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NeoSamurai · 11-14-2006, 11:02 PM

its good to see Bosh step up and get into Andrea...my concern with Andrea isnt him being ostricized by his teammates but rather the quality of coaching that he'll get...they need a big mentor to help him learn some defense full time on the staff like what LA is doing with Bynum having Kareem help him out everyday...at least Dirk had Nelly and his good staff with guys like Del Harris to help him out...our staff isnt as experienced nor as good....

Mr_B · 11-14-2006, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by firstrounder

For those that just saw that, theres your televised evidence. Bosh is laying into Bargnani in the Golden State game.

Thats exactly what I saw happen at the game vs Atlanta.

I saw in the 3rd where Bargs committed a stupid foul and Chris ran up to him and snapped he was pissed that was no leadership on Chris part that was frustration

Gilgamesh · 11-15-2006, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SickGame

A) Dirk's draft class was much better than Bargnani's
B) The European explosion/expansion wasn't at full effect like it is today, therefore drafting a European player back then was much more obscure and riskier, therefore harder to make him a higher pick than he was.

Dirk was BRUTAL in his first year. Anyone who though that Bargnani was going to be an effective starter in his first year had to be out of their mind. It wasn't like he was lighting up the Italian League when he was abroad. The kid is an obvious project and always was going to be.
And I'm not sure why everyone is panicking. Look at this year's draft, it isn't like the rookies are lighting up either. Morrison and Roy are the only ones averaging over 10 points (11.8 and 11.6 respectively) and no one is having a major impact on their teams except for Roy (whom we all knew was the most NBA ready player in the draft, yet the one that had the least potential out of the lottery picks).
On top of this, all these players are getting major minutes (18-25 min) either because of team injuries or the lack of depth on the team. Unfortunately for Barganani, not only are the Raptors deep and there are no injuries, he has to adjust to the game meaning that he picks up quick fouls that he's not used to.
I really don't understand why everyone is jumping the gun after 6 games. Let's see how he does after he gets 3-4 games of major burn.

Bargs is definitely a project. I said that before he got drafted when Barg fanboys were everywhere comparing him to Sabonis which was ridiculous.

Anyways, it's too early to call Bargs a bust. Way to early. Give him two years. Of course every fan is always scared of the supposed Euro bust curse especially with what happened to Darko and Skita but we have to keep optimistic. Nobody thought Dirk would become the player he is now after the rookie year he had but comparing Bargs to Dirk is a tall measuring stick. Dirk is an anomaly just like Lebron is an anomaly for HS players. People forget that Dirk finished his rookie season very strong. The guy who said March is right. Let's see how is doing by then because that will probably give us a better projection for how he will do in his 2nd year.

As for this feud. I don't get it. We got all over Carter for his lack of leadership and passion now we are scared that Bosh is showing some? Whining to the coach ust shows that Bosh is still young and still needs to mature but getting in the face of Bargs is something I expect from a leader. Of course that tactic might backfire and we obviously don't want a MJ/Kwame situation because we saw how that turned out. But that situation went overboard off the court and all the way into the media. When that happens then I would be really worried. The Raps are Bosh's team and will be his for a long time. This year's draft class was weak. Taking a risk on a player whose value is all about his potential was a risky pick but it's better to take a risky pick in a weak draft class than in a strong draft class.

MagnusPinus · 11-15-2006, 02:07 AM

Bosh has only to shut up.. Defensively he is no better than Mago..He has gained credit offensively so he can make the boss.. If MAgo had the minutes of Bosh and the confidence too he could score a lot..Defensively he is no bad at all..I'd say he is ahead Bosh..u commits so many stupid mistakes.

MagnusPinus · 11-15-2006, 02:07 AM

Bosh has only to shut up.. Defensively he is no better than Mago..He has gained credit offensively so he can make the boss.. If MAgo had the minutes of Bosh and the confidence too he could score a lot..Defensively he is no bad at all..I'd say he is ahead Bosh..who commits so many stupid mistakes.

**speedythief** · 11-15-2006, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_B

I saw in the 3rd where Bargs committed a stupid foul and Chris ran up to him and snapped he was pissed that was no leadership on Chris part that was frustration

Pretty silly thing to say.

Of course Bosh was frustrated. Why else would he say anything?

**speedythief** · 11-15-2006, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagnusPinus

Bosh has only to shut up.. Defensively he is no better than Mago..He has gained credit offensively so he can make the boss.. If MAgo had the minutes of Bosh and the confidence too he could score a lot..Defensively he is no bad at all..I'd say he is ahead Bosh..who commits so many stupid mistakes.

Little biased, maybe?

Bosh is an All-Star, in case you hadn't noticed. He's also the team captain. It's his job to make sure his teammates are putting in the effort.

Bargnani let Biedrins go over him literally four times in a row. If he's "ahead of Bosh" he wasn't showing it.

lucky777s · 11-15-2006, 07:01 AM

Yeah, I don't think you can say Bargs is ahead of Bosh defensively right now. Maybe he is ahead of the rookie Chris Bosh. Bosh has been a horrible defender up until this summer when he got more serious about D with the Olympic team. Bosh has definitely stepped up his play on that end this year.

I dont' mind Bosh calling out poor play by his teammates as long as he is performing at a high level. His turnovers were almost as bad as Barg's defensive lapses.

At least Bosh went back to Bargs after the next timeout and encouraged the rook again, letting him know that he needs the kid and just wants him to improve. That was a strong leadership move.

The Mad Viking · 11-15-2006, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DWADE4

barnani another hoffa? I dont think so.

Barnani another Nikoloz Tskitishvili? Most probably.

Those Dirk and Pau compairsons were stupid. When those two game in the league they didnt look confused, and lost on the court.

Revisionist history. Dirk played worse his entire rookie season than Bargnani has so far...

If Bargnani was the only post option on a terrible team, he would average 20 and 9 for the season as a rookie. You can see that if you watch. He can fill it up. Pau's situation was entirely different than Bargnani's.

The Mad Viking · 11-15-2006, 07:47 AM

Lookit, Bargnani is going to be great, and I can't believe people can't see it.

Yes he has played badly in stretches. He is not getting any consistent burn in the rotation, and he apparently is not allowed to make rookie mistakes without being yelled at.

Despite all this, if you take his 72 minutes and project it into say, two games at starters minutes, he would be averaging 16.5ppg 7.5 rpg and 1.5 bpg. He has already surpassed the point of any comparisons to Hoffa or Skita, thank you very much.

When he gets more experience under his belt, and a more consistent spot in the rotation, he will be much more productive.

Yelling at someone on the court almost never works. If they aren't trying, maybe. But if they know the made a mistake, it doesn't help. And if they don't know what mistake they made, it doesn't help.

JuniorNoboa · 11-15-2006, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagnusPinus

Bosh has only to shut up.. Defensively he is no better than Mago..He has gained credit offensively so he can make the boss.. If MAgo had the minutes of Bosh and the confidence too he could score a lot..Defensively he is no bad at all..I'd say he is ahead Bosh..who commits so many stupid mistakes.

Take off the red, white and green goggles.

Victor Page · 11-15-2006, 08:40 AM

Dirk STILL looks lost defensively, I can't imagine what he looked like as a rookie.

Anyway, Bargnani has shown that he can put the ball in the hoop. He's only 19 or 20 so he's bound to improve and get stronger. He would have to be chronically lazy not to do so.

I don't see any other rookies lighting it up this year - this buys Margo some time to get his game
together. I'm going to call him Margo until his defense improves - nevertheless, I think he'll come around.

mysteral · 11-15-2006, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Mad Viking

If Bargnani was the only post option on a terrible team, he would average 20 and 9 for the season as a rookie.

The Raptors are not a terrible team right now ???

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