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futuristxen · 11-23-2005, 08:32 PM

I think Big Z is a better player to have...as a third or fourth option on a good team...like he is now....playing at a similiar clip to Yao. Z has more competitive fire, that's for sure. When is the last time Yao dove to the floor for a loose ball?

Yao's kind of proven that he's not going to be a center of the Shaq level, who you can build a team around. I think Houston will have to aquire another star player in order to truly be dangerous. Like a Larry Hughes-like sidekick for T-Mac.

Like Rashard Lewis or Peja. Put them with T-Mac.

Alston
T-Mac
Peja
Swift
Yao

Then you are starting to talk about a team that can contend for championships in this new golden age.

**sherako** · 11-23-2005, 08:47 PM

nice post futuristxen, but none of this would've had to happen if tracy would've stayed with reverend howard.

**Hakeem** · 11-23-2005, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by futuristxen

When is the last time Yao dove to the floor for a loose ball?

I watch most Rockets games and I've seen Yao dive to the floor plenty of times. That's one thing I find difficult to understand -- the claim that Yao has no competitive fire. This is a guy who embarrasses his teammates and fans by pounding himself in the head sometimes when he makes a mistake. He may not be vocal on the court and he may not showboat after dunks, but he has more fire than the majority of players I've seen.

Also, he is a better passer and defender than Big Z, and scores much, much more efficiently, while drawing more attention from the defense.

PartisanRanger · 11-23-2005, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hakeem

Yeah, makes a lot of sense to declare him MOP after one bad game, despite him averaging 19 and 9 so far with no help. Phoenix had two guys on him constantly for three quarters. When they stopped with that when Ryan Bowen -- after being left completely open the entire game till that point -- hit a few jumpers, none of Yao's teammates seriously attempted to get him the ball. I'd like to see any post scorer dominate night in night out in such conditions. And I'd like to point out that Yao's been playing some very good defense so far this season (hope he continues with it).

Btw, Dwight Howard: 5/7/2/0 in 27 minutes = scrub?
Or,
Duncan on the 12th: 11 points, 3-18 from the field, 0 blocks = MOP?

I got the same impression. Yao was constantly getting double-teamed and being denied the entry pass, it's hard to make any offensive impact with that kind of thing going on.

**Mr. Predictable** · 11-23-2005, 09:20 PM

We still haven't heard if Sir Patchwork watched the game. For the first 3 quarters the Suns had one man fronting Yao and one behind him. Ryan Bowen was open the entire game. It was only after he knocked down 3 consecutive jumpers the Suns brought Kurt Thomas in the game, and that's when Yao got the rest of his points. He was still double teamed, but only after he put the ball on the floor. One thing TMac's injury has proven about Yao is that he is not a closer. Not a great player with the game on the line.

Yeah the Rockets haven't won with TMac and Alston out, but I wouldn't place the brunt of it on Yao. The Rockets are #1 in opponents PPG with him on the floor... the problem is the scoring just hasn't come from anyone outside of Yao (although Head and Anderson have had back to back good games). Put a Camby or Big Z in Yao's place right now and they wouldn't even be in these games.

It's a little tragic when moderators are making assumptions based on stat lines, but atleast it gets some discussion going.

**JNice** · 11-23-2005, 09:30 PM

..

Why is Ryan Bowen employed by the NBA?

Unfortunately for the Rockets, Tmac is having back issues and their new signees have been less than impressive. I wasn't expecting great things from Anderson or Swift, but I was expecting them to be a little better than they have been.

If Tmac can get his back straight, then there is plenty of time for things to change.

**MemphisX** · 11-23-2005, 09:46 PM

People still don't seem to feel or understand "era changes" in the NBA. Centers like Yao (limited mobility) are going to struggle in this NBA era. Yao has the skill to still make an impact but teams are killing them with athleticism, movement, and ball skills. That is the impact of the zone.

Yao is a pretty good player in the weakest NBA position. He is not MOP because most don't consider him a great player anyway.

**MemphisX** · 11-23-2005, 09:52 PM

People still don't seem to feel or understand "era changes" in the NBA. Centers like Yao (limited mobility) are going to struggle in this NBA era. Yao has the skill to still make an impact but teams are killing them with athleticism, movement, and ball skills. That is the impact of the zone.

Yao is a pretty good player in the weakest NBA position. He is not MOP because most don't consider him a great player anyway.

**Mr. Predictable** · 11-23-2005, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MemphisX

People still don't seem to feel or understand "era changes" in the NBA. Centers like Yao (limited mobility) are going to struggle in this NBA era. Yao has the skill to still make an impact but teams are killing them with athleticism, movement, and ball skills. That is the impact of the zone.

Yao is a pretty good player in the weakest NBA position. He is not MOP because most don't consider him a great player anyway.

Agreed to an extent. Hakeem always struggled to dominate against the Sonics in the mid-90's because they would 'cheat' and play zone on him. When back to the basket players don't have room to work with it's always a challenge for them to create shots. I guess Shaq would be the one exception as he could create his own space and also was the beneficiary of an excellent triangle offense. Yao would be pretty awesome in one, as fronting wouldn't be a huge problem. Still, Yao does a pretty good job of getting a high % shot with his FGA.

He obviously doesn't have the impact he would in the pre-zone era, but he is still an impact player. I mean Ryan Bowen had 9 shots, 8 of them because Yao was on the floor. 1 was a runaway layup he nearly injured himself on. When the Rockets got back into it, it was because Bowen was finally hitting those open shots. To me, that's impact.

rocketeer · 11-23-2005, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Roger's Cardigan

He obviously doesn't have the impact he would in the pre-zone era, but he is still an impact player. I mean Ryan Bowen had 9 shots, 8 of them because Yao was on the floor. 1 was a runaway layup he nearly injured himself on. When the Rockets got back into it, it was because Bowen was finally hitting those open shots. To me, that's impact.

exactly. in order to stop yao, the suns had to leave a man open. that's a huge impact on the game. it's not yao's fault if guys miss the open looks he creates for them.

**RSP83** · 11-23-2005, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wadeshaqeddie

he couldnt take advantage of Boris Diaw starting at center. Diaw outplayed him by far

great game by Diaw. He played every position this season from PG to C. And he hasn't let anybody down.

**Sir Patchwork** · 11-23-2005, 10:38 PM

I watched everything up until the final 6 minutes of the 4th, when I went out to play some ball. My opinion of Yao is not based on one game, the title is a mere spoof of a thread we saw at the beginning of the year, with different variable filled in.

My main problem with Yao is simply his inability to get position. I too thought the guards were chucking in the first half, and passing up on getting it to him in the post, until a couple of times where Yao seemingly had position, they dropped the ball to him, and the post defender slipped out from behind him and stole the ball. This is not a one game thing, this is an every game thing.

He has a lot of good skills for a big man, but they are rarely ever used. The ball is rarely in his hands, and people can blame the guards all they want, blame Francis and trade him, blame everyone except Yao, but it's easy to see why they look him off. And by the time he does finally get it in the post, he is too tired to do anything with it.

Yao is not a superstar. He is not a top 20 player. He is not the 2nd best center in the league. He is not better than Marcus Camby, he is not better than Ben Wallace. If you think he is, then I think you're overrating him.

**Hakeem** · 11-23-2005, 11:02 PM

Quote:

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