Greatest players of all time (number 10)

[PauloCatarino]

Originally Posted by XxIrvingxX

There are three guys I would pick before I would pick Kobe. But DRod definitely isn't one of them. Who ever said DRod would be competition...wow.

Who are they?

[XxIrvingxX]

And why isn't Julius Erving on this list??

[XxIrvingxX]

Originally Posted by PauloCatarino

Who are they?

Lebron, Moses, and at the time I would've said Hakeem, but then I forgot that we had voted him in a spot already lol.

Edit: Oh and Oscar Robertson. No question I would definitely pick him over Kobe.

[PauloCatarino]

Originally Posted by XxIrvingxX

Lebron, Moses, and at the time I would've said Hakeem, but then I forgot that we had voted him in a spot already lol.

Why do you think Moses was a greater player than Kobe (honest question, no baiting)?
(I'm not gonna ask the same question about Lebron, cause i promised myself never to get into another conversation regarding Lebron James and all-time ranks.)

[XxIrvingxX]

Originally Posted by PauloCatarino

Why do you think Moses was a greater player than Kobe (honest question, no baiting)?
(I'm not gonna ask the same question about Lebron, cause i promised myself never to get into another conversation regarding Lebron James and all-time ranks.)

Because I think that consistently Moses can do more for me than Kobe would. Moses was a damn good defender and he was a double double machine, holding a double double record that would never be broken until our lord and savior Kevin Love finally broke it. 3 time NBA MVP, 12 time all star, w/e amount of all NBA teams he made (BUT I KNOW ITS BIG!) I can certainly see why someone would say Kobe's greater, I just personally think Moses is better. It's nothing against Kobe.

And my explanation for Lebron was already made if you go back a couple posts.

[Luke]

Oscar isn't better than Kobe. And LeBron hasn't been in the league long enough to warrent a selection this early. If someone wants to make the argument that a peak LeBron is better than Kobe, then fine. Or if someone wants to say that LeBron through age 27 was better than Kobe through age 27, sure. But his collective body of work isn't better than Kobe's and that's what matters in this thread.

[e-monk]

Originally Posted by Luke

Oscar isn't better than Kobe. And LeBron hasn't been in the league long enough to warrent a selection this early. If someone wants to make the argument that a peak LeBron is better than Kobe, then fine. Or if someone wants to say that LeBron through age 27 was better than Kobe through age 27, sure. But his collective body of work isn't better than Kobe's and that's what matters in this thread.

this has been my rubric as well - Lebron is a better player right now than Kobe has ever been BUT you could say that about Lebron in regards to most of the players already on the list it's just that he doesnt have the resume yet, he's working on it but he doesnt have it yet (and another thing he doesnt have or is only just developing almost everyone already on the list had from birth is hunger and will to be the man and that counts for something)

as for Moses? I love Moses, his case as I see it: he has 3 MVP awards, 1 title as a center piece player, 8 all nba team nominations, 13 trips to the all star game and a couple all NBA Def team nominations - Moses one of the 2 or 3 all time great rebounders, and especially one of the great offensive rebounders and a guy who just flat outworked whoever faced him

I think at this point it's going to be close enough with a number of guys that it's going to come down to personal taste - I'm still going with Mr Bean

[e-monk]

if Kevin Love breaks your record it's probably not a good measure of your worthiness as a member of this list

[e-monk]

Originally Posted by XxIrvingxX

And why isn't Julius Erving on this list??

good call - his name should be on the list since he's going to figure in the conversation here pretty soon

[MemphisX]

Originally Posted by Luke

Oscar isn't better than Kobe. And LeBron hasn't been in the league long enough to warrent a selection this early. If someone wants to make the argument that a peak LeBron is better than Kobe, then fine. Or if someone wants to say that LeBron through age 27 was better than Kobe through age 27, sure. But his collective body of work isn't better than Kobe's and that's what matters in this thread.

My advice for Kobe fans...let it go...you are holding on to vapor.

[hobojoe]

Originally Posted by XxIrvingxX

Lebron, Moses, and at the time I would've said Hakeem, but then I forgot that we had voted him in a spot already lol.

Edit: Oh and Oscar Robertson. No question I would definitely pick him over Kobe.

One ring late in his career as a distant second option to Kareem does not make Oscar a better player than Kobe, not even close.

[PauloCatarino]

Originally Posted by hobojoe

One ring late in his career as a distant second option to Kareem does not make Oscar a better player than Kobe, not even close.

Well, to be fair, the championship won by Oscar with Lew is never referred as an Oscar accomplishment.

People that say Oscar is a Top-10 All-time player refer his incredible game and stats, and not his team wins.

And yes, Oscar is probably the second greatest all-around player ever. He was THAT good.

[GrandKenyon6]

I just don't even agree that LeBron's collective body of work doesn't already equal or surpass Kobe's. LeBron has three MVP's to Kobe's one (and whether he even deserved that one was debatable whereas all three of LeBron's were pretty much uncontested), one Finals MVP to Kobe's two (and whether Kobe even deserved the 2010 one is debatable), and a Rookie of the Year Award which Kobe doesn't have. He's been the best player in the NBA for a longer period of time and he has a boatload more NBA records than Kobe. He is better statistically across the board. Too much is made of Kobe's championships in regards to comparisons with other players. Look at Kobe's teammates and coaching staff over his career and then look at LeBron's. There's no comparison. Longer does not mean better.

[e-monk]

Originally Posted by PauloCatarino

Well, to be fair, the championship won by Oscar with Lew is never referred as an Oscar accomplishment.

People that say Oscar is a Top-10 All-time player refer his incredible game and stats, and not his team wins.

And yes, Oscar is probably the second greatest all-around player ever. He was THAT good.

and you're going on this based on his 23-7-7 (pace adjusted) Clyde Drexler/Mitch Richmond -esque stats? The Royals were averaging 123 ppg (and allowed 121ppg) the season he averaged a triple double - his assists are the only really impressive stat worth mentioning since they used to be a lot more strict about giving out assists

[GTA Addict]

There are a few remaining players who peaked higher than Kobe IMO, but his body of work is too immense. This is Kobe for me.

Then I'm looking at Dr. J, both Malones (leaning Karl over Moses atm), and KG in some order. Then Oscar/West after them.