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Old 03-16-2006, 01:46 PM   #1 (permalink)
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NBA Points Created

This is a stat invented by a friend of mine (Ryan Toohil), and it's calculated thusly:

Points Created = Points + .75*Ast + 1.03(.75*OReb + .25DReb + Stl + .5Blk - TO - .71*FGMissed)

The first part is self-explanatory, he chose .75 as the coefficient for assists because it's the standard value assigned in linear-weighted formulae (though he prefers .6 as being more reflective of the value of an assist). The last part of formula is to get an idea of possessions created modified for the value of points/possession. Anyway, here is Ryan's Points Created list sorted by total points created, though you can also sort points created/game or /48. Some of the results are quite interesting.
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Old 03-16-2006, 04:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

I would like to see the rationale behind a modified points/possession (including the co-efficients he used) but from the results of this statistics, it seems very useful and it does not hold any biases to players of different positions.
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Old 03-18-2006, 08:19 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

Would like to see the same numbers with number of possessions taken into account
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Old 03-21-2006, 12:50 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

I did get him to alter the co-efficient on assists. The ratio of assists to adjusted FGs over the last five years .56 and the points/FG number over the same period is 2.15, so he altered the co-efficient on assists to 1.2 (as the relative point value of an assist).
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Old 03-21-2006, 11:19 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

wow, I havent actually looked into it too hard, but that looks like a really accurate way to rate a player. However, I dont know if Nene Hilario would be too happy about it! How the phuck do you end up with a negative value??
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Old 03-22-2006, 09:53 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

Wanted to add a few thoughts on this, I think the points created idea is a fine one, but the methodology used here is slightly flawed.

First, in general linear weighted metrics tend to be more subjective than objective - to quote Premier, "from the results of this statistics, it seems very useful..." and that can be a trap that many linear weighted models fall into. Try to be as objective as possible in your selection of coefficients and statistics.

Second, the use of FGM is problematic. As an example, suppose two players, player A and player B both take 10 shots. Player A takes all 3 point shots and makes 4, and player B takes all 2 point shots and makes 6.

Player A's PC(points created) is 12 + 1.03(-.71*6) = 7.6122
Player B's PC(points created) is 12 + 1.03(-.71*4) = 9.16

Yet for all intents and purposes in a game, the player's value should be identical. Even more to the point, there is no quantification of free throws taken or missed except under the catch-all of points. A player could go 1 of 100 from the free throw line with no other productive statistics and have a positive points created value.

Next, while I agree with the basic idea of using possessions created and multiplying it by the value of an average possession (also I'm curious how you derived 1.03 for your coefficient - the last time I calculated it was two years ago and I got 1.046, but I'm still curious as to what method you used to get 1.03), quantifying possessions created at the player level can be difficult. I wanted to test this, and here's what I came up with:

In a game, two teams should start with a base number of possessions that is equal. Their possessions created would then add to their total number of possessions, and the difference between the two's possessions should be equal to the difference between their possessions created.

(A + b) - (A + c) = b - c where A is the base possessions and b and c are the possessions created of each team.

In the formula above, (A + b) is equal to FGA + (FTA/2.5) and (A + c) is equal to FGA allowed + (FTA allowed/2.5). I grabbed all of the latest data and plugged it into a spreadsheet. Using these formulas and plugging in your (.75*OReb + .25DReb + Stl + .5Blk - TO - .71*FGMissed) metric, I calculated both sides of the above formula for each team. Here are the results: (apologies for formatting)

Atlanta 0.08 -2.959
Boston (2.30) -2.894
Charlotte 4.48 0.506
Chicago (0.16) -2.425
Cleveland 1.08 1.583
Dallas 1.74 3.989
Denver (0.02) 3.044
Detroit 1.92 4.492
Golden State 1.46 -0.617
Houston (1.12) -0.337
Indiana (1.34) -1.302
LA Clippers (2.48) 2.698
LA Lakers 0.96 1.203
Memphis 0.32 -0.574
Miami (2.06) 3.437
Milwaukee 1.78 -1.466
Minnesota (2.28) 0.591
New Jersey 1.40 -0.435
New Orleans 1.98 -4.219
New York (0.66) 0.887
Orlando (2.22) -1.305
Philadelphia (1.04) 1.252
Phoenix (2.92) 1.322
Portland (2.52) -3.821
Sacramento (1.80) -1.726
San Antonio (1.16) 2.861
Seattle 1.16 -2.919
Toronto 0.78 -2.413
Utah 2.22 -1.725
Washington 2.80 2.205

The first column is the actual possession differential, and the second column is the possessions created differential. I then plugged the points into a scatter plot and used a linear regression to get an R-squared value. Here's a link to the graph:

Graph

As you can see, the R-squared value is .002, which definitively shows there is no correlation between the actual possession difference and the possessions created difference.

Finally, I just want to say that I think the idea of points and possessions created at the player level are great ideas, but this method I think still has some work to be done on it.
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Old 04-08-2006, 12:30 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

Quote:
Originally Posted by magohaydz
wow, I havent actually looked into it too hard, but that looks like a really accurate way to rate a player. However, I dont know if Nene Hilario would be too happy about it! How the phuck do you end up with a negative value??
lol it means that when you better play with 4 players than let Nene play.
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Old 04-11-2006, 08:32 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

While I admire any attempt to think deeper about basketball stats than simple PPG/RPG/APG, RunTMC is right on the money about the formula's flaws. One additional problem (that TMC didn't mention) is that points are not conserved in your formula. Which is to say that when a player scores, he shouldn't receive full credit for those points while the assist man simultaneously gets .75 points worth of credit on the same basket... Another example: say a player grabs a defensive rebound, and a teammate makes a layup on the resulting possession... under your formula, 2.27 "points created" would be assessed on a possession that only netted 2 points, which is illogical. That said, kudos to your friend for actually thinking about the game on a deeper level. Work out the flaws, and PC will be useful.
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Old 04-15-2006, 11:28 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created


Hockey has points so why shouldn't basketball.
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Old 05-23-2006, 01:40 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: NBA Points Created

Quote: