[kflo]

also note that the lakers being the better team in the much better conference are likely to have their closer games against better competition. coupled with the smaller sample size, it makes it tough to compare. what you really have to do is look at the numbers for both guys and say wow.

[Brandname]

Yeah, by no means is it supposed to be some conclusive determination of the better player.

Rather, I think some people might genuinely be missing what this guy has been doing in the 4th quarters this year, and a comparison to Kobe gives a good idea how good he's been.

[TakaraJinRoh]

Originally Posted by futuristxen

Actually Brandname said that that stat accounts for Kobe's blowouts. It doesn't matter how many clutch situations you've been in. That's not what is swinging it. It's that in the clutch situations they've both been in Lebron has been a lot better. And the teammate thing doesn't really wash, because Lebron is beating Kobe in clutch assists too.

You don't really even need statistics to see this. Lebron has just been taking over fourth quarters all year. Moreso than anyone has a right to. He's basically been doing what he did to the Pistons last year in every single game every night it's needed. Look at the defensive numbers as well. Lebron's clutch defense has been out of this world.

Not necessarily a clear cut better like you said it. Clutch situations doesnt take the other side of the game, like defense. Kobe's just a better defender than Lebron in clutch situations. I am a witness. IF you guys just watched how Kobe shut Kevin Martin Dwon on the fourth when they are trailing, then completely demoralized Sacramento on the offensive end, then you guys would have access to a much clearer picture.


Also the Lakers plas a very pass oriented team than the Cavs, even in the fourth quarter. When lebron passes, normally to say Boobie or Damon Jones, chances are they will take that shot. Kobe does the same thing and its not unusual to see the ball spread around even further before a shot is released.

[Brandname]

Originally Posted by TakaraJinRoh

Not necessarily a clear cut better like you said it. Clutch situations doesnt take the other side of the game, like defense. Kobe's just a better defender than Lebron in clutch situations. I am a witness. IF you guys just watched how Kobe shut Kevin Martin Dwon on the fourth when they are trailing, then completely demoralized Sacramento on the offensive end, then you guys would have access to a much clearer picture.


Also the Lakers plas a very pass oriented team than the Cavs, even in the fourth quarter. When lebron passes, normally to say Boobie or Damon Jones, chances are they will take that shot. Kobe does the same thing and its not unusual to see the ball spread around even further before a shot is released.

Sorry man, but this isn't true. Lebron's clutch defense this year has been second to none in terms of wing players, including Kobe. The knock against Lebron's defense is that he doesn't play that way during the first 3 quarters, but make no mistake, when the game is on the line he's just as good of a defender as Kobe.

[TakaraJinRoh]

Originally Posted by Brandname

If that's the case, you have to concede that the combination of offensive system and players that the Lakers have made Kobe's job a lot easier. Which makes Lebron's higher efficiency pretty significant, in my opinion.

I dont think Lebron's higher efficiency is pretty significant when his team is not winning more.

[ehmunro]

Originally Posted by TakaraJinRoh

Considering that Kobe's team has been so efficiently good this year that the normal clutch shots usually dedicated to Kobe is now spread around to players like Fisher,Farmar,Pau and Vujacic, Kobe's slightly lower stat rate on clutch situations is bit unfair for him for comparisons.

Take a look at the minutes covered and Kobe's shot rate (hint, it's virtually the same as LeBron's) and get back to me.

[Brandname]

Originally Posted by TakaraJinRoh

I dont think Lebron's higher efficiency is pretty significant when his team is not winning more.

It is.

So Kobe's team is better. Yeah I'm not going to argue that. They're really talented right now. Are you trying to imply that Kobe is sacrificing efficiency for the good of the team?

[TakaraJinRoh]

Originally Posted by Brandname

Sorry man, but this isn't true. Lebron's clutch defense this year has been second to none in terms of wing players, including Kobe. The knock against Lebron's defense is that he doesn't play that way during the first 3 quarters, but make no mistake, when the game is on the line he's just as good of a defender as Kobe.

We just have to agree to disagree since there is no way we can prove whose really been better in that category.

[kflo]

Originally Posted by Brandname

Sorry man, but this isn't true. Lebron's clutch defense this year has been second to none in terms of wing players, including Kobe. The knock against Lebron's defense is that he doesn't play that way during the first 3 quarters, but make no mistake, when the game is on the line he's just as good of a defender as Kobe.

which means you believe he's just as skilled a defender as kobe. and i'd question whether that's true yet. even when he's focussed. not that he doesn't have a strength and length advantage.