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hobojoe · 07-01-2007, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shaunliv

Wait a minute, didn't Corey Maggette play significant SG minutes for us in his career? Does he have dibbling skills? NO. There's no way you can claim that Tornton doesn't dribble better or at least as good as Maggette.
Point is, dribbling is for the PG not the SG, if the SG can dribble it's a bonus.

Wrong, dribbling isn't just for PGs, it's absolutely essential for SGs as well. That's crazy to think you don't need to be able to dribble to play SG.

**yamaneko** · 07-01-2007, 11:25 AM

and as bad as maggette is, he is a btter dribbler than thornton who has never played the position yet.

It was so important to dunleavvy that maggette (who played parts of what 3 years at SG?) NOT play SG because of his build and dribbling, that he went out and gave mobley the richest free agent contract in history to move maggette to SF.

People can learn to play different positions. Its been done before. Thornton can learn to play PG, and it wouldnt be the first time thats happened. But again, i bet on sure things, not what if scenarios. Nick young was a SG sure thing, nick young can dribble sure thing. Bellineli can play even PG and SG, sure thing. etc. etc. If thornon ever does anything like that its because he learned to do something hes never done before...he would be beating the odds. Not the chance id take.

**HKF** · 07-01-2007, 12:20 PM

Maggette is going to opt out next summer anyway. So is Brand.

hobojoe · 07-01-2007, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yamaneko

and as bad as maggette is, he is a btter dribbler than thornton who has never played the position yet.

It was so important to dunleavvy that maggette (who played parts of what 3 years at SG?) NOT play SG because of his build and dribbling, that he went out and gave mobley the richest free agent contract in history to move maggette to SF.

People can learn to play different positions. Its been done before. Thornton can learn to play PG, and it wouldnt be the first time thats happened. But again, i bet on sure things, not what if scenarios. Nick young was a SG sure thing, nick young can dribble sure thing. Bellineli can play even PG and SG, sure thing. etc. etc. If thornon ever does anything like that its because he learned to do something hes never done before...he would be beating the odds. Not the chance id take.

I would agree with you, but I think Al Thornton is clearly on a level above Nick Young as a pro prospect. It's like the old phrase that you "always take big over small". That's only applicable if you're talking about comparable talents. It's good reasoning if you're saying that's why you'd take Greg Oden over Dwyane Wade, but you can't say you'd take Patrick O'Bryant over Dwyane Wade because you always take big over small. Obviously that's an extreme example, but I don't think you take team need over the best player available unless they're comparable talents. In this case, I just don't think Nick Young is on the same level as Al Thornton. The Clippers made the right pick in my opinion, it's the best for the team.

TakingitbyStorm · 07-01-2007, 08:58 PM

"It was so important to dunleavvy that maggette (who played parts of what 3 years at SG?) NOT play SG because of his build and dribbling, that he went out and gave mobley the richest free agent contract in history to move maggette to SF."

True, but we should remember that this is when Maggette established his reputation with the refs by punishing opposing SGs. He is more than capable of holding down this position, although it may not be his strongest.

**yamaneko** · 07-01-2007, 10:51 PM

hobojoe, again i disagree. Nick young also meets other clipper needs, not just based on the position he plays. Nick young has superstar potential with the way he plays the game. He has the mentality to take over games down the stretch. You always take need over player unless youre talking about something ridiculous. And thornton is not ridiculously nor obviously a great deal more talented than nick young. And you look at comparable by age, and what nick young did at his age, compared to where thornton was at the same age.

Now, new orleans you could argue it more. Julian wright is top 5 talent. SO they went with him instead of young since he dropped. If clippers picked wright over young, i wouldnt have liked it, but i would have been fine with it. Wright is someone, that if he was picked 4 or 5, people would not have batted an eye, he has that talent, not to mention the age.

**yamaneko** · 07-01-2007, 10:56 PM

and again, if you do take talent over need, it means that guy is good enough to undoubtedly make minutes for himself. Like portland. They have prizbilla, aldridge, had randolph, have freeland, lafrentz, etc. etc. Technically they dont need a center. But oden instantly is a starter over all those guys, no question. Seattle kind of had allen and lewis. But again, durant is so good, you still pick him because his abilities demand playing time.

I dont think anyone here will stay that thornton is better than maggette. yet we know as a fact that much of the year maggette didnt even start. If thornton was soo good to demand playing time on this team, there shouldnt be any doubt that dunleavvy would play him over maggette. Heck, theres even doubt that coach would play him over tim thomas. and theres NO doubt that coach plays him over elton brand.

If we had a shot at oden, we take him, regardless of if kaman is on the team. If we at 14 had a shot at Brandon wright, you take him regardless of maggette. If we had a shot at 14 at conley jr. you take him, doesnt matter if we had shaun livingston and cassell healthy. With thornton any playing time he earns is an uphill battle. Hes not pencilled in to get time off the bat ahead of thomas and maggette, and already hes cost us anothe rguy in singleton just to at least get his 5 minuts a game.

hobojoe · 07-02-2007, 07:47 AM

We can agree to disagree then, but I guarantee you Thornton will be playing significant minutes for the Clippers this season. There's no doubt in my mind he's going to come in and impress the coaching staff enough to the point where they have no choice but to find time for him to play. I really do think he is a level above Nick Young and that the Clippers made the right pick, and I really like both players -- I just think Thornton is better and worth not taking a pure SG with a more consistent outside shot at this point.

bootstrenf · 07-02-2007, 08:23 AM

i have one question...has thornton ever had any knee problems or problems with nagging injuries in general during his collegiate career???

if not, i don't think his age is a big issue...

**yamaneko** · 07-02-2007, 10:07 AM

But for the 1000th time, where/who is he going to take minutes from. I figured zero as it stood when he was drafted. But now that singleton was cut thats guaranteed 5 minutes every few games. But the fact remains, ross is a favorite of dunleavvy, especially to counter cassells inability to guard anyone. Maggette people on here say is this teams 2nd best player. Thomas is another dunleavvy favorite. So who are you guaranteeing he is going to take significant minutes from.

Age to me doesnt have much to do with injuries unles youre like sam cassell. Age has to do with peak and improvement graph. most stars are stars or pretty much near stars in the nba by 24. Not getting third team all american in college.

bootstrenf · 07-02-2007, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yamaneko

But for the 1000th time, where/who is he going to take minutes from. I figured zero as it stood when he was drafted. But now that singleton was cut thats guaranteed 5 minutes every few games. But the fact remains, ross is a favorite of dunleavvy, especially to counter cassells inability to guard anyone. Maggette people on here say is this teams 2nd best player. Thomas is another dunleavvy favorite. So who are you guaranteeing he is going to take significant minutes from.

Age to me doesnt have much to do with injuries unles youre like sam cassell. Age has to do with peak and improvement graph. most stars are stars or pretty much near stars in the nba by 24. Not getting third team all american in college.

no offense, but i didn't ask for all that...

i just wanted to know if he was injury prone...'tis all...

hobojoe · 07-02-2007, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yamaneko

But for the 1000th time, where/who is he going to take minutes from. I figured zero as it stood when he was drafted. But now that singleton was cut thats guaranteed 5 minutes every few games. But the fact remains, ross is a favorite of dunleavvy, especially to counter cassells inability to guard anyone. Maggette people on here say is this teams 2nd best player. Thomas is another dunleavvy favorite. So who are you guaranteeing he is going to take significant minutes from.

Age to me doesnt have much to do with injuries unles youre like sam cassell. Age has to do with peak and improvement graph. most stars are stars or pretty much near stars in the nba by 24. Not getting third team all american in college.

I've already told you I don't know, all I know is if a guy comes in and impresses everyone in the organization and everyone knows he's good, he's not going to rot on the bench. Dunleavy will find a way to play him. If Thornton comes in and shows better discipline defensively than he has in the past, there's no defensive advantage in playing Ross over him and certainly a huge offensive advantage with Al as opposed to Quinton. Tim Thomas has one thing over Thornton at this point, and that is 3-point shooting. If the Clippers need someone out there to stretch the floor and hit some treys (and TT is actually hitting his shots) then Thomas should be on the court -- otherwise Thornton is better in every aspect of basketball.

As for the injuries, the answer is no. Thornton's a durable guy, he gets hit a lot and I've personally seen him get up from some nasty spills and continue to play. He has a knack for getting his feet taken out from under him when he's skying for a dunk or rebound and landing hard on his back. He's never missed significant time from injury.

**yamaneko** · 07-02-2007, 11:56 AM

all of what? the only part directed at you was the last 3 whole sentences. The first paragraph obviously was for the previous post from hobojoe...

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