC leaving the CFA package was the impetus to make it happen."

(CBS and the SEC made a deal) That move effectively ended the CFA package. ABC quickly reached agreement with the ACC. CBS then signed the Big East. That left the Big Eight and the SWC.

When the CFA coalition broke up, the two leagues agreed to negotiate as a unit. CBS, after acquiring the rights to the SEC and the Big East, said it had room for no one else. That left ABC, which within a week made a $60 million offer to the two leagues. The 16 schools met to discuss it.

Dr. Robert Berdahl, University of Texas president left no doubt that Texas had no qualms about dissolving the SWC. Berdahl told them that the university had had discussions with the PAC-10 Conference and that Texas leaned toward going west.

Big Eight officials began to explore what the league's worth would be to ABC without the SWC. But they also realized that they would have to make some sort of agreement or else Texas and Texas A&M would walk.

ABC had said the value of its offer for 12 schools would be the same amount of money as if the Big Eight and the SWC merged. By leaving Houston, Rice, SMU and TCU behind, the 12 schools received one-third more money.

(End quoting)

While all this was going on, Baylor and A&M had substantial pull in state government. The Texas Board of Regents had to approve conference moves and powerful alums were trying to block changes that left their alma mater's behind.

The governor (a Baylor grad) told Texas that they would slash UT's budget drastically if they abandoned six SWC schools. Texas told both the Pac-10 and Big Eight they could only join if Tech and Baylor were included. The Big Eight obviously accepted that, and the Pac-10 wouldn't.

Had SMU been clean and strong, and the power of the league, it would have been UT, SMU, A&M and Baylor going to the Big Eight while the SWC folded. But the league was folding anyway.

URIrx

Penn state signed a consent agreement which is why the process eventually is "legal" if they chose to fight the punishment then the NCAA would of had a much harder time making the punishment stick as the rules don't cover this situation.

I still think an appropriate punishment would of been a season of home games with fans banned(along with other things). the silence of the stadium would be a reminder of the silence the penn state admin kept to protect its image

TUOwl06

The whole SWC was corrupt. Wasn't SMU, TCU, Texas A&M, Houston, Texas and Baylor all on or recently off probation in the early/mid 90's?