[KDOS]

Originally Posted by ehmunro

True, he underrated Garnett and overrated Kobe.

lol @ underrating KG

[Plastic Man]

Originally Posted by ehmunro

True, he underrated Garnett and overrated Kobe.

I agree. Bryant should no be on that ballot. 6 players rank higher than him in PER; 5 actually since his and Duncan's are virtually a wash.

[ehmunro]

Originally Posted by Plastic Man

I agree. Bryant should no be on that ballot. 6 players rank higher than him in PER; 5 actually since his and Duncan's are virtually a wash.

I really don't use PER for anything outside quick & dirty production comparisons. That's about all any of those magic all-in-one formulae are good for. As far as I know Duncan hasn't won any PER titles (let me reiterate, that I know of, I'm the first to admit that I ignore Hollinger's formula), but he's still been the most valuable player of the last decade, no matter who the MVP award winner is in any given year. The fact is that there really is no number that can accurately measure defensive impact. So the guys that do that sort of work go under-appreciated if they don't post gaudy shot-blocking numbers.

[essbee]

What's with the media campaigning amongst itself? They do the same thing for Hall of Fame votes in baseball with the whole "this is the year _______ should get in" even though their stats haven't actually CHANGED nonsense. They want Kobe to win the MVP so he'll win it.

Originally Posted by Plastic Man

I agree. Bryant should no be on that ballot. 6 players rank higher than him in PER; 5 actually since his and Duncan's are virtually a wash.

Carl Landry is ahead of Carmelo Anthony and Steve Nash in PER.

Originally Posted by LameR

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/s...t&lid=tab2pos1

They have Kobe edging out Paul.

Also, look at Jemele Cook's ballot.

Her last name is Hill and I agree with a couple of her points, I listed Hedo as an MVP candidate a couple weeks into the season and still feel that way. He does a lot of **** for that team.

And Hollinger is right about Amare's defense.

[KDOS]

Originally Posted by ehmunro

I really don't use PER for anything outside quick & dirty production comparisons.

That being the case, why is Kobe overrated in that list? Please explain that you bad honky mofo, because im dying to know.

[ehmunro]

Originally Posted by KDOS

That being the case, why is Kobe overrated in that list? Please explain that you bad honky mofo, because im dying to know.

I would have thought the use of the smiley would be a clear indication that i was making light of Basel's statement.

[KDOS]

Originally Posted by ehmunro

I would have thought the use of the smiley would be a clear indication that i was making light of Basel's statement.

I know, I know, thats why i reiterated calling you a bad honk mofo.

[Plastic Man]

Yeah, I forgot to put a =) next to my post apparently.

[Kaas]

Originally Posted by ehmunro

He didn't "change the culture of losing". He changed the defense. And changed it from a mediocre unit to an arguably top 5 all time defense. I know that for the kids around here defense sucks, but the reality is that Bill Russell really was the most valuable player of the 60s and Garnett was the most valuable player of this last season (as Tim Duncan has been the most valuable player of the last decade). I doubt he'll win the MVP as everyone gets carried away with the gaudy offensive numbers put up Paul, Kobe, and LBJ, but that doesn't change the fact that Garnett has turned the Celtics into a all-time great defensive squad, as in '94 Knicks great.

You'll find no argument from me on what KG has meant to the team defensively, and this is something I was hinting at, but didn't overtly say when I mentioned him bing a worthy candidate. The only reason I brought up KG is because people use the argument Kobe is having a down year because his numbers are down, yet those same people don't make the same argument against KG, despite them being in similar situations--going from a team lacking talent one year to being surrounded by other great players the next. KG just had to switch teams to do it. Both are playing the best defense they have in years, worthy of the Defensive 1st team. KG's is at another level of course. I don't see how he doesn't walk away with a very handy lead for DPOTY (other players on the team have stepped up on that end, of course, but he's been the main factor of one of the best defenses ever, as you mentioned).

[ehmunro]

Originally Posted by Kaas

You'll find no argument from me on what KG has meant to the team defensively, and this is something I was hinting at, but didn't overtly say when I mentioned him bing a worthy candidate. The only reason I brought up KG is because people use the argument Kobe is having a down year because his numbers are down, yet those same people don't make the same argument against KG, despite them being in similar situations--going from a team lacking talent one year to being surrounded by other great players the next. KG just had to switch teams to do it. Both are playing the best defense they have in years, worthy of the Defensive 1st team. KG's is at another level of course. I don't see how he doesn't walk away with a very handy lead for DPOTY (other players on the team have stepped up on that end, of course, but he's been the main factor of one of the best defenses ever, as you mentioned).

I'd be stunned if Garnett finished in the top three,