TwinkieFoot

And I'm not buying your side of the story either. Like I said, the entire locker room being up and arms because of Marbury is unfounded. Aside from a few isolated incidents with players like Tim Thomas, Kurt Thomas and Keith Van Horn taking shots at Marbury, you never really hear very many complaints from teammates. Once again, aside from Kurt Thomas (who only said it was nice to play with a real pg), Tim and Keith seem to be finding excuses of why they never became the players they should have or were suppose to have been. As for players showing up other players during live games, Payton did it to Wade just this year in the playoffs and they won a title. Michael Jordan during the 96 season I believe showed up Pete Myers, his own teammate on the court yet it didn't effect the Bulls winning several titles. Again, being the leader of a team doesn't mean your a nice guy. I know of this first hand but you sometimes need to tell people what they need to hear and not what they want to.

TwinkieFoot

Just because you don't play with stars doesn't mean that your team is butchered. There's this common misconception that Nash is some kind of wizards. That couldn't be farther from the truth if you actually looked at the roster. This is an excerpt from one of my friend's post who made excellent points and shares the same opinion as mine:

"I watch Cold Pizza and I keep hearing how Steve Nash is the MVP because six of his teammates are having career scoring years. Well, I am here to say that it is not because of Nash at all. Opportunity is the real MVP. Either opportunity or Mike D’Antoni. You choose. Now, I am not one to shoot down Canada’s Finest without some evidence. So, here goes.

In Utah, Raja Bell played 28.4 MPG and averaged 12.3 PPG. Now, next to Nash, he averages 14.6 PPG, but he is playing 37.6 MPG.

Leandro Barbosa played 17.3 MPG last season and averaged 7.0 PPG. This season he is playing 27.2 MPG. That is nearly 10 more minutes. His PPG reflects his increase in MPG with an average of 12.6 PPG.

Boris Diaw averaged 18.2 MPG last season in Atlanta averaging 4.8 PPG while playing PG and SG. Apparently, despite his size, he is more comfortable playing PF and C. Factor in his 35.2 MPG, and it is obvious why he averages 13.2 PPG this season. As even more proof that it is not Nash, Diaw played great while running the team from center against San Antonio when Nash was injured. Diaw’s low Atlanta numbers are due to a restrictive coach that sticks players in positions based on size and skill set. Sure Diaw can handle and pass and is only 6’8”, but if the man plays better as a PF/C, then let him play PF/C.

Eddie House averaged 4.7 PPG while playing 11 MPG in Sacramento. He averages 9.7 PPG while playing 17.5 MPG this season, and a lot of that is while he is subbing for Nash.

James Jones was pretty much a chair in Indy. He only played last season because of the brawl. Then, he averaged 5.0 PPG in 17.7 MPG. Now, with the amazing Steve Nash, he is averaging a whopping 9.5 PPG in 23.7 MPG.

Shawn Marion, the 3-time All-star, apparently is Nash’s greatest accomplishment. He averaged a puny 19.4 PPG in 38.8 MPG while sharing the offensive load with Stoudemire. Now, while playing without the team’s #1 option and playing 1.9 more MPG (40.7 MPG), Nash has boosted him to the outrageous scoring total of 21.4 PPG. That is unbelievable when you figure in just two minutes he averages a whole two points. FREAKIN’ AMAZIN’!!! STEVE NASH IS AWESOME!!! (Insert sarcasm here).

Probably Nash’s most significant accomplish, and the one that I never hear mentioned is Dijon Thompson. Last season, he was in college. As a college ball player, his NBA scoring average was exactly zero PPG, but this season Nash has him scoring at the unheard of clip of 2.8 PPG in 4.3 MPG. I think he is the real reason why Nash is the MVP again. (Yet again, insert more sarcasm)."

That about sums it up and saves me alot of time typing up everything. Once again, Nash is the benefactor of his system.


Moving on, that little comment about Marbury and the Suns you made is off. First off, this is a dramatically different team from the one Marbury played on. Just to save time, here was the roster:

Stephon Marbury
Anfernee Hardaway
Shawn Marion
Amare Stoudemire
Jake Voshkul
Joe Johnson
Casey Jacobsen
Jake Tsakalidis
Tom Gugliotta
Bo Outlaw
Scott Williams
Dan Langhi
Randy Brown
Alton Ford

What about that lineup suggests to you that they could shoot? What about that lineup suggest yo you that it is as good as Nash's squad? Seriously, that Suns team was about 10-12 deep. With Marbury's squad, it would be hard to field a solid starting 5, let alone a decent team. As far as wanting to knock Marbury for his defense, what about your boy Nash? Last time I checked, he wasn't winning any all team defenses or for that matter, better than Marbury at that end of the floor. Knock his personality as well but he was a kind enough guy to buy each one of our former rookies suits to wear to games. I'm sure they wouldn't have anything negative to say about him especially since they recently took his side regarding former coach Brown. So, until the non-Marbury supporters come up with a half way decent response to shut me up, this Marbury support will keep talking. Patiently awaiting the next posts...

alphadog

and you need to watch more ball. Penny could shoot, Marion is still there, Joe Johnson can shoot, Gugs can shoot, Jacobson was drafted as a shooter but was too slow too make in the league,..the others I am not familiar with. How many shooters you need? If you think Diaw, Bell, and Barbosa are great players, you're nuts. Good, not great. Despite who did what when Nash was injured, the bottom line is that the team was simply not nearly as good. Take Nash away and the team struggles to make the playoffs. Dfend Marbury all you want by twisting numbers and maling alobies but history doesn't lie, and we all know that those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

PRIMIDONNA, DIVA....whatever you call it, its still MARBURY.

USSKittyHawk

This part of the post basically sums up the thread. I'm done and I know the facts and I'm actually a Steph fan so I'm done beating this dead horse, the results remain the same his attitude is his doom.

__________________
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
PLEASE BEWARE THIS POSTER MAY GO ON THE DEEP END AT ANY GIVEN TIME. Use Caution!

TwinkieFoot

I guess it must take a basketball player to understand a basketball player but just because you could hit jump shots occassionally, doesn't make you a jump shooter. For instance, Johnson had range but at a young age, he was not nearly as good a jump shooter as he is today. That was evident by his .397 shooting percentage. Jacobsen not being in the league for very long might tell you just a little bit of the reason why it might be foolish to even include him in any relevant discussion. Besides, for as great a shooter as you may think him to be, he shot .373 from the field. Real accuracy there. Marion has or never been a jump shooter, just a scrapper that comes up with putbacks and layups. He does shoot the 3 but hardly the guy that could be classified as a jump shooter and nearly not good enough to offset the team's poor jump shooting ability. As for Tom Googs, yeah, he could shoot....in early 1990's. By the time he was a Sun, he was a broken down has been that was only capable of spot minutes evident by his 16.6mpg and then never being resigned after that. Somehow, I don't believe he effected the game very much especially from, the fact he wasn't even tendered an offer after his Suns gig.

By the way, excellent defense there on me being "nuts" about my opinion's of Nash's supporting cast. Maybe we could actually get some reasoning out of that in the future since you know...it adds credibility to your opinion. Was it great? Obviously not and I never said it was but what it is is pretty damn good especially since it compliments his skill which goes unnoticed by the average fan. Take the time to reread my earlier post and you'll find out why.


P.S., I almost forgot to address your comment about why the Suns lose without Nash. Silly me, I always thought that kind of happens when you lose your best player but not only your best player, the most important player in the system you play. Remember, the whole running game was first invited to offset the lack of actual skill. Teams that either couldn't post up and/or shoot ran the ball because it increased their chances of scoring and wasn't that hard to run. You could lose a guy like Amare or Marion and be relatively alright because a less talented player could take their place and have a similar impact on the game offensively as long as they have something you could work with. Take Nash off and you lose the initiator of the break. Without him, the ball doesn't get up the court as well, it isn't distributed as well so that has a much more direct effect on the team, especially on a team that can score up until their 12th man. That's a noteworthy point as is my friend's words. His defense is pretty solid and I have yet to hear anything to damage it so you should care and learn from what he's saying.