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Old 12-07-2012, 06:59 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Joakim Noah

30/23/6/2/2

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Old 12-07-2012, 07:35 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah



That's crazy.
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:21 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

It was a pleasure seeing him play tonight even though he basically destroyed us.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:50 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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Originally Posted by mvP to the Wee View Post
30/23/6/2/2

I haven't been following the league as closely this year as in years past, but is that in contention for the best stat line of the season so far???
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Old 12-08-2012, 08:09 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

Sam Smith ranks it as one of the top ten individual Bull's performances ever.

http://blogs.bulls.com/2012/12/noah-...-over-pistons/
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:07 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

Nice Kevin Love esque game.
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Old 12-09-2012, 03:34 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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Sam Smith ranks it as one of the top ten individual Bull's performances ever.

http://blogs.bulls.com/2012/12/noah-...-over-pistons/
Thats a pretty strong statement considering the players that have worn a Bulls Uniform.
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Old 12-09-2012, 03:52 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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Thats a pretty strong statement considering the players that have worn a Bulls Uniform.
If just going on stats and nothing else, then I guess it fits.
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Old 12-10-2012, 07:02 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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Sam Smith ranks it as one of the top ten individual Bull's performances ever.

http://blogs.bulls.com/2012/12/noah-...-over-pistons/
I don't think Smith is considering a couple things when talking about best "individual performance ever."

First, I think he's talking about evened out stat lines. What's better? Michael Jordan scoring 55 points in a big win or Boerwinkle getting 37 rebounds and 22 points. Points, after all, and I'm not sure Chicagoans have ever embraced this... only win the game.

Also, what about magnitude. What's better? A big rebound 30 point, 23 rebound performance against the Pistons in a season in which the Bulls will win nothing? Or Michael Jordan getting over 50 points v. the Knicks in a 93 ECF game that the Bulls had to have?

Noah's performance? Or Scottie Pippen leading 4 bench players to a furious comeback to beat the Portland Trailblazers in game 6 of the NBA finals, when the Bulls were down like 15 to start the 4th.

Boerwinkle's performance? Or Jordan's off the charts night v. the Phoenix Suns in game 4 of the NBA Finals?

I don't get this movement by some in this town to marginalize Jordan's Bulls. They ARE the Bulls. The significance of the Bulls historically is 95% Jordan, Pippen and the rest and 5% everyone else. That's what championships MEAN.

When the Bulls beat the Heat and win it all, then we can talk about members of the team in terms of historical relevance and greatest performances.

It's like comparing Jordan's 87 season in which he averaged 37 PPG to seasons in which he averaged only 32 PPG but WON IT ALL. It's ridiculously stupid. But, if you've read Smith's trade proposals, you would know what to expect.
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Old 12-10-2012, 09:13 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

If there's a movement to marginalize Jordan's Bulls it is certainly news to me.
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Old 12-10-2012, 09:25 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Youre looking at it in your own way. Sam Smith is not comparing the performance to certain game situations....but merely looking at the stat line. It was a crazy good game, period. Yes, it goes down as one the best ever if performed in game 7 of the finals, but that's not the point here.

And trust me, Sam Smith will be the last person to marginalize the Jordan era Bulls.

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Old 12-10-2012, 10:07 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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Youre looking at it in your own way. Sam Smith is not comparing the performance to certain game situations....but merely looking at the stat line. It was a crazy good game, period. Yes, it goes down as one the best ever if performed in game 7 of the finals, but that's not the point here.

And trust me, Sam Smith will be the last person to marginalize the Jordan era Bulls.

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What Smith is doing is taking something that matters and acting like it doesn't. The teams prowess when accomplishments are made statistically matters. There's a reason Dominique Wilkins didn't make the NBA top 50. You need some measure of team success; even a Finals appearance, for statistical lines to matter.

Why? Because, and I'm not saying Noah did this, it's very easy to rack up stats when winning big is an afterthought. If Rose is out and you know you're not making the Finals anyway, you can play for stats first and wins second, just like the garbage-time stat grabber... Elton Brand.

I don't know that that was what was going on in Noah's head. What I do know is that it's easy enough to fall prey to, and it happens enough, that you sweepingly dismiss all instances unless they are truly other-worldly like Chamberlain's 100 points. And I hardly celebrate that as having the magnitude others think it has because of the circumstances surrounding it. It's remarkable, but not one of the greatest things to ever happen.

When I think of great individual performances that would fall into the top ten for franchises like the Bulls, Celtics, Lakers, Spurs, etc... I think of:

> Michael Jordan's 63 points v. Boston - Why? Yeah, he lost. He was also 4 hall of fame teammates short of what Larry Bird had. Bird won and called him god, case closed.

> The shot

> Every one of the people who blocked Charles Smith's shots can claim to be part of a great individual performance, because each block in isolated fashion saved a championship

> Jordan's overtime performance when Pippen fouled out of game 3 of the 91 Finals, including a tear drop over Divac to send it into overtime

> Bill Russell's 12 blocks in game 1 of the 1969 playoffs, catapulting an ancient Boston team into an eventual victory over Wilt, West and Baylor in the Finals.

> Larry Bird hitting multiple game winners in the ECF in 1981.. where you get the image of him holding the sides of his head and jumping

> Magic's game 6 performance in 1980..

Now, did Smith use the words, "most statistically significant in terms of an evenly disbursed stat line in a game of any meaning"... had he, that would have been very appropriate...

Stats are great, when you're comparing two losers or two winners. Jordan won like Bird but is considered better because he won AND put the bigger numbers up. If he lost, like Wilt (who did win twice, but lost more than he should have), it would be different.

And you carry this all the way down to the Joakim Noahs, Shane Battiers, Charles Oakleys, Terri Cummings, Mookie Blaylocks and whoever elses of the world.
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Old 12-10-2012, 12:44 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

Noah's game ten years from now will not even be remembered. Its a game that has no impact on the season, its no indication of the type of player Noah is and it absolutely doesn't change ANYTHING about the current trajectory of this team.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:01 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I don't know... I still remember a 20/20 game (or close to it) from Aaron Gray against Toronto... though apparently Sam Smith had to remind me of that Marcus Fizer game...

I think people may be getting a bit too worked up over a portion of the article that is basically about box scores.... this stuff about the importance of the game is just a different conversation than the one Smith is having.
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Old 12-10-2012, 05:01 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: Joakim Noah

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I don't know... I still remember a 20/20 game (or close to it) from Aaron Gray against Toronto... though apparently Sam Smith had to remind me of that Marcus Fizer game...

I think people may be getting a bit too worked up over a portion of the article that is basically about box scores.... this stuff about the importance of the game is just a different conversation than the one Smith is having.
Yeah, you're right. He's talking about "individual performances" when he should be talking about purely statistical performances.

All I'm saying is that within the phrase "individual performance" I'd add big plays at key points in the game, whether you won, and mostly magnitude of the situation.

I'd diminish the impact of this performance for the same reason I'd diminish the impact of a lot of what Wilt and Oscar Robertson did.

As long as Smith is going with "individual performance" and not "purely statistical performance" I think he's off for bringing up top ten performances and putting this one in it.
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