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**speedythief** · 02-27-2005, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Insiders say Toronto Raptors GM Rob Babcock refused to trade Donyell Marshall or Jalen Rose partly because he was gun-shy about making another mistake like he did getting basically nothing for Vince Carter. One insider says 15 teams, including the Bulls, expressed interest in Marshall.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/banks...pt-banx27.html

Another article mentions that Mark Cuban and the Mavericks were interested in Donyell but the KVH trade led to that interest going away.

Quote:

The Mavs had interest in Donyell Marshall until they were able to secure Van Horn from the Bucks. They kept it all-in-the-family, with Mavs assistant Del Harris working with son Larry, Milwaukee's GM, on making sure that Alan Henderson, part of the Van Horn deal, takes a U-turn back to Big D. The Mavs consider Henderson an integral role player and defender and can't wait to claim him off waivers.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...p-244009c.html

**MonkeyBallZJr** · 02-27-2005, 07:26 PM

Just how credible is the sun? I don't really agree with them saying that Babcock was gun-shy about making another deal. I don't think he is that type of guy, he has been in this business long enough but 15 teams interested in Marshall...hmm. If it is true then I don't see how Babcock couldn't put a deal together. It is either BS, the trades were crap, or Babcock is a bad negotiator, or maybe he feels that we can make the playoffs...unlikely though.

butr · 02-27-2005, 08:15 PM

The problem with the article is the word "interested" and no gauge for how interested. I'm interested in trading Lamond Murray for Ervin Johnson, but it does not mean Minny will return my calls. Interest is irrelevent.

I am begining to look at it this way:

We all know Yell's contract. We know he's a solid player. But is anyone willing to give up significant futures AND matching salaries that don't go beyond next year for a guy who may leave this summer?

If someone were willing, a deal would have been made IMO. You could really point to a pick or young player in the deal and say, "Here is a big part of our future. Thank you Donyell."

However, without that deal on the table, keeping Donyell maintains there is some ambition, wise or not, to make the playoffs. Rather than dealing for help to push for the playoffs, the Raps did a non-move push for the playoffs.

I don't like it. You may not either. It takes courage to do what PHX did last year and explicitly tell your fans this year is a write off.

IMO, short-term gains, dollar-wise, are coming ahead of the actual team-building process. But it is a business after all, this is the balance they have struck. Try to retool or reload or whatever, while still trying to compete.

To me, you can't do both, but this is what you have when the team is owned by profit seekers rather than billionaire egomaniacs.

**HKF** · 02-27-2005, 08:18 PM

I read on slamonline in Lang Whitaker's "Links," that an unnamed Raptor said that Babcock was scared to make another deal, because he didn't want to get fleeced again. Now Whitaker is really well connected in the NBA with players, so it doesn't surprise me that he would sit on a deal, because the last thing he can afford to do, is make two bad trades.

However, buying out Alonzo for nothing, was still the stupidest thing ever. He folded faster than a burning napkin.

butr · 02-27-2005, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HKF

I read on slamonline in Lang Whitaker's "Links," that an unnamed Raptor said that Babcock was scared to make another deal, because he didn't want to get fleeced again. Now Whitaker is really well connected in the NBA with players, so it doesn't surprise me that he would sit on a deal, because the last thing he can afford to do, is make two bad trades.

However, buying out Alonzo for nothing, was still the stupidest thing ever. He folded faster than a burning napkin.

To the first. What does it matter what some Raptor thinks? VC wanted AD, AW and JYD locked up. We all know how that went.

We explored this in my NBA thread. The VC deal was market value like it or not.

As for being afraid. Who becomes afraid to make a trade becaue EW is all of a sudden a whining loser. If those picks all of a sudden become NBA contributors, does that make Rob pumped to make his next trade?

As for Zo. No one seems to comprehend why Rob was over a barrel. You can argue his inclusion in the deal all you want but there is no deal w/o Zo.

Zo's condition enabled him to sit back and say, "I'm injured, I got kidney troubles, no Dr. will OK me to play." You CANNOT suspend him w/o pay because of this. This means he never, never had to play a single game.

With no insurance, the Raps would pay it all no questions asked, no recourse. The buyout saved the organisation 6 million or so and reduced the cap number.

Rob wanted 2 picks, Zo was a cost he was willing to absorb.

TRON · 02-27-2005, 09:24 PM

It seemed as if half the league was interested in Donyell up to the deadline, so I don't know if this is exactly breaking news

the offers probably weren't spectacular, all involving taking on contracts, with no youth or picks...every GM with even a fringe playoff team must have made a low-ball pitch, just to see if they could make Babcock flinch.

It's too bad, I thought teams would have upped the anti for Donyell nearing the deadline.

trick · 02-27-2005, 09:52 PM

off topic, but in relation to babcock being scared because of the vince deal, you look at what teams gave up for webber and bdiddy and that alone should put some justification on the dec. 17 deal.

imo, it's clear that the way we value players is totally off-base to how the GM's value the players.

mavhaz · 02-28-2005, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trick

off topic, but in relation to babcock being scared because of the vince deal, you look at what teams gave up for webber and bdiddy and that alone should put some justification on the dec. 17 deal.

imo, it's clear that the way we value players is totally off-base to how the GM's value the players.

Well Said !!!

charlz · 02-28-2005, 12:50 PM

well what is wrong with going for it?

if no one was offering draft pics - then win now.

4.5 games back 25 games to go....

I was in favor of tanking it but even if toronto does make the PO's by some miracle they will still get Philly's lotter pick.

butr · 02-28-2005, 04:27 PM

You know, I hope the Raps win now too. I want Shelden no matter where we pick. The higher we are the more many would ***** about taking a player like him too high (like Hoffa).

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