Top 5 PFs in the NBA coming into the 2012-2013 season

[Luke]

Originally Posted by R-Star

Maybe the rest of us should start watching some games so we can be as all worldly as you when it comes to basketball.


That's sarcasm. This is a basketball website, I'm sure I'm not the only one who caught 20+ games that didn't involve my team last season. Not to mention I was blasting people who use PER before you even joined the site. Look it up if you'd like.

Saying Kevin Love isn't as good as Larry Bird and saying he's worse than LMA are two completely different things.



Also, I don't feel I should have to explain this but.... You saying Portland didn't make it last year due to injuries after ripping Love and the Wolves for falling apart after their PG and second best player went down for the year is laughable. Not to mention its clear the Wolves have been rebuilding around their core of Love and Rubio, proven by the fact of how many fresh faces the team has this year. Something you used as an excuse of LMA and the Blazers, but slammed Love and the Wolves for.


Clearly, you're biased.

It's funny how hard you're trying to turn me into the poster that comes into a thread with a holier than thou opinion that immediately shuts down everyone. That couldn't be further than the truth. I'm merely of the opinion that if you're the best player at your position than you should have the results to back up. Love doesn't. He's won a fourth of the games he's played as a pro and he's going into his fifth year.

You can say that Kevin Love is as good as Bird and that is the exact same thing people can put him above Aldridge for - boxscores. That is the only tangible edge that Love has over these guys. Bird, and Aldridge to a significantly lesser degree, have a bigger impact on the game and that's clearly visable from the simple eyeball test.

Would you rather have Al Jefferson or Tyson Chandler as your starting center? The answer to this question should sum everything up that I've been trying to say this entire thread.

LaMarcus has been to the postseason three times. Love has never been there. That is a fact and you trying to twist a rookie's injury into an excuse as to why the apparent "best power forward in the league" has failed to make the postseason in four tries is not going to work.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by Luke

It's funny how hard you're trying to turn me into the poster that comes into a thread with a holier than thou opinion that immediately shuts down everyone. That couldn't be further than the truth. I'm merely of the opinion that if you're the best player at your position than you should have the results to back up. Love doesn't. He's won a fourth of the games he's played as a pro and he's going into his fifth year.

You can say that Kevin Love is as good as Bird and that is the exact same thing people can put him above Aldridge for - boxscores. That is the only tangible edge that Love has over these guys. Bird, and Aldridge to a significantly lesser degree, have a bigger impact on the game and that's clearly visable from the simple eyeball test.

Would you rather have Al Jefferson or Tyson Chandler as your starting center? The answer to this question should sum everything up that I've been trying to say this entire thread.

LaMarcus has been to the postseason three times. Love has never been there. That is a fact and you trying to twist a rookie's injury into an excuse as to why the apparent "best power forward in the league" has failed to make the postseason in four tries is not going to work.

So you are going to skip over the clearly hypocritical points of your argument I pointed out then?

Classic.

[E.H. Munro]

Originally Posted by R-Star

They quit playing after Rubio was injured. No point fighting for 9th place when you can secure a quality draft pick instead.

The T'wolves traded their 2012 #1 years ago. There was no motivation for the team to lose.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by E.H. Munro

The T'wolves traded their 2012 #1 years ago. There was no motivation for the team to lose.

But........ yea ok. Can't argue that.



They went 4 and 7 after Rubio's injury, which is bad, but not worst in the league bad like Luke is making them out to be. They then went 1 and 13 to finish the year, which to me seems like everyone just gave up once they saw they weren't making the playoffs.

[Luke]

So now going 5-20 over the final 25 games is an excuse because a rookie got injured. Okay.

And I addressed everything in your post.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by Luke

So now going 5-20 over the final 25 games is an excuse because a rookie got injured. Okay.

And I addressed everything in your post.

No, actually it was fleshed out 4 and 7 and finishing 1 and 13 when it was clear they weren't going to make the playoffs. I can elaborate and add thought to arguments and you can keep simplifying to try to muddle the argument though if you'd like.


And no again on you addressing everything, so I'll ask again if it wasn't clear.

You said Kevin Love has no excuse for the Wolves failing last year, even though they lost their second best player and point guard. After that you gave excuses as to why it was ok for LMA and Portland to fall out of the playoffs last year because they had injuries and are rebuilding.

Your posts addressed none of that. So I'll ask in clear and concise questions and you can answer them one by one.

1) Why is team injury an excuse for LMA's failure last season but not Love's?
2) Is it not clear to you the Wolves have been rebuilding around Love and Rubio? Because you seem to have it as an excuse for Portland, but not for Minnesota.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by R-Star

No, actually it was fleshed out 4 and 7 and finishing 1 and 13 when it was clear they weren't going to make the playoffs. I can elaborate and add thought to arguments and you can keep simplifying to try to muddle the argument though if you'd like.


And no again on you addressing everything, so I'll ask again if it wasn't clear.

You said Kevin Love has no excuse for the Wolves failing last year, even though they lost their second best player and point guard. After that you gave excuses at to why it was ok for LMA and Portland to fall out of the playoffs last year because they had injuries and are rebuilding.

You posts addressed none of that. So I'll ask in clear and concise questions and you can answer them one by one.

1) Why is team injury an excuse for LMA's failure last season but not Love's?
2) Is it not clear to you the Wolves have been rebuilding around Love and Rubio? Because you seem to have it as an excuse for Portland, but not for Minnesota.

As EH already stated, the Wolves did not have a draft pick. They had no reason to finish 1-13. That is not an excuse, that's shitty basketball.

You can use the injury excuse with LMA because he's already been to the playoffs three straight years. If a team has a bad year because of injuries I can see that, but Love has never been in the playoffs, and the only year it was even a longshot that he had a chance a rookie point guard was apparently just as big of a catalyst based on the results.

Portland never rebuilded around LMA and I never said they did, so I'm not seeing where you're getting this excuse from. LMA was supposed to be the third star next to Brandon Roy and Greg Oden in a potential future dynasty but injuries destroyed two very promising careers, LMA was just good enough to keep the Blazers afloat during the process. Because he's a really good player.

You seem to think that I have some huge vendetta against Love for whatever reason. If KLove matches his production this year and the Wolves flirt with 50 wins then I have no problem giving credit where credit is due, but I'm not going to annoint a big man who plays absolutely no semblance of defense the title of best 4 in the game before he shows me he can do it and win basketball games.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by Luke

As EH already stated, the Wolves did not have a draft pick. They had no reason to finish 1-13. That is not an excuse, that's shitty basketball.

You can use the injury excuse with LMA because he's already been to the playoffs three straight years. If a team has a bad year because of injuries I can see that, but Love has never been in the playoffs, and the only year it was even a longshot that he had a chance a rookie point guard was apparently just as big of a catalyst based on the results.

Portland never rebuilded around LMA and I never said they did, so I'm not seeing where you're getting this excuse from. LMA was supposed to be the third star next to Brandon Roy and Greg Oden in a potential future dynasty but injuries destroyed two very promising careers, LMA was just good enough to keep the Blazers afloat during the process. Because he's a really good player.

You seem to think that I have some huge vendetta against Love for whatever reason. If KLove matches his production this year and the Wolves flirt with 50 wins then I have no problem giving credit where credit is due, but I'm not going to annoint a big man who plays absolutely no semblance of defense the title of best 4 in the game before he shows me he can do it and win basketball games.

Uh, it was from you writing "....and Portland is in a rebuilding phase" directly after using injuries as an excuse for them. That's where I got it from... your posts.


The Timberwolves were a laughing stock after KG left, and finally traded Mayo for Love which turned out to be brilliant. Last year they finally got a decent player beside him to play and look what happened. Portland on the other hand has been solid for years. You talk about their playoff runs and refuse to mention that's when Roy was healthy and one of the better players in the league.

I mean, the way you're trying to blast the Wolves and then use the same arguments as excuses for Portland is just sad. You're trying way too hard here.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by R-Star

Uh, it was from you writing "....and Portland is in a rebuilding phase" directly after using injuries as an excuse for them. That's where I got it from... your posts.


The Timberwolves were a laughing stock after KG left, and finally traded Mayo for Love which turned out to be brilliant. Last year they finally got a decent player beside him to play and look what happened. Portland on the other hand has been solid for years. You talk about their playoff runs and refuse to mention that's when Roy was healthy and one of the better players in the league.

I mean, the way you're trying to blast the Wolves and then use the same arguments as excuses for Portland is just sad. You're trying way too hard here.

Yeah Brandon Roy was certainly one of the better players in the league in 2011. He was really special off the bench against Dallas.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by Luke

Yeah Brandon Roy was certainly one of the better players in the league in 2011. He was really special off the bench against Dallas.

You're kidding me right? So that little sentence you made there negates the fact that Roy, not Aldridge was the key player during most of the 3 year playoff run you're talking about?



You're doing a terrible ****ing job here. Fold harder.

[E.H. Munro]

Originally Posted by R-Star

You're kidding me right? So that little sentence you made there negates the fact that Roy, not Aldridge was the key player during most of the 3 year playoff run you're talking about?



You're doing a terrible ****ing job here. Fold harder.

While I'm sure that the 11-12 points per game that Roy was scoring in 2011 were really important points, the fact remains that he only played half the year and only started 20-30 games. Aldridge was far and away the most important player on that team.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by E.H. Munro

While I'm sure that the 11-12 points per game that Roy was scoring in 2011 were really important points, the fact remains that he only played half the year and only started 20-30 games. Aldridge was far and away the most important player on that team.

I addressed that. Luke is trying to put Aldridge at the helm of all 3 years of those playoff runs though. Lets not try to twist that please.

[E.H. Munro]

I'm pretty sure that like me he was an LMA skeptic until 2011. That year Aldridge opened a lot of eyes because he played a lot better when Roy wasn't around. And he pretty much carried a team whose second best player was Wes Matthews into the postseason.

[R-Star]

Originally Posted by E.H. Munro

I'm pretty sure that like me he was an LMA skeptic until 2011. That year he opened everyone's eyes because he played a lot better when Roy wasn't around.

That's all well and good, but it doesn't make LMA the best player for the two years prior to Roy getting hurt.

[Bogg]

Aldridge......is very good. He could definitely be the third-best player on a championship team. He might be able to be the sidekick to an all-time kind of guy, like Lebron or Shaq. I feel the same way about Love and Blake. With Duncan, KG, and Dirk aging/hurt/moving positions I don't know that there's really a franchise power forward left in the league.