The Mad Viking

A few things on Joey Graham.

There are things to like, and things to be concerned about.

LIKE:
Attitude = A+
Athleticism = A+
Free Throw Shooting = A+

Ability to finish = A
Shooting efficiency = A
Shooting form = C

On the ball defence = B

Rebounding = C

Ball Handling = D

Shot Blocking = F
Ball Hawking = D

Size = D

Here is the scoop. He is a well-coached Senior from a major program who has already got his adult body. He is already 23 years old. Upside is a question.

Despite terrific athleticism, he was not a particularly productive player in college. It is extremely unlikely that he will be more productive in the NBA. So the Shawn Marion comparison is way off base. Graham will never average 8 rebounds a game; he will never get half the steals or blocks that Marion gets.

Graham is 6-5 1/4" in socks, 6-6 1/2" in shoes, with a 6-8 wingspan. He is the size of a SG. He has the skillset of a PF.

I think he may acquire a role not unlike Bruce Bowen. A hard working guy willing to do unpleasant, thankless tasks that help the team win, w/o demanding a lot of ball time or coddling.

And that is something the Raptors could certainly use.

He will never be a first option guy, and it's very unlikely he will ever be a 2nd option guy offensively. He will never be a shooting specialist. Guys like that don't score a lot. He might end up pitching in 10 to 12 ppg; and IF given minutes/touches, he might just do that as a rookie.

Nothing wrong with that in a 16th pick.

__________________
With the first pick in the 2010 draft, the ... select, Ricard Rubio of Spain.

Minstrel: There's no such thing as a "proven loser." Teams win and lose, not individuals.

speedythief

I think he could potentially be alot like another player on our team, Eric Williams. Think of an explosive Eric Williams with better shooting technique.

FanOfAll8472

Who cares about shooting form? Ray Allen and Reggie Miller get A-/B+ shooting form, but hell, they go in just about everytime. Rashad McCants has about as close to an A+ shooting form as you can get, but we don't know if he's going to tear up the league yet. Then you have the Shawn Marion's, Josh Childress's, and Tayshaun Prince's. Ugly, but they go in.

I would rate on-ball defense a little higher and same with size. He maybe only 6'6", but he is very stout.

bigbabyjesus

Ron Artest, baby.

All of the weaknesses that Artest has, are mostly also named when people talk about Graham. And when you talk about strengths for Joey; its man to man defense, mid range game, rebounding, toughness, and post game.. all of the things people relate to Artest. Both dont have the best skill set, but are physical specimens that are tough as nails.

Sporty G

I want a Graham authentic.

The Mad Viking

Artest was a way better ball handler in college, with more of an outside shooting game, too. He proved to be competent in the NBA with these skills as well. Artest was a major ballhawk in college and the NBA.

Joey Graham cannot be projected to have these Artest skills. OTOH, Joey has intensity without insanity.

__________________
With the first pick in the 2010 draft, the ... select, Ricard Rubio of Spain.

Minstrel: There's no such thing as a "proven loser." Teams win and lose, not individuals.

drlove_playa

Ray Allen has text book shooting form. One of the best in the NBA for sure.

FanOfAll8472

It's not down to the last word of the book. It's close (which is why I said A-), but not the most exact out there. That's my point though, shooting form isn't all that important; there are bad habits, i.e., letting the elbow stick out, but it's not the end all factor.

seifer0406

I don't agree with some of your ratings. I think it's a bit too early to give him a A+ in attitude before he actually plays a month or two in the league. For things like shot blocking, the guy is a shooting guard / small forward, I don't see how you can give him a F or even include that category in his rating. As for his size, I wouldn't say at 6-6 220 he would be undersized to guard the opposing swingman. The raptors didn't draft him to score, they drafted him for defensive purposes, and he has great size just to do that.

You lefted out some important ratings that actually matters. Such as his shooting range, ability to drive and get to the line, basketball IQ as how smart he will be on offense/defense, his ability to steal, his strength and whether he can guard bigger players or post up smaller players, is he a clutch performer? As for his shooting form, peja has an ugly form, I don't see anyone criticizing him.

bigbabyjesus

Artest was a decent ball handler; nothing special in college. He had good court vision and passing skills, but when he came into the league, his ballhandling skills were average at best. So yes he does have the advantage over Joey in terms of court vision but not ballhandling so much. He was more of an outside shooter, but again; wasn't anything special. I don't see why Joey can't improve on these aspects of his game quickly with his work ethic.

He isn't as skilled as Artest was coming out of college, but does have the athleticism and the work ethic to take him above Artest and improve those things in his game because; its nothing major.

Nitestalker

One Question to all Raptors and Pacers fan....is he better then Granger?
i'm sorry to say i have not watched any of them play and therefore cant say much about their potential or anything else other then through scouting reports which are sometimes not all that accurate....so i'm kinda curious as to know which one will turn out to be the better player...i've heard all sorts of good things about Granger and how he was such a steal since he had like top ten talent or sumthing of that sort but how cum the Raptors drafted Graham over him and was being praised for it? Is Graham more nba ready or better rebounder or sumthing? thx

The Mad Viking

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a player with a better attitude in the NBA or anywhere.

He does not block shots. Rashad McCants is a much better shot blocker, and he is a smallish 2-guard. Joey played PF in college, so for the foreseeable future he is a SF. Who does not block shots.

His shooting range is very good, if he has time and space to get his shot off. He tends not to shoot contested shots from outside, which is a good thing, IMO. But it does mean that you won't be looking to him for a trey in the dying seconds of a close game. He's not that kind of an outside shooter.

I rated him D as a ballhawk - that is stealing ability. That might be a generous rating. He really does not steal very much at all.

He has not shown signs of breaking down a player from the wing, but that was not his role. He has the athleticism to do so, but has not demonstrated the skillset. I think this will come very quickly.

He will not be guarded by smaller players, but he can post up guys who are bigger than him. He is very strong inside, and can finish despite being hacked and held.

He's pretty good at getting to the stripe.

His BB IQ seems quite average. He is not particularly good at creating offensively, and doesn't seem to see the floor very well. Defensively, he is good defending on the ball but tends to lose sight of other things going on. He tends to lock in on his man even when his check doesn't have the ball, and will lose sight of the ball. Not a strong help defender, and doesn't play in the passing lanes.

Still, there are plenty of things to like.

__________________
With the first pick in the 2010 draft, the ... select, Ricard Rubio of Spain.

Minstrel: There's no such thing as a "proven loser." Teams win and lose, not individuals.

cram

This may sound ridiculous to some, but i see him as a better-shooting JYD. He may not get the same rebounds, though i think he'll do better in the NBA than college b/c he'll be going against SF's, and won't be the first option on offense.