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jericho · 09-18-2007, 10:25 AM

This is a question I've been mulling for a long time--

Who are the most important players ever? Most important, that is, to the game's history, evolution, impact, economics, etc., and perhaps to broader society and culture. They aren't necessarily the "best" players ever, so this is different than most GOAT debates and makes the Pandora's box of inter-era comparisons irrelevant.

I'm also focusing on players here, so am bypassing for now guys like Saperstein, Auerbach, and some guys like Phil Jackson and Pat Riley that would only rate as coaches.

The first few to mind for me are...

George Mikan: Rules were changed to mitigate his impact on the court. He's more responsible than anyone for basketball having evolved as a big man's game, with a premium on star difference-makers in the post.

Bob Cousy: Basically invented the point guard position as we know it, setting the expectation over time that one player is responsible for being the floor general, chief ballhandler and playmaker. He's also the most notable pioneer of fancy-pants play, with creative dribbling, no-look passing, and so forth. (He had some help in all this from Andy Phillip and Dick McGuire, but Cousy was the real master.)

Bill Russell: I believe he was the first non-white superstar in the game, and also the first superstar to make celebrated arts out of defense and rebounding. If Mikan invented the dominant big man, Russell completed the invention.

Julius Erving: The Doc really wrote the style manual on aerial play. He had some predecessors (Baylor) and some peers (Skywalker and Connie), but far more acrobatic youngsters have been compared to Erving than those other fellows, and not enough civilians actually saw Baylor play since the league hadn't really emerged as a commercial force at that point. Erving was the first really marketable high-flyer, and so he re-set fans' expectations for what exciting basketball was supposed to look like. It also didn't hurt that he was the NBA's chief ambassador during its most troubled era.

Magic Johnson and Larry Bird: It's hard to separate these two in this exercise, since their careers mostly overlapped and they were the clear cornerstones of the game on and off the court. They were both highly marketable, basically unique in what they did on the court and at their positions, were unsurpassed competitors, and happened to play for good teams. They personified the on-court rivalry (between the Lakers and Celtics) and the individual class that first salvaged the NBA and then solidified it as a top 3 sports league in the US.

Michael Jordan, obviously: In part, he did what Erving did in that he became the new (and still current) basketball archetype--a high-flying swingman who can do just about everything. Jordan just did it better, to the point where throughout the '90s he seemed virtually unstoppable whenever he really wanted to take over a game. I'd say he ranks just a hair behind Russell and arguably on a par with Magic as the game's greatest "winner" ever. His power as a marketing bonanza was instrumental in propelling the league into its current status as an international commercial and cultural presence. And he definitely made bald fasionable, especially among young black men.

Kevin Garnett: Set a continuous trend of superstar high schoolers going right to the NBA, and emerging there fairly quickly as superstars. Garnett opened the gate for some other future Hall-of-Famers. Even though this trend has been stopped by league mandate (temporarily, I suspect), Garnett still personifies the ongoing pattern of young megastuds turning professional as early as possible. He's also the classic example of the post-modern big man: mobile, athletic, versatile, and more comfortable facing the basket than posting up.

I also gave some thought to Wilt, West, Kareem, and Lebron. And I haven't even started considering Europe and other parts of the world.

Any thoughts on who I've missed, or where I'm wrong?

HB · 09-18-2007, 10:27 AM

Allen Iverson: Has there ever been a greater player under 6'1? Regardless of the era, he would have been one of the greats

**Avalanche** · 09-18-2007, 10:29 AM

Wilt is definately up there, he incorperated a lot of different plays/styles into the game to the point where they started changing the rules just to contain him.

**Avalanche** · 09-18-2007, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HB

Allen Iverson: Has there ever been a greater player under 6'1? Regardless of the era, he would have been one of the greats

Definately Iverson too

jericho · 09-18-2007, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HB

Allen Iverson: Has there ever been a greater player under 6'1? Regardless of the era, he would have been one of the greats

But would you say he changed how the game is played or presented? Definitely a great, bizarre, unique, and admirable player. But does he belong on a Most Important list?

HB · 09-18-2007, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jericho

But would you say he changed how the game is played or presented? Definitely a great, bizarre, unique, and admirable player. But does he belong on a Most Important list?

Dont you think it would be unfair to any player coming out after the post jordan era to be expected to revolutionize the game? Theres really not much else a player in this day and time can do that hasnt been done before, but should we hold that against them. AI in say the Cousy era would have been one of the most dynamic players on the court. His athleticism, grit and speed would have given teams fits during that period. He probably would have averaged close to 40 ppg back then

jericho · 09-18-2007, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HB

Dont you think it would be unfair to any player coming out after the post jordan era to be expected to revolutionize the game? Theres really not much else a player in this day and time can do that hasnt been done before, but should we hold that against them. AI in say the Cousy era would have been one of the most dynamic players on the court. His athleticism, grit and speed would have given teams fits during that period. He probably would have averaged close to 40 ppg back then

I agree, he might have. And his lower-than-ideal shooting percentages wouldn't have been unusual. But again, this question of "most important" isn't about cross-era comparisons.

And I assume the game will continue to evolve. I don't consider Iverson a revolutionary or pioneer, because I don't see him as having had a lasting effect on how the game is played or perceived. I would say he was at the forefront of a recent trend toward high-scoring combo guards (or "scoring" point guards) having free reign as their team's first option on offense. Baron, Marbury, and Arenas all come to mind. But I think that trend is already in reverse as its limitations become obvious...now every rebuilding team wants a Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

jericho · 09-18-2007, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avalanche

Wilt is definately up there, he incorperated a lot of different plays/styles into the game to the point where they started changing the rules just to contain him.

I guess it's silly of me to leave Wilt off the list. But if I were ranking them I'd probably put him below everyone I mentioned except for Garnett. There's no question that his entry into the league, and his dominance of league play for many years, was unparalleled. I'm just not sure he had as big an impact on the rules as Mikan, or on marketing as Jordan, Bird or Magic, or on style of play as Russell or Erving. But feel free to tell me I'm crazy.

HB · 09-18-2007, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jericho

I agree, he might have. And his lower-than-ideal shooting percentages wouldn't have been unusual. But again, this question of "most important" isn't about cross-era comparisons.

And I assume the game will continue to evolve. I don't consider Iverson a revolutionary or pioneer, because I don't see him as having had a lasting effect on how the game is played or perceived. I would say he was at the forefront of a recent trend toward high-scoring combo guards (or "scoring" point guards) having free reign as their team's first option on offense. Baron, Marbury, and Arenas all come to mind. But I think that trend is already in reverse as its limitations become obvious...now every rebuilding team wants a Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

And the trend will focus back on scoring points with next year's draft. If the same players in this draft where eligible at the time of Williams and Paul's picks, Williams might have not gone so high

BadBaronRudigor · 09-18-2007, 03:38 PM

I'd put a couple of guys up there you don't have.

(1) Oscar Robertson . . . the first big PG, Mr. Triple Double, plus . . . his lawsuit as head of the player's association opened up the modern era of free agency which has changed the face of the modern game more than any stylistic innovation.

(2) Hank Luisetti . . . invented/popularized the modern one-handed jump shot.

(3) Connie Hawkins/Spencer Haywood . . . the first ABA star who helped get that league off the ground,

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