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BlazerFan22 · 05-27-2008, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian Necronamous

If I were the Blazers, I'd propose a deal of Kirk Hinrich, Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons for Jarrett Jack, Raef LaFrentz and the 13th pick.

The Bulls get substantial future cap relief to use towards re-signing all their solid young guys (Gordon, Deng, Noah, #1 pick, possibly Thomas, possibly #13 pick). Meanwhile, the Blazers get Hinrich and a couple salary-fillers who are certainly worth a shot. In fact, Sefolosha would probably fit in perfectly on the Blazers, as his length on the defensive end would cause a lot of damage when teamed up with Travis Outlaw and Greg Oden.

Portland Trailblazers
PG: Kirk Hinrich...Steve Blake...Sergio Rodriguez
SG: Brandon Roy...Rudy Fernandez(?)...Thabo Sefolosha
SF: Martell Webster...Travis Outlaw...James Jones(?)
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge...Channing Frye...Cedric Simmons
C: Greg Oden...Joel Przybilla

Chicago Bulls
PG: Derrick Rose...Jarrett Jack
SG: Ben Gordon(?)...Larry Hughes
SF: Luol Deng(?)...Andres Nocioni
PF: Drew Gooden...Tyrus Thomas
C: Joakim Noah...Aaron Gray
Plus, the 13th pick in there somewhere

Ya sounds good to me! I think Kirk Hinrich would do vary well in Portland.

B-Roy · 05-27-2008, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOD

Balian, nobody here is arguing that Rudy is not a good prospect or one of the best players in Europe (notice I say Europe and not "outside the NBA" which should included NCAA). It's just not so clear cut as say that he IS DEFINITELY the best. I think he is the best combo of current ability with potential, but even that could be disputed if you consider some of the younger players. I know that I am not able to adequately follow either the ACB league or the Euroleague since their games are not available to me. So, I really can't say who is best. All I can do is look at threads and articles by people that live in Europe and follow those leagues, and they are far from consensus over who the best player is. I know this because I made a thread in the draft section claiming that Rudy was the best (just like you) and I got hammered by lots of Europeans who totally disagreed. Some said he was top three, some top ten, but none of the Euro posters had him as THE BEST. Not yet at least.

+1

Balian · 05-27-2008, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOD

Balian, nobody here is arguing that Rudy is not a good prospect or one of the best players in Europe (notice I say Europe and not "outside the NBA" which should included NCAA). It's just not so clear cut as say that he IS DEFINITELY the best. I think he is the best combo of current ability with potential, but even that could be disputed if you consider some of the younger players. I know that I am not able to adequately follow either the ACB league or the Euroleague since their games are not available to me. So, I really can't say who is best. All I can do is look at threads and articles by people that live in Europe and follow those leagues, and they are far from consensus over who the best player is. I know this because I made a thread in the draft section claiming that Rudy was the best (just like you) and I got hammered by lots of Europeans who totally disagreed. Some said he was top three, some top ten, but none of the Euro posters had him as THE BEST. Not yet at least.

I could agreed with your assessment. At least its well reasoned out, unlike another meme poster on this forum. Most of the greats you mentioned are in their late 20s or over 30. As far as I am concern, they are not viable for the NBA. Their days have long past. Langdon is a retread and have failed in the NBA. Papaloukas is 31 and now comes off the bench. Siskauskas and Diamantidis are 29/28, respectively. All of the others are at most, Darko clones. Aside from a high 3pt % avg, their statistics are less than compelling. Yes, it is hard to gauge all of them and judge which is the best player in Europe. But at the same time, I am not out of line to say Rudy is the best player outside the NBA, if you go by his body of work and potential. It's a matter of opinion. European fans have a different sensibility in terms of judging talent. No, I do not include players in the NCAA

GOD · 05-27-2008, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balian

I could agreed with your assessment. At least its well reasoned out, unlike another meme poster on this forum. Most of the greats you mentioned are in their late 20s or over 30. As far as I am concern, they are not viable for the NBA. Their days have long past. Langdon is a retread and have failed in the NBA. Papaloukas is 31 and now comes off the bench. Siskauskas and Diamantidis are 29/28, respectively. All of the others are at most, Darko clones. Aside from a high 3pt % avg, their statistics are less than compelling. Yes, it is hard to gauge all of them and judge which is the best player in Europe. But at the same time, I am not out of line to say Rudy is the best player outside the NBA, if you go by his body of work and potential. It's a matter of opinion. European fans have a different sensibility in terms of judging talent. No, I do not include players in the NCAA

Well it looks like we are in agreement. Just remember:
Don't mess with Jesus

or GOD

angrypuppy · 05-28-2008, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian Necronamous

If I were the Blazers, I'd propose a deal of Kirk Hinrich, Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons for Jarrett Jack, Raef LaFrentz and the 13th pick.

The Bulls get substantial future cap relief to use towards re-signing all their solid young guys (Gordon, Deng, Noah, #1 pick, possibly Thomas, possibly #13 pick). Meanwhile, the Blazers get Hinrich and a couple salary-fillers who are certainly worth a shot. In fact, Sefolosha would probably fit in perfectly on the Blazers, as his length on the defensive end would cause a lot of damage when teamed up with Travis Outlaw and Greg Oden.

Portland Trailblazers
PG: Kirk Hinrich...Steve Blake...Sergio Rodriguez
SG: Brandon Roy...Rudy Fernandez(?)...Thabo Sefolosha
SF: Martell Webster...Travis Outlaw...James Jones(?)
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge...Channing Frye...Cedric Simmons
C: Greg Oden...Joel Przybilla

Chicago Bulls
PG: Derrick Rose...Jarrett Jack
SG: Ben Gordon(?)...Larry Hughes
SF: Luol Deng(?)...Andres Nocioni
PF: Drew Gooden...Tyrus Thomas
C: Joakim Noah...Aaron Gray
Plus, the 13th pick in there somewhere

That's all? I would have thought you would have had Chicago throwing in the #1 pick to make it even.

**Dornado** · 05-28-2008, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angrypuppy

That's all? I would have thought you would have had Chicago throwing in the #1 pick to make it even.

I mean, all Chicago is doing in that trade is trading away 2 starters and getting back a bunch of guys that will never see the court... you guys need a SF, right? Why don't we just throw in Luol Deng?

MrJayremmie · 05-28-2008, 10:25 AM

Quote:

I mean, all Chicago is doing in that trade is trading away 2 starters and getting back a bunch of guys that will never see the court... you guys need a SF, right? Why don't we just throw in Luol Deng?

True.

Luol Deng and the #1 pick for LaFrentz, Jack, and #13.

Good trade for both sides, imo. Jack gives you a nice backup PG, LaFrentz gives you cap flexibility, and its a deep draft.

Crimson the Cat · 05-28-2008, 12:36 PM

I like Hinrich, but I'd hate to see Portland overpay to get him. That's a huge risk that I'm betting Pritchard isn't willing to take, not with a player coming off a poor season. This isn't like when we acquired Frye after his down year. More is on the line.

I think some people are undervaluing Lafrentz's expiring contract. This isn't just a throw-in. I would be willing to package his contract with either the #13 or Jack. I wouldn't do both unless they added their 2nd Rounder, Gray, or Sefolosha.

angrypuppy · 05-28-2008, 01:31 PM

Somehow I don't see Chicago doing cartwheels over Raef's expiring contract. They won't be players in the LeBron free agency sweepstakes, unless they let guys like Deng and Gordon walk. Unlike Memphis, Chicago isn't on the verge of financial collapse. While an expiring contract can be useful in acquiring Hinrich, it would need more than an #18 pick and a minor roleplayer to land him.

Crimson the Cat · 05-28-2008, 01:50 PM

Maybe but what Chicago has to contend with is Hinrich stock has fallen. They won't get what they want, which I would think is a starter-caliber player. A lottery pick and a reserve-type guy they can plug into the rotation seems about right.

Personally if I was Chicago, no way I deal him right now unless they can get some sort of inside talent. Hold on to him and play him with Rose. Deal him before the deadline when his stock raises.

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