[Dan]

I hope you're documenting what she's doing, however you can. (receipts, whatever)

[dudleysghost]

Wow this thread is still going strong. Divorces really are that messy. All I can say is that I agree with those who think being your ex-wife's landlord is a perilous idea. If you have enough equity in the house and money in the 401k, you should be able to get a mortgage refi that can either reduce monthly payments for her by extending the number of years, create enough cash from the equity to pair with the 401k assets to result in an even split, or both.

Or, you could just seek custody of the kids and the house, refi and give her a big cash check, then send her on her way. That's tempting from a revenge standpoint, but you'd have to be sure you were doing it for the kids and not yourself, if it's possible to separate those feelings...

Also, if you don't want to pay 24.95 there is a site annualcreditreport.com that allows you to check each of the three reporting agencies (although they usually give hte same result each) one time per year. It was mandated by the government.

Other than that, keep hope alive. Eventually the time in the desert comes to an end...

[dudleysghost]

It's totally OT from this OT thread, but changing topics can be good.

How many strips of bacon is this mamma-jamma? The story says it's 1,051 lbs total.

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by mook

as a guy who has been a landlord before and had to deal with drug addicts, a suicide, alcohol abuse and a number of other nasties from tenants (I was pretty lousy at picking tenants), I'd hate the idea of renting to an ex even more.

do you really want to get a phone call at 3 am because she "says" there's a dripping pipe? you are just opening yourself up to all kinds of head games with her as a tenant.

and what happens if she decides NOT to pay rent after a few months? you evict her? I can just imagine her telling your kids, "Daddy is evicting us from our own house. But I won't let him." even aside from that sort of misery, it can take up to six months to actually execute an eviction if a tenant wants to be a real *******. do you want to even risk having to add that misery to your life?

landlords may collect the dough, but it'd surprise you how often the tenant has all the real power.

nope, you are far better off not having a business relationship with this woman.

if it were me, I'd definitely sell the house. divvy up the assets. maybe let her keep more of the equity in the house in exchange for leaving the 401k alone for you. you don't want to have to pay all the tax penalties for raiding your 401k if at all possible.

try to stay in the same school district, but if you can't it's not the end of the world, is it? kids get moved all the time due to the harsh realities of grownup messes. being forced to make new friends in a new school can sometimes even be good for you.

where she wants to live is her problem. she's an adult, and she's the one who's made this mess. she's getting a big ol' pile of money out of this. let her figure it out. that's what a lot of that money is for.

your job is to manage your own living situation so that you have a place for the kids to stay at when they are with you.

Agree, mook. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this.

After thinking about it some more (and reading the advice given here), I realized that the whole rental arrangement would be setting me up for many more (and yet more serious) cans of worms farther on down the road. I can't imagine how I would ever be able to evict my own children if she didn't pay the rent, and she would know I wouldn't be able to, and would simply not pay the rent. Then there's responding to "emergencies". Potential claims of safety hazards. Just not a good situation to put us in.

My bottom line: I both need and deserve to own my own house someday so the kids have a place to call "home" when they are with me. And she does, too. The reason she doesn't WANT to move is because she doesn't want to have to get a job in order to be able to afford a place of her own. Never has wanted to work. Welcome to the working world, toots.

PBF

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by MARIS61

Sell the house, she can buy another, more modest one in the neighborhood with her winnings from the divorce lotto. Last thing you want your kids to view you as is the evil landlord. She will use that against you forever. Good luck ever collecting rent. "Sorry kids, you can't play baseball 'cause your Father takes all my money for rent."

And you can buy yourself a nice house so the kids have a stable environment when they are with you, instead of you being the loser with an apt. I have a feeling they will end up with you solely sometime down the line. Your wife is involved in something that is going to bring her down hard in the end. I can feel it.

I agree, MARIS. Yet there appears to be nothing I can do about it. What I am trying to do now is to prepare myself as much as possible for when it happens. I need to be there (and able) to be the children's safety net when it does.

PBF

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by crandc

PBF, I don't think you need to ask forgiveness of your children. YOu have done everything you can for them. And I'm sure you will continue to do so.

Please, if you have not done so, you need to bring all this to your lawyer. He/she can guide you through the finances of the house and getting hold of your share of the family assets. I don't know if Oregon is a community property state but the lawyer sure will. What your ex is doing may not be legal. I'm no lawyer but I know friends who have gone through divorces and have had to dig out "hidden" income (usually women are in that position, simply because men tend to earn more and in a lot of families are the ones handling the finances and investments).

I would also suggest a trip to your public library. I have no doubt there are a lot of resources on exactly how to get info on "hidden" assets. I know you're busy but any research you do is something you don't have to pay a lawyer to do.

The children don't have to necessarily change schools, you can use the income from the sold home for a more modest home in the same area. Again, your lawyer can guide you.

Best to you and to your kids in this tough time. Maybe we can dine together before the Blazers home opener? I'll bring dessert.

Great advice, crandc. I have been keeping my lawyer informed as much as possible, but my retainer is starting to run low, so lately I have only been informing him of the most absolutely "need-to-know" information. This has also been a good forcing function for me - making me step up and deal with the trivials personally. I have an interesting update that I will post shortly.

PBF

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by Hap

I hope you're documenting what she's doing, however you can. (receipts, whatever)

As much as possible.

PBF

[Spud147]

Originally Posted by ProudBFan

My bottom line: I both need and deserve to own my own house someday so the kids have a place to call "home" when they are with me. And she does, too. The reason she doesn't WANT to move is because she doesn't want to have to get a job in order to be able to afford a place of her own. Never has wanted to work. Welcome to the working world, toots.

PBF

Okay, now she's just making me mad... and you KNOW she doesn't want a piece of Spud.

I was just going to post this thought about not wanting to find employment outside the home but you beat me to it. And it is just a crock to lay that line of guilt on you when you wanted to go to counseling or whatever was needed to save the marriage. I know you're on board with the divorce now but let's not forget she initiated this. What about her guilt? Grown ups are supposed to know that life is about choices and the consequences of them. She wants to have her cake and eat it too. She makes this life altering decision that rocks every other family member's world but doesn't think there should be any repurcussions?!? Apparently her solution is to have everything remain the same, has her house, has her kids, has the same income level but doesn't want to work outside of the home. The only change, you're just not a part of it.

Yeah, lets come back to reality here. You are a big part of the kids' lives, will remain a big part of those kids' lives, and thank God for them you're going to be. The household is being split, as a result the living expenses double, she needs to own up to her part in this and understand that this is going to take additional income. If the children are going to be living in two households they both need to be stable and liveable, that means that dad should not have to live in a slum because "she's just trying to do what's best for the children". Give me a friggin' break!

Here's the choice:

Get a job, refinance the house and buy you out OR

Get a job, let you refinance the house, buy her out, you move back in and she uses her part of the equity to make a down payment on another house (hopefully within the same school district OR

Get a job, sell the house, split the proceeds, mom and dad both buy another house using their half of the equity (hopefully within the same school district) and move there.

B DO NOT let her guilt you like this, it's ridiculous. This manipulative tactic is just not okay.

And finally, give her this message from your buddy Spud... "GROW THE "F" UP!!!!!

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by dudleysghost

Wow this thread is still going strong. Divorces really are that messy. All I can say is that I agree with those who think being your ex-wife's landlord is a perilous idea. If you have enough equity in the house and money in the 401k, you should be able to get a mortgage refi that can either reduce monthly payments for her by extending the number of years, create enough cash from the equity to pair with the 401k assets to result in an even split, or both.

Or, you could just seek custody of the kids and the house, refi and give her a big cash check, then send her on her way. That's tempting from a revenge standpoint, but you'd have to be sure you were doing it for the kids and not yourself, if it's possible to separate those feelings...

Also, if you don't want to pay 24.95 there is a site annualcreditreport.com that allows you to check each of the three reporting agencies (although they usually give hte same result each) one time per year. It was mandated by the government.

Other than that, keep hope alive. Eventually the time in the desert comes to an end...

I would love nothing more than to have primary custody of the kids, possession of the house, pay her alimony, have her pay me child support, and pay a nanny 4x / week. Problem with this is - as my lawyer points out - Oregon's custody laws seek to maintain the status quo for the children above all else. That means, since I moved out in November (ironically to preserve a conflict-free environment for the kids), I basically gave away my claim to primary custody of the children.

PBF

[ProudBFan]

Originally Posted by Spud147

Okay, now she's just making me mad... and you KNOW she doesn't want a piece of Spud.

I was just going to post this thought about not wanting to find employment outside the home but you beat me to it. And it is just a crock to lay that line of guilt on you when you wanted to go to counseling or whatever was needed to save the marriage. I know you're on board with the divorce now but let's not forget she initiated this. What about her guilt? Grown ups are supposed to know that life is about choices and the consequences of them. She wants to have her cake and eat it too. She makes this life altering decision that rocks every other family member's world but doesn't think there should be any repurcussions?!? Apparently her solution is to have everything remain the same, has her house, has her kids, has the same income level but doesn't want to work outside of the home. The only change, you're just not a part of it.

You see the situation very clearly, Spud. Stay tuned for my next update (been simply responding to all y'all up to this point today). It's a doozie.

PBF

[crandc]

I am going to underline Spud. Feminism means equal rights, which we alas don't yet have. But it also means equal responsibilities. The reality is men still (nearly always) get paid more so to ask a woman to contribute 50% when she earns 30% is unrealistic. But that she should never have to work? What century is this?

I'm sorry but she sounds like a total spoiled brat! I find it hard to believe there are young women nowadays who still expect some man to support them all their lives. Even if I was straight I would not want that.

I mean, even if I won lottery I'd work part time. Who wants to stare at the walls all day? And who wants to be a parasite? (OK, Paris Hilton)

Especially if you think there may be someone else in her life, PBF. You sure as HELL have no obligation to support him!

[Spud147]

Originally Posted by crandc

I am going to underline Spud. Feminism means equal rights, which we alas don't yet have. But it also means equal responsibilities. The reality is men still (nearly always) get paid more so to ask a woman to contribute 50% when she earns 30% is unrealistic. But that she should never have to work? What century is this?

I'm sorry but she sounds like a total spoiled brat! I find it hard to believe there are young women nowadays who still expect some man to support them all their lives. Even if I was straight I would not want that.

I mean, even if I won lottery I'd work part time. Who wants to stare at the walls all day? And who wants to be a parasite? (OK, Paris Hilton)

Especially if you think there may be someone else in her life, PBF. You sure as HELL have no obligation to support him!

Yeah, what Crandc said! We both know you realize she doesn't have the earning capacity you do and know she can't make this a 50/50 deal. You want to maintain the kids' quality of life but it's not feasible on one income with this change. I know you aren't looking to withdrawn all support from her but she's going to have to contribute financially to the household expenses if she wants to live in seperate houses.