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MAS RipCity · 01-06-2005, 12:22 AM

I wish there was any way we could pry Corey Maggattee away from the Clips. He has it all. His jumper is smooth, he gets to the hole at will,and he makes alot of his free throws.He is a muscular guard who can bang with any other guard in the L. I know it's impossible since our best offer could be Zach/SAR and they already have Big E.This guy is the next great wing superstar in the L. Too bad he is burried in LAC. Man the Lakers were stupid for not dealing Maggs and Brand for Kobe and keeping Shaq.

Kmurph · 01-06-2005, 12:42 AM

No I am not saying that Nash should accept a bad trade for SAR, NVE or Damon. But just what exactly constitutes a bad trade from a POR perspective?

Taking on a player with 2 years or so on his deal? Nash just resigned Theo, Miles and Zach to big money. DA and Ruben are on the books for another two years, so its not like POR is going to see any significant cap space for awhile anyway right?

The problem I see with Nash is that he has now backed himself into a corner so to speak. He is playing a high stakes game of poker, betting that once again the FEB trade deadline will bail him out ala Sheed.

Whether we\he liked them at the time, trades WERE available for SAR. IF SAR does indeed walk for nothing, does Kerry Kittles and a draft pick or two look so bad in retrospect? I don't think it does at all. He gambled there would be something better, he better be right.

And I don't hold a lot of faith that Nash could get SAR, whom POR has jerked around to some extent. to agree to a S & T, and EVEN IF NASH DID, I maintain that no team is going to give us anything remotely appealing. Remember when POR signed DA? SA didn't want Steve Smith, but getting him was better than losing DA for nothing. San Antonio didn't orchestrate that deal POR and DA did. The Spurs just took what they could get, which if I remeber correctly was a Steve Smith with 1yr? on his contract. I don't think they necessarily wanted Smitty.

NJ got three picks for K-Mart, they wanted Nene, and IMO DEN gave in, in an apparent rush to lock up K-Mart. Didn't NJ threaten to match just to "lock" DEN cap money down for a few weeks during a critical FA period? That explains why NJ got 3 picks. POR won't have that luxury, SAR will be a UFA, not a RFA like Martin was.So I HIGHLY doubt POR would get anywhere NEAR that type of offer for SAR, let alone Damon ir NVE.

Maybe POR could angle a pick out of a S & T for SAR if they are lucky, but POR would still have to take back a player or two that they didn't particularly want, given that the teams projected to have cap space probably won't pursue SAR.

But all of this is wildly hypothetical IMO, you are working under a TON of "IF's" here. IF SAR doesn't just walk, IF every team with cap space isn't interested in signing SAR, IF by that time there won't be some team we are not expecting that WILL have cap space through deadline or other deals, IF SAR is NOT willing to sign with a "playoff" team for the MLE, IF SAR is amiable to work a S & T, IF the team SAR is going to is willing to give up something of VALUE to POR in return..... That does not sound as promising to me as it does to you eblazer.

Nash has hedged his bets for the FEB trading deadline IMO. He has had opportunites to make some decent deals before then, and what did he expect? YES, expiring deals have value, but he may have overvalued the ones he has, they may be TOO large. Especially if he is unwilling to accept any longer term contracts.

Nash better readjust his plan then, he shouldn't be turning his nose at a player with 2 years on his deal IMO, especially if he can get a pick or young player with it. He should also not be afraid of a player with 3yrs on his deal, GIVEN the value of the return (the young player\s or pick\s that would come along wiith the "anchor"). I don't think he should touch deals longer than that though.

It all depends on WHAT he gets back. Obviously, the more garbage you take, the better the sweetner. All I am saying is Nash shouldn't be afraid to take another teams garbage if the players\picks along with it are desirable. POR is over the cap, they have large expiring deals, they are an orginization headed by one of the richest men in the world. Play to your strengths, Isaiah Thomas is doing far more with far little of value. I don't necessarily like the deals Thomas has made per se, but I acknowledge the strategy. Be willing to accept some not so desirable contracts, IF you can also get something that you DO desire in return as well.

Swim against the prevailing current. Trade ALL of our expiring contracts and get whatever young players and\or picks you can, and be willing to take on whatever ballast you have too, the less the weight (in length of contract) the better of course.

I am curious to see what Nash pulls out of his...err...hat at the FEB trade deadline, and if he comes up empty, he will have gambled BIG TIME and busted IMO, and for a GM that is a FIRING expense.

sorry for the long post

Ed O · 01-06-2005, 01:35 AM

I see zero value in a sign-and-trade this summer. I don't see why a team would be more willing to move some value to Portland when SAR's a free agent than they would be now.

I can understand why Portland might want to let Damon, NVE, and SAR simply come off the books, but I will be extremely disappointed if they do so.

One more thing: the worst thing is not, IMO, making a trade for a guy who cannot or will not play. The worst thing is simply to keep the team the same and watch it get worse every year. I'm not saying Portland should make a bad trade, but I think they're in a position where they'll need to take chances over the next year or two to improve enough to get back into the playoffs.

Ed O.

e_blazer1 · 01-06-2005, 09:33 AM

OK, first I think we all agree that Nash should and, in all probability, will take a decent trade for any one of our three expiring contracts. But you have to remember that trades made at the deadline are usually done for one of the following reasons:

1. Teams in the title hunt who are looking for that last piece to put them into serious contention. They're usually looking to unload bit players with expiring contracts and draft picks in exchange for talent. Think Detroit trading crap to Atlanta for Sheed last season. We aren't likely to get the impact player we want in return from a team like that since they want to keep their talent for the playoffs.

2. Crummy teams wanting to get under the salary cap to make a run at a free agent next summer. The value is in the expiring contract; not the player. A team like that may be a spot for a NVE or Damon, but not for a talent like SAR. You're not likely to get equal value in this situation. Nash came as close as you're likely to see last year in the Sheed/Person for SAR, Theo, & Dickau deal. While we can argue that there were PR reasons that made that deal necessary, I doubt that too many believe that the Blazers are a better team now because of that deal.

3. Teams that have impact players who will be unrestricted free agents next summer with little probability of getting value back for them. The Blazers could be said to be in this situation with SAR except that, as I've said before, I think in his case there's a reasonable chance for a sign-and-trade simply because he's not likely to get more than a MLE offer without a sign-and-trade. As far as other teams in a similar situation go, I can't think of any that have a good SG other than the Sonics with Ray Allen and Milwaukee with Redd. The prevailing wisdom is that both of those guys are going to stick with their current teams.

I think it's likely that NVE is moved prior to the deadline, hopefully for a SG. I think the Blazers will try to re-sign Damon at just above the MLE. SAR, especially now with his injury, is more likely to be dealt with next summer.

**Trader Ed** · 01-06-2005, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by <b>Ed O</b>!
I see zero value in a sign-and-trade this summer. I don't see why a team would be more willing to move some value to Portland when SAR's a free agent than they would be now.

I am sure your aware of this, but a scenario might be a team wanting Rahim very badly but only able to pay him the MLE due to them being over the cap. And to follow up on it, Rahim does not want to play for them for the MLE pay scale.... so you have a dilemma.

To solve it you trade Rahim for a decent salary above the MLE he can live with, and getting a decent return on a combination of player(s) from the other team.

But your other comment about it being this summer versus now..... who knows.

Maybe they will have contracts coming off the books that make it more palatable.

OR....

they think they can get Rahim at a summer rate of $8-9 mil versus his $14.6 mil now.... this allows them to trade us fewer player(s) to us with respect to the reduced rate. That would be a good reason to wait until the summer S&T

Kmurph · 01-06-2005, 03:06 PM

To all of you who think POR can get something valuable in a S & T during the summer...

IS this what it has come to? HOPING that a team might throw POR a morsel of talent, iF POR agrees to initiate a S&T to help SAR get paid?

Really...

IS anyone else not particularly encouraged by that thought?

I know I sure as he!! am not. POR has ZERO leverage when SAR is a UFA. Yeah they can say "Go ahead sign for the MLE then" , but in the end if they do that then they have to realize that he may just do that and POR will get NOTHING, I repeat NOTHING for him.

Faced with that prospect, a little morsel is better than nothing.

Teams cave first, not the players....and history shows this to be the case. So I think expecting POR to gain anything remotely substantial for SAR (or Damon, NVE for that matter) in the offseason is a LONG SHOT.

I sincerely hope that I am wrong. This injury to SAR could really hurt POR and in the end, cost Nash his job. He gambled, and injuries occuring are always a gamble, and it appears he is in jeopardy of coming out on the losing end.

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