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Old 12-12-2012, 01:36 PM   #661 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Originally Posted by Knobby View Post
You guys are all funny. You all act like these AD's are reading your ideas on this fanboard and will take them into consideration when they start negotiating.... Oooh, I cen hear it now, Mateer over on the basketball Forum A-10 board thinks we should drop Fordham, because, you know, they suck.....

The speculation is fun I suppose, but don't take yourselves too seriously. There are a lot of moving parts and the musical chairs music is far away from stopping.
It is kinda funny, all the opinions. Well over 650 of them, so far. However, I don't think Mateer mentioned anything about dropping Fordham.
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:40 PM   #662 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:11 PM   #663 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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The A10 has all the power here, even though there are 'fraidy cats at every school about to cave in to the false perception of the basketball only big east members.
Ha. A unified A-10 has all the power: Just like the WAC had the power over the MWC with BYU going Independent in football and joining for all sports, and a plan to take SDSU and UNLV. In about three seconds, the MWC simply blew apart the WAC solidarity and crippled the WAC.

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Here's the truth, without their big football brothers those schools are no better, or in some cases little better, than their A10 peers.
The Big East schools have the power because they have decades of bigger publicity thanks to the ESPN hype machine, and because they don't have the bottom third of the A-10 clinging to their ankles.

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Here's another fact if Xavier, Richmond, Dayton, St. Louis, and whoever else is at the top of their wish list tell them to go f themselves what are they going to do? Stay in their soon to be inferior basketball/football fiasco of a league or recruit the likes of George Mason, some Patriot League schools, and Creighton, and do what? Bend their knee to the lowly A10 because they are in hell.
Xavier, Richmond, Dayton, Saint Louis wouldn't do that. If they have the chance to trade Fordham for St. John's, and LaSalle for Villanova, GW for G-Town, St. Bona for Marquette, and Duquesne for DePaul, they'd do so in a heartbeat.

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What our schools should be doing is circling the wagons because literally we are the only option they have. If our big boys choose to substitute some east coast high school gyms for some other east coast high school gyms we'll all lose. If they don't, and are the only conference to show some sack and intelligence we all win...

Instead of a blanket of bids to the Big East Seven, cherry pick. Sorry, Providence we only need one team in Rhode Island. St. Joes doesn't want Nova... no sweat to me. Okay, GW doesn't seem to have any problem with Gtown and now they'll have a local rival and maybe the lone national program out of the group. Invite. St. Johns, NYC, invite, don't care if Fordham dissents (sorry Fordham... but... sorry Fordham). Marquette... invite. DePaulful and Chicago... okay, fine, it's a joke but Chicago is too big and could be a good place for a conference tournament every five years. Who's left? Seton Hall. Nobody wants to go to New Jersey the only state that it's free to enter and they charge you to leave. If Marquette's AD keeps talking smack I'm sure the Horizon or the MVC will take them.

18 team league. And then start a network. FBS football, and sell airtime to all the other "mid-major" leagues. Maybe the Providence grads can catch their much anticipated clash with Bucknell in the new patriot league.
I agree with you, in terms of that's what I'd WANT. As a Bona fan, I don't want X, UD, SLU, Butler, and maybe VCU/Richmond/Duquesne joining those seven and leaving us to add from the CAA/AmEast/NEC/MAAC.

But as a realist, I know if the Big East splits, the A-10 splits too. That's GOING to be the outcome. If you're not a Xavier or Saint Louis fan, you should be terrified.

If we present a united front as a unified Atlantic 10 and say "join us because we're not joining you" it will be a matter of seconds before the BE7 call that bluff. All that accomplishes is bad blood when we collectively make Xavier, SLU, Dayton, Butler and others stab the A-10 in the back.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:18 PM   #664 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Originally Posted by DukesDan View Post

Zags Blog piece

Quote:
Marquette AD Larry Williams dismissed the idea of the Catholic schools joining with teams from the A-10, although ESPN.com reported that the A-10 would be interested in adding some of the Big East’s basketball-only schools.

"When you think about the A-10, I don’t even really view the remnants of the Big East in the same light as I do the A-10," he said.

"There’s no Georgetown in the A-10. Georgetown has won a national championship. There’s no Marquette in the A-10. They’ve not won a national championship in their history.

They have a couple of good schools and they have some nice quality across the board, but I certainly, and I know I’m being sort of a homer here, but I certainly think the Big East basketball schools present a profile that is superior to what the depth of the A-10 is."
The man has a point about the depth of the Big East vs. the depth of Atlantic 10.

With a record of 6-4, Villanova presently has the worst non-conference record in the 15-team Big East, but the Wildcats are still two games over .500:


Big East Conference Standings (ESPN)


Selected Big East School W-L Records - Updated December 12, 2012

Code:
 #21 Georgetown    8-1 
 Providence        7-2 
 Seton Hall        7-2 
 Marquette         6-2  
 St. John's        7-3 
 DePaul            6-3 
 Villanova         6-4
Atlantic 10 W-L Records - Updated December 12, 2012

Code:
 Charlotte        9-0  
 La Salle         6-1
 Temple           6-1  
 Richmond         8-2    
 Butler           7-2
 Dayton           7-2 
 Xavier           7-2
 VCU              6-3
 St. Bonaventure  5-3  
 St. Joseph's     5-3
 Saint Louis      5-3
 Duquesne         6-4   
 Massachusetts    4-3   
 Geo. Washington  4-6
 Rhode Island     2-7
 Fordham          1-8
Quote:
Originally Posted by DukesDan View Post

Zags Blog piece

That Marquette AD is a tool. Starts talking about national championships and touts Georgetown and Marquette as too good for little ole A10.

Wake up dude, you are about to be a mid major if you don't pull off some miracle in the next 6 months!
That's a bit harsh, considering what Marquette AD Larry Williams actually said, the fact that Georgetown and Marquette have won National Championships, and the fact that 15-place Villanova is still making a positive contribution to the Big East's Conference RPI.

The Atlantic 10 has never had a last-place team with a winning non-conference W-L record.

Perhaps the idea of being members of a conference that has no perrenial doormats is appealing to some Atlantic 10 schools.

If I was a Big East Athletic Director, I would be quite opposed to joining a conference that included Fordham or St. Bonaventure, or for geographic reasons, a conference that included La Salle, St. Joseph's, George Washington, or Rhode Island (duplication of market).

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Originally Posted by Bona84 View Post

I don't think Mateer mentioned anything about dropping Fordham.
. . . or St. Bonaventure.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:25 PM   #665 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

We can all play this game, Muddy...

... or Dayton. Nobody likes mediocrity (or sweater vests).
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:39 PM   #666 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

Marquette is talking about Final Fours?

#umyeah
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:46 PM   #667 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Originally Posted by jpschmack View Post

Xavier, Richmond, Dayton, and Saint Louis wouldn't do that.

If they have the chance to trade Fordham for St. John's, and LaSalle for Villanova, GW for G-Town, St. Bona for Marquette, and Duquesne for DePaul, they'd do so in a heartbeat.
Astute observation, jpschmack.


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Originally Posted by jpschmack View Post

As a Bona fan, I don't want X, UD, SLU, Butler, and maybe VCU/Richmond/Duquesne joining those seven and leaving us to add from the CAA/AmEast/NEC/MAAC.

But as a realist, I know if the Big East splits, the A-10 splits too.

That's GOING to be the outcome. If you're not a Xavier or Saint Louis fan, you should be terrified.
Indeed, although I can't imagine any Flyers fans being worried about Dayton being left out of a new conference with the BE7.

Can the good folks of Olean say the same ? I should think not.


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Originally Posted by jpschmack View Post

If we present a united front as a unified Atlantic 10 and say "join us because we're not joining you" it will be a matter of seconds before the BE7 call that bluff.

All that accomplishes is bad blood when we collectively make Xavier, SLU, Dayton, Butler and others stab the A-10 in the back.
The writing is already on the wall.

Refusing to look at the wall doesn't make the writing go away.


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Old 12-12-2012, 03:12 PM   #668 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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I heard that it was discussed in a faculty senate meeting. There was no vote and any vote there would be non binding anyways. They are upset about the costs of FBS football.
The faculty never support athletics at all, and don't even understand how the NCAA works (some suggested dropping football down to Division III - which isn't even possible since everything else is Division I).


That senate has no power in this and should not be listened to. (we're staying FBS)
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:22 PM   #669 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

District...I concur with you about "catholic" not meaning anything in putting a conference together.

But size might matter. Temple leaves because they are large and want to be in the football pool.

With VUC at 30,000+, would you not have a desire to someday play football in the FBS?

If the BE expanded from 7 to 12, I could see them taking Butler, St. Louis, Xavier, Creighton and Richmond. That would give them the maximum TV markets and with Richmond covering central VA they wouldn't be worried about VCU leaving to play football at a higher level.
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:55 PM   #670 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Indeed, although I can't imagine any Flyers fans being worried about Dayton being left out of a new conference with the BE7.

Can the good folks of Olean say the same ? I should think not.
I think there should be significant pause for the Dayton faithful.

You and I both know that together, Xavier and Dayton deliver a Cincinnati-Middletown-Dayton metroplex of 3.2 million people and no two other non-FBS programs in the country are going to give you that amount of market reach (schools in bigger markets can't deliver them, i.e. Detroit-Mercy; or schools that do deliver are in smaller markets, i.e. Creighton).

However, lots of people don't realize that the CIN-MID-DAY DMA is going to happen very soon, that it would be the #17 market in the country, and only view it as CIN #27, DAY #62.

We assume the BE7 will take five schools for 12, but why?
Wouldn't their best inventory to sell to TV be a double-round robin?
And wouldn't 9 teams let them play RPI games?
Why wouldn't the old school BE FIVE want to keep it at nine, letting them retain the power over the western four (so they don't find their conference tournament in Indy or Chicago some years?)

Also, we're talking about the Pittsburgh (#22), Indianapolis (#35) and Dayton (#62) markets… but there's one move to make for the BE7 that's both brilliant, massive, and leaves Dayton out in the cold:

Coastal Conference
East: St. John's, Nova, G-Town, Hall, Providence, Marquette, DePaul, Xavier and Saint Louis
West: Gonzaga, BYU, Saint Mary's, Santa Clara, Portland, San Diego, Denver, Seattle and either Pepperdine or LMU.

That's 15 of the top 38 markets in the United States (1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 11, 15, 17, 19, 21, 23, 27, 31, 38) plus #97 is the biggest name in mid-major cinderellas (Gonzaga) and #108 has their own global TV network (BYU).

Until the press conference, no one but Xavier should be feeling cozy until the music stops.
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:58 PM   #671 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Originally Posted by Knobby View Post
You guys are all funny. You all act like these AD's are reading your ideas on this fanboard and will take them into consideration when they start negotiating.... Oooh, I cen hear it now, Mateer over on the basketball Forum A-10 board thinks we should drop Fordham, because, you know, they suck.....

The speculation is fun I suppose, but don't take yourselves too seriously. There are a lot of moving parts and the musical chairs music is far away from stopping.
We're not allowed to have mindless speculation anymore?

Well...that's the end of all internet message boards. Last one out, get the lights.
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:59 PM   #672 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

Jps, you had me until the words 'Portland' and 'Denver'.
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Old 12-12-2012, 04:03 PM   #673 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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Wouldn't their best inventory to sell to TV be a double-round robin?
And wouldn't 9 teams let them play RPI games?
Double round robin works best with ten teams, not nine. With 10, you do not have to have somebody sitting out. Ten is what we have in the MVC and the double round robin is my favorite part about the conference - no unbalanced schedules and you get a chance to play everybody on your home floor.
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Old 12-12-2012, 04:09 PM   #674 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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I think there should be significant pause for the Flyer Faithful [sic].

. . . but there's one move to make for the BE7 that's both brilliant, massive, and leaves Dayton out in the cold:


Coastal Conference

East: St. John's, Nova, G-Town, Hall, Providence, Marquette, DePaul, Xavier, and Saint Louis

West: Gonzaga, BYU, Saint Mary's, Santa Clara, Portland, San Diego, Denver, Seattle and either Pepperdine or LMU.
You want me to lose sleep over that ?

I don't think so . . .

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Old 12-12-2012, 04:20 PM   #675 (permalink)
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Re: More BCS realignment

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The faculty never support athletics at all, and don't even understand how the NCAA works (some suggested dropping football down to Division III - which isn't even possible since everything else is Division I).


That senate has no power in this and should not be listened to. (we're staying FBS)
I don't think that's true, unless they added some new rules. In NC, Davidson College used to be division 1 in football and they dropped to division 3, but the rest of the sports stayed as D-1. That happened a while ago though.
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