It's pretty funny how you guys can sit behind your computers and call a guy a "****ing idiot" for making a decision that just resulted in him inking a max contract. Funny stuff.
Houston really wants to stay medicore then they should max harden out... I like harden, he is one hell of a #3 on any team in the league but he will be a poor #1 option.... can see this going the Michael Redd route for the Rockets
Kevin Martin is being underrated in this thread. He's basically been a 20+ scorer for 7 seasons, he hits the boards well and had a pretty impressive passing game.
You should have realized by now that around here, whichever player has a ton of hype is the best. And a decent guy on a non exciting team like Kevin Martin gets underrated like crazy.
I said last year that Harden was the most overrated player on these forums. Its pretty clear I was right.
James Harden was better last season than Kevin Martin will be this season on the Thunder because he is just the better player. Additionally, Harden is a MUCH better fit on the Rockets than he was on the Thunder. He is certainly worth as much to Houston as Hibbert is worth to Indy. He should get Hibbert money, IMO.
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But spare me the dreck about how James Harden should have sacrificed for the greater good. He's under no obligation to do so. The Thunder's owners haven't sacrificed profits here; why should Harden? The Thunder brain trust believes in the importance of sacrifice for the greater good, harking back to Tim Duncan taking less than the max in 2007 to help San Antonio afford its complementary stars. They wanted Harden to make that sort of sacrifice. He didn't, and the Thunder voluntarily chose to cut their championship odds in order to save the equivalent of about $1.5 million in salary and a few million more in tax payments every season.
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As for the Rockets, they've paid a steep price, as you can trace all the assets they've sent in this deal back to Kyle Lowry (the price for the Raptors pick) and Samuel Dalembert (the price for the pick that became Lamb). Harden isn't a top-three overall player like Howard, Houston's first choice, but he has the potential to be a top-15 or even top-10 player when unleashed as the focal point of his team. He flopped in the Finals, and it is astounding how many fans and writers are judging Harden's contributions based solely on his play in that series — and against one of the league's most athletic defenses.
Heres the thing, and I'lll say it again, fans are beyond fickle. So if their lasting memory of Harden is him bombing in the finals they'll use that to judge him more than they should. It's like I was telling Dre in the finals last year when he was stating that Harden was due to get "near max" dollars until he slumped in the finals, GMs are smarter than the posters here.
The Reggie Miller flailing rule change kind of neutered Kevin martin whose shtick was to flop around like a wounded animal into defenders to get free throws.
If Eric Maynor can handle Harden's creating role, they'll be fine. Martin is a terrible defender, though. Sefolosha's getting some major minutes this year.
If you're 6'7 and you grab three boards a game then you're not average. And I have absolutely no idea where you're getting this passing thing from. Have you ever watched Kevin Martin play? He can put the ball in the bucket but that's about it.
Yea Kevin Martin is about as one dimensional as it gets in the NBA. If he's a good or average rebounder and/or passer, please start listing all of the below average rebounding and passing swing men.
Yeah, I am pretty sure James Harden will be a top 5 scorer this season.
I also like how people ignore the fact Kevin Martin has never had a major role on a winning team in his career(6 career playoff games in a 10 year career:2ti. So the 20 ppg thing is total bullshit.
actually if you compare their minute to minute stats the differences are bigger
but this isnt just about Martin for Harden and its not just about 1.5m a year - it's about a ton more flexibility going forward and being able to pay for 3 or 4 young guys on rookie contracts instead of just Harden + luxury tax
no and some of it is role related - certainly Harden will be terminating more possessions with shots in his new role and I doubt as the focus of the offense (and opposing defenses) his scoring efficiency will be the same
flexibility to continue to compete for a title for several more years without getting hammered by luxury taxes while not hurting your chances all that bad this year
The other thing potentially getting lost in this trade is the fact that late lottery picks are more valuable on a team like the Thunder than they typically are on a true rebuilding squad. If Bargnani and/or Lowry have any sort of injury problems this year, that pick could get real interesting in a good draft. Also, Jeremy Lamb and Perry Jones could turn out to be starters alongside OKC's current big three if they are given the proper time to develop in this good environment.
True. Most championship teams have to go out and sign guys every year to fill out their roster and never get decent prospects. The Lakers the only guy I can think of recently is Bynum, and the Heat have the same problem.
San Antonio is the only one off the top of my head that was able to keep a stocked talent pool through having some amazing late picks in the draft.
Being a title contender and having quality young players coming into the system is going to be a real boost for OKC.
Like everyones said, Martin won't replace Harden 100%, but they will improve in other areas because of this trade.
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