 |
|
05-02-2008, 01:07 PM
|
#16 (permalink)
|
|
Player
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: salem
Posts: 785
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazerCaravan
What PG in his right mind is going to drive past Roy straight into LMA and Oden? And what PG is going to want to guard Roy straight up? It's like the Outlaw at PF argument -- he's smaller than most PF's, but quicker than them too.
It's worth experimenting to see if Roy can start/finish at PG (and maybe play fewer minutes at PG during the 2nd and 3rd quarters), especially since he already plays PG in the final 6 minutes anyway.
|
like I already said, Roy should start and finish the game at point, while we set the tone in a methodic and precise style of pounding the other teams inside. During the middle of the games we unleash hell with Sergio and Rudy, wear the other teams out, and Roy gets minutes at SF during this stretch to have another ballhandler on the floor, provide an outside threat, and get back into the flow of the game while getting to play a little different/more passive. He could even fill it leading the break. The couple times Sergio got time with Roy this year they played well together and Roy truly got time at the wing. He could use the rest in the middle of the game when he didn't have to dribble around on high screens constantly too, so that he could close out games at his best. He already scores the most at the beginning and end of games anyways (as most stars do).
What we need to compliment him is an elite defender, who can hit open shots, and get out on the break at the 2/3 position.
|
|
|
|
Sponsored Links
|
Advertisement
|
|
05-02-2008, 01:12 PM
|
#17 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portland
Posts: 4,738
|
Re: Roy as PG
Well I am coming around to liking Roy at the PG spot, but it depends on a couple of things.
1) Rudy must come over and be as good as advertised. Also, there are two knocks on Rudy, his defense and his ball handling. Those must not be too big of issues or the experiment will fail.
2) This will mean that Outlaw and Webster must be exchanges for another SF, one that is a good defender, but more importantly has very good handles. I think that a point forward would be very important because Roy is going to need help, at least over the next few seasons.
__________________
..  ..
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 01:13 PM
|
#18 (permalink)
|
|
Player
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 821
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by It's_GO_Time
I prefer to see Roy at SF.
|
Your joking... right?
I would LOVE to put Roy at the PG position full time. Blake backup, roster looks great.
Roy\Blake
Rudy\Jack
Outlaw\Webster\Jones
LMA\Frye\McBob
Oden\Joel\Raef
I really REALLY like that roster.
__________________
DUMP SERGIO, GET KOPONEN!!
Bayless | Roy | Webster | Aldridge | Oden
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 01:23 PM
|
#19 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,648
|
Re: Roy as PG
I'd rather see Roy start at the 3 and Rudy at the 2, then Roy swing over to the 2 when Rudy is out of the game, and then like this year, in crucial times Roy go to the 1 and Rudy at the 2.
That would be perfect, imo.
Quote:
Your joking... right?
I would LOVE to put Roy at the PG position full time. Blake backup, roster looks great.
Roy\Blake
Rudy\Jack
Outlaw\Webster\Jones
LMA\Frye\McBob
Oden\Joel\Raef
I really REALLY like that roster.
|
From what i've seen this year, Outlaw will not be an effective starter as the 5th option. He doesn't contribute without scoring and doesn't score without iso-ing with stops the offensive rhythm. He won't get many iso's playing with the first unit. He is very effective off the bench, even effective at end-game because he is a clutch shooter. I think his role is good.
Of course, if he improves this off-season with playing within' the offense, and contributing without scoring (blocking, assisting, off. rebounds, help defense and so on) then everything changes, as he would be a perfect fit, as he continues to develop his jumper.
Quote:
Roy is an average player when he's tired, not in the middle of things.
He has not displayed the energy to play against box-and-1 for 82 games,
let alone bring the ball up and get everyone involved, too.
|
Thats what i think also. He is already our playmaker... he doesn't really need to dribble it up, call the plays and defend the PG on top of that.
I remember a Miami fan (NewAgeBaller maybe?) talking to us about this situation. He said that this is what Miami was thinking about Dwayne Wade also. Put him at the PG position so he has the ball more and that they can put more scorers at the 2 and 3. Just like what you guys are saying for Roy.
He said they tried it, and it didn't work out. Now Dwayne is a SG (very similary to Roy) and still the playmaker, but he isn't as tired by the 4th Qtr and stuff.
Last edited by MrJayremmie : 05-02-2008 at 01:30 PM.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 01:49 PM
|
#20 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portland
Posts: 4,738
|
Re: Roy as PG
Roy is not a SF. He is not lengthy enough. Sure, there are a lot of SF's in the league that are 6'6", but they have a bigger wingspan than 6'8". They usually have a wingspan of 6'11" or so. Roy would always be undersized. Why take him out of his game by making the game harder on him.
__________________
..  ..
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 02:19 PM
|
#21 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: *3rd* most dangerous city in America
Posts: 3,030
|
Re: Roy as PG
I say we put off this problem for a while. For now, Roy is our SG and Rudy is our 6th man. As somebody pointed out, the history of big PGs since Magic is not good. Penny was great, and they got to the finals with him at PG, but his career was very short. Shaun Livinston's career was even shorter (MAYBE it'll re-start - we'll see). Steve Smith, like Penny, quickly moved over to SG. Same with Jalen Rose. Now, maybe Roy can be PG like Ron Harper was PG on the Bulls/Lakers, but that's a kind of PG who doesn't dominate the ball at all. (Incidentally - who did bring up the ball when Harper and Jordan were the backcourt?)
Anyway, Rudy can be sixth man until he proves himself. And maybe after, a la Ginobili.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 02:23 PM
|
#22 (permalink)
|
|
All-Star
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 5,515
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by GOD
Roy is not a SF. He is not lengthy enough. Sure, there are a lot of SF's in the league that are 6'6", but they have a bigger wingspan than 6'8". They usually have a wingspan of 6'11" or so. Roy would always be undersized. Why take him out of his game by making the game harder on him.
|
Funny because that last line is what I have to say about putting Roy at the PG position. I think it makes the game harder on him.
And I'm not saying Blazers shouldn't run the offense through Roy. But I don't think I'm way off here . . . Nate seems more inclined to have Roy play the SF than PG position.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 02:29 PM
|
#23 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portland
Posts: 4,738
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by It's_GO_Time
Funny because that last line is what I have to say about putting Roy at the PG position. I think it makes the game harder on him.
And I'm not saying Blazers shouldn't run the offense through Roy. But I don't think I'm way off here . . . Nate seems more inclined to have Roy play the SF than PG position.
|
I just don't think it will end up helping. I am not so sure if Roy would be good at PG, but I really think that SF is a bad move. Just think about how defenders get to Roy, it's the bigger defenders that tend to harass him. He does very well against normal or smaller sized defenders. At SF, he willl be swimming upstream every night. Then, on the defensive end Roy would become a liability. Against certain teams or in certain situations Roy can play SF, but on a regular basis I think he would get worn down and his positives would be negated.
__________________
..  ..
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 02:50 PM
|
#24 (permalink)
|
|
All-Star
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Beaverton
Posts: 5,515
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by GOD
I just don't think it will end up helping. I am not so sure if Roy would be good at PG, but I really think that SF is a bad move. Just think about how defenders get to Roy, it's the bigger defenders that tend to harass him. He does very well against normal or smaller sized defenders. At SF, he willl be swimming upstream every night. Then, on the defensive end Roy would become a liability. Against certain teams or in certain situations Roy can play SF, but on a regular basis I think he would get worn down and his positives would be negated.
|
I sort of tuned out at the end of the year (stop with the bandwagon chants) . . . is that what happened to Roy when he started at SF with Webster being out?
I think this whole question can be delayed for a year as meru pointed out . . . Rudy should be fine with coming off the bench next year.
I do think Roy is capable of playing PG. The reason I'm taking my postion is at the end of the year, the games I went to, I noticed a concentrated effort of the Blazers pushing the ball upcourt and finding Aldridge on the fast break. It was mainly Blake pushing the ball running the fast break with Roy on the wing or trailing. I kept trying to watch if Roy would lead the fast break but never saw him do it. I could be wrong on all this . . .as I stated I kind of tuned out at the end of the year.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 03:00 PM
|
#25 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,648
|
Re: Roy as PG
I understand the concerns at SF but i remember vs. Dallas when Jack started at the 2 and Roy at the 3 and we beat them and it was a really good game. Gave me hope of switching Jack out for Rudy and Frye for Oden for our starting line-up next year.
IDK, i think having Roy struggle a little bit more vs. defenders is worth it to be able to play Rudy and Roy together (if Rudy pans out). It would only be while they are both together, remember that when Rudy would go to the Bench (lets say 15 minutes a game) Roy would slide back to the 2, and at crucial times, Roy would play point (so lets say 5 minutes).. so taht is 20 minutes NOT at the 3 spot. Then lets say 10 minutes break for Roy a game, and that leaves around 18 minutes he'd have to play at the 3.
I think the risk would be worth it if Rudy and Roy are dominating, imo. We would just have to try it out and see, just like we should try out Roy playing PG and see how he does, imo.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 03:07 PM
|
#26 (permalink)
|
|
Player
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 670
|
Re: Roy as PG
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrJayremmie
I understand the concerns at SF but i remember vs. Dallas when Jack started at the 2 and Roy at the 3 and we beat them and it was a really good game. Gave me hope of switching Jack out for Rudy and Frye for Oden for our starting line-up next year.
IDK, i think having Roy struggle a little bit more vs. defenders is worth it to be able to play Rudy and Roy together (if Rudy pans out). It would only be while they are both together, remember that when Rudy would go to the Bench (lets say 15 minutes a game) Roy would slide back to the 2, and at crucial times, Roy would play point (so lets say 5 minutes).. so taht is 20 minutes NOT at the 3 spot. Then lets say 10 minutes break for Roy a game, and that leaves around 18 minutes he'd have to play at the 3.
I think the risk would be worth it if Rudy and Roy are dominating, imo. We would just have to try it out and see, just like we should try out Roy playing PG and see how he does, imo.
|
Dallas was a unique match up that is not the norm, they started with a Kidd/Terry/Howard 123 line up, Howard is on the small side for a SF (he's the same height as BRoy, he does have a much greater wingspan that allows him to play SF more effectively) and that's why that particular matchup (that you have used as an example before) is not one I would rely on to make an accurate prediction for Roy's future at the 3.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 03:25 PM
|
#27 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 4,411
|
Re: Roy as PG
Roy at SF is a absolutley terrible idea. He simply isnt a SF, and sucked at SF.
I agree that Roy is going to be a better PG than anyone we could get realistically. In the end, I am starting to also think Roy/Rudy will end up as the starters. The only downside to having Roy at PG is his inability to run the break, but the only PG right now who can really run the break is Jose(Who is such a bad defender, he isnt worth getting). I know he cant lock down speedy PG's like Parker and Ellis, but no one can. Think of how easily we can iso Roy against those guys and post them up all night.
I still think we need to make a run at Hinrich, who is also essentially a combo guard and hence could play SG when Roy played PG, but is also a good PG defender.
|
|
|
05-02-2008, 03:33 PM
|
#28 (permalink)
|
|
Star
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Portland, OR...THE Capital of PC.
Posts: 3,654
| |