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Old 03-25-2013, 07:28 AM   #106 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

I'm assuming that Siena will also join July 1st?
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:35 AM   #107 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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Originally Posted by Free Quebec View Post
This is good from a GW perspective (local rival, maybe the A-10 will actually get some media attention now).

But it's bad from a basketball perspective. We finally - finally - can see an end to the Dayton-Xavier flame wars that basically ruined this forum, and now, judging by this thread, are about to be subjected to VCU -GMU ripping and trolling each other. Ugh.
The a10 should make membership decisions based on their effect on this message board?
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:37 AM   #108 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

I would make the following assumptions if it is today announced that GMU is joining the A-10:

1. The A-10 expects to lose more schools. This is a move to shore up the conference with more members to brace it for future departures. Adding GMU makes returning to the CAA an even less attractive prospect for schools such as VCU and Richmond.

2. The A-10 expects that one of these schools will be St Louis. The first member added after all the defctions is not a midwest school to placate St. Louis, which will have no members nearby.

3. GMU likely did not turn down an invite from the A-10 last year per its spin on staying in the CAA. The A-10 was probably in discussions last year with GMU but never extended an official invite once it decided on Butler and VCU. I find it hard to believe that GMU's thinking would have changed so dramatically in just a year. The A-10 was even more attractive a league last year as it still had Xavier and Butler was joining. Why would a school turn down an invite last year to then quickly reverse course a year later and joined a weakened A-10? The only reasonable explanation in my view is that it didn't as there was no decision for it to make.

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Old 03-25-2013, 07:48 AM   #109 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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I would make the following assumptions if it is today announced that GMU is joining the A-10:

1. The A-10 expects to lose more schools. This is a move to shore up the conference with more members to brcase it for future departures. Adding GMU makes the returning to the CAA an even less attractive prospect for schools such as VCU and Richmond.These two schools were going to be added if Butler and Xavier left not the others...

2. The A-10 expects that one of these schools will be St Louis. The first member added after all the defctions is not a midwest school to placate St. Louis, which will have no members nearby. The A-10 will become a East coast based conference as the C7 conference is now a Midwestern based conference

3. GMU likely did not turn down an invite from the A-10 last year per its spin on staying in the CAA. The A-10 was probably in discussions last year with GMU but never extended an official invite once it decided on Butler and VCU. I find it hard to believe that GMU's thinking would have changed so dramatically in just a year. The A-10 was even more attractive a league last year as it still had Xavier and Butler was joining. Why would a school turn down an invite last year to then quickly reverse course a year later and joined a weakened A-10? The only reasonable explanation in my view is that it didn't as there was no decision for it to make.
GMU did not turn down an offer. They would have taken it in a second but they were not extended an offer because there were only two programs to be added at the time. GMU knew this and was told to wait.
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:50 AM   #110 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

I don't think GM was offered last year, either.

The A-10 has few good choices left for another school if two programs are lost next year. The only way a western oriented school should be considered is if Dayton is stuck with the A-10 for the long haul. Wichita State is probably too far away, but Cleveland State, Murray State and Western Kentucky could be possibilities.

Barring that, an Eastern seaboard school is preferable. I prefer a larger school in a good locale, with a good fanbase and excellent facilities. The new Big East is sorely lacking in good on-campus or near campus arenas. The A-10 can help keep the competition close by adding a school with said attributes.

I would rule out Davidson. Too small and we already tried the Charlotte experiment. Once McKillop leaves Davidson could fall off.

If the A-10 were to move South again, CoC might have all the attributes. Unlike Niner fans, CoC fans would happily partake of the A-10.

Other than those schools, Siena, Boston University, Hofstra and perhaps Iona might be the next best possibilities. The pickings are getting very slim.
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:57 AM   #111 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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Other than those schools, Siena, Boston University, Hofstra and perhaps Iona might be the next best possibilities. The pickings are getting very slim.
So who do you Northerners find most palatable among this bunch?

To me, Iona plays in a high school gym and Hofstra is not palatable.

So who would you prefer between BU and Siena.

I would love Davidson but fear you are right. And I think CoC is just too far away. I think they are 8 hours from Richmond.
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:58 AM   #112 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

George Mason University Patriots
School: Public
Campus: Fairfax, VA
Distance to Barclays Arena-Brooklyn 250 miles
Enrollment: 20,782 Undergraduates
Market: NoVa pop estimate 2.6m
Home: 10,000 seat Patriot Center (on campus)
2012-13 Attendance: 5,393 averaged for 13 games (for 19-14 team)
Division 1: started play in 1978
NCAA Appearances: 6 – 1989, 1999, 2001, 2006, 2008, 2011
NCAA Record: 5-6
Notable NCAA Wins: Michigan State-2006, North Carolina-2006, Wichita St-2006, UConn-2006, Villanova-2011
NIT Appearances: 4 – 1986, 2002, 2004, 2009
NIT Record: 3-4
Notable NIT Wins: Tennessee-2004
Notable Coaches: Jim Larranaga, Paul Hewitt, Paul Westhead, Rick Barnes

================================================== ========================

Siena College Saints
School: Private-Catholic
Campus: Loudonville, NY (just outside Albany)
Distance to Barclays Arena-Brooklyn 160 miles
Enrollment: 3,390 Undergraduates
Market: Albany MSA-870,716 (4th largest urban area in New York State and the 58th nationally)
Home: 14,500 seat Times Union Center in downtown Albany (all home games off campus)
2012-13 Attendance: averaged 6,361 for 14 games (for an 8-24 team)
(averaged 7,853 in 2009-10 season when team went 27-7 and was in NCAA)
Division 1: started play in 1976
NCAA Appearances: 6 - 1989, 1999, 2002, 2008, 2009 and 2010
NCAA Record: 4-6
Notable NCAA Wins: Stanford-1989, Vanderbilt-2008, Ohio State-2009
NIT Appearances: 5 - 1988, 1991, 1994, 2000, and 2003
NIT Record: 9-5
Notable NIT Wins: South Carolina-1990, UMass-1990 & 2000, Kansas State-1994, Ga Tech-1994, Tulane-1994, Bradley-1994, Villanova-2003
Notable Coaches: Mike Deane-Marquette, Paul Hewitt-Ga Tech, Louis Orr-Seton Hall, Fran McCaffrey-Iowa

================================================== ========================

Davidson College Wildcats
School: Private (loose affiliation with the Presbyterian Church)
Campus: Davidson, NC
Distance to Barclays Arena-Brooklyn 620 miles
Enrollment: 1,756 Undergraduates
Market: Davidson, NC pop-10,944 - 20 miles north of Charlotte (Charlotte MSA: 1,758,038 - 33rd nationally)
Home: 5,223 seat Belk Arena (on campus)
2012-13 Attendance: averaged 3,941 for 13 games (for 26-8 team)
NCAA Appearances: 12 - 1966, 1968 1969, 1970, 1986, 1998, 2002, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2012, and 2013
NCAA Record: 8-13
Notable NCAA Wins: Rhode Island-1966, St. John’s-1968 & 1969, Villanova-1969, Gonzaga-2008, Georgetown-2008, Wisconsin-2008
NIT Appearances: 5 – 1972, 1994, 1996, 2005, 2009
NIT Record: 3-5
Notable NIT Wins: VCU-2005
Notable Coaches: Bob McKillop, Lefty Driesell, Terry Holland

================================================== ========================

College of Charleston Cougars
School: Public
Campus: Charleston, SC (downtown location)
Distance to Barclays Arena-Brooklyn 770 miles
Enrollment: 9,866 Undergraduates
Market: Charleston MSA- 664,607 (2nd largest in SC and the 75th nationally)
Home: 5,100 seat TD Arena (COC owned and on campus)
2012-13 Attendance: averaged 3,873 for 19 games (for a 24-11 team)
Division 1: started play in 1989
NCAA Appearances: 4 - 1994, 1997, 1998 and 1999 (all under Coach Kresse)
NCAA Record: 1-4
Notable NCAA Wins: Maryland-1997
NIT Appearances: 4 -1995, 1996, 2003, 2011
NIT Record: 4-4
Notable NIT Wins: Dayton-2011
Notable Coaches: John Kresse, Bobby Cremins, Doug Wojcik
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:02 AM   #113 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

Adding Davidson now would open the door for Charleston if (when) UMass leaves for a football conference.
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:05 AM   #114 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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Adding Davidson now would open the door for Charleston if (when) UMass leaves for a football conference.

Adding Siena now would give the league another northern school should northern member UMass eventually leave. It also gives us a school that is just 160 miles from the site of the A-10 Tourney. We would then have six members (Fordham, SJU, LaSalle, URI, Umass, & Siena) within about 160 miles from Brooklyn.
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:11 AM   #115 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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Adding Siena now would give the league another northern school should northern member UMass eventually leave. It also gives us a school that is just 160 miles from the site of the A-10 Tourney. We would then have six members (Fordham, SJU, LaSalle, URI, Umass, & Siena) within about 160 miles from Brooklyn.
Siena would work, too. I just prefer Davidson. If A10bball is correct and Siena will, indeed, receive the last invitation, then this is all moot. They're certainly the only program from the MAAC we should be considering, though. Iona's facilities just aren't up to par.
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:16 AM   #116 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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So who do you Northerners find most palatable among this bunch?

To me, Iona plays in a high school gym and Hofstra is not palatable.

So who would you prefer between BU and Siena.

I would love Davidson but fear you are right. And I think CoC is just too far away. I think they are 8 hours from Richmond.
What in the hell does that mean? What is up with you people and these damn arena size? That has no bearing on the quality of the program.. Iona has made back to back NCAA Tourney bids.. Heck they had an at-large bid last year.. an AT LARGE bid
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:23 AM   #117 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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What in the hell does that mean? What is up with you people and these damn arena size? That has no bearing on the quality of the program.. Iona has made back to back NCAA Tourney bids.. Heck they had an at-large bid last year.. an AT LARGE bid
You can go ahead and get offended if you want, but the more schools we have playing in facilities that look like the La Salle facility ... the more I feel like we're playing in the MAAC. Sure, La Salle is in the Sweet 16 and that's awesome, but long term, we need teams that play in College basketball facilities. Not high school gyms.
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Old 03-25-2013, 08:25 AM   #118 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

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What in the hell does that mean? What is up with you people and these damn arena size? That has no bearing on the quality of the program.. Iona has made back to back NCAA Tourney bids.. Heck they had an at-large bid last year.. an AT LARGE bid

Arena size and attendance are factors that relate to the revenue stream that is typically required to sustain a successful program. Having a small gym does not mean that a school can't have a decent program and success. It however makes it more difficult. A small gym and low ticket revenue limits the amount of money that can be spent on a program.
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Old 03-25-2013, 09:06 AM   #119 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

I think CoC is too far away. The A-10, IMO, should seek a tighter geographical fit if SLU leaves to increase the value of regional rivalries.

There are no obvious East Coast schools with all the attributes the A-10 is looking for.

BU has the location and facilities, but not the devoted fanbase.

Iona has location and some history but poor facilities. Unlike BBaball, I think arena quality has a ton to do with maintaining a very successful program in the long run. All things being equal, better to keep up with the Jones.

Hofstra has a nice arena and its in Long Island, but its a small school unknown nationally.
Northeastern is BU without the facilities.

Siena has the fanbase, facilities and some history of success, but Albany is small city in upstate NY and its addition would probably hurt Bona.

Alternatively, the A-10 can look for a program with good facilities, in a good location, with the potential to elevate itself by joining a higher-profile league. All these schools Delaware, Towson State, Stony Brook, Quinnipiac, James Madison have problems.

Unless the A-10 goes well outside of its traditional territory, BU, Siena and James Madison strike me as the best choices. All have good, fairly large facilities.

If BU had better fan support, Id definitely go with the Terriers. Siena gets my nod because of better fan support.
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Old 03-25-2013, 09:34 AM   #120 (permalink)
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re: 2016-17 George Mason Patriots

The problems with Delaware and JMU are that they have 1-A football aspirations which make them not long term solutions. Stony Brook may have 1-A football dreams down the road too. BU's hoops team plays second fiddle to their hockey team. They play in a broom closet above the new hockey arena there.
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