Thread Tools

Display Modes

SickGame · 01-05-2008, 10:16 AM

Over the past two seasons, we have seen alot of T.J. bashing on these boards. Continous uproar about his wild play, his supposed selfish ball-hogging during stretches of the game combined with the stable and spread out game of Calderon made fans continously ask for a T.J. trade or Calderon starting and some sighing at the extent of T.J's contract/the possibility that we chose the wrong point guard.

Now T.J. has been out for a few weeks and now the team has been anything but unspectacular. They lose games they should be winning, they get blown out by the contenders when at a time, during T.J.'s presence, games were close. The San Antonio steal wasn't quite notable consider their x-factor, Ginobli, was missing.

It has just come to visible attention how much T.J. Ford's presence changes the game, gives this team an identity and wills the team to wins. He is, in definition, a winner. During stretches of the game when the team is cold and doubles are being run at Bosh, T.J. is the team's sole creator due to his athleticism, quickness and I.Q. Don't get me wrong, Calderon has a few positive attributes over T.J., but Calderon isn't the player that can play 30+ minutes and make this team win on a continous basis (like a Chris Paul) through his ability to create and break a defense down.

On a sidenote, this post came to be inspired by the latest murmurs that Milwaukee is being blown up. There is a team that gave up on T.J., and the team has achieved close to nothing with a pretty talented line-up since Ford left, who had taken that team to the playoffs.

I, for one, cannot wait for T.J.'s return and firmly believe that this team will only reach higher pastures with his presence in the line-up as a starter with major minutes, and not through Calderon, who is a solid point-guard but not the guy you want running the team for 30+ minutes.

RX · 01-05-2008, 11:11 AM

The team needs TJ, he is the only Raptor who can create his own shot whenever he wants...and its blatently obvious that there is no backup PG behind either of them...right now...the moment Martin or Dixon takes the point...the Raps start losing and its a slippery slope until Calderon gets back in.

The prob with the Raps as I see it is that our starters are just average...however...our bench is just as good as the starters...that's how we won games last year, and its how we won games earlier this year. Basically the starters are just good enough to hang with most teams, sometimes they get a lead, sometimes they get behind...but once both teams go to the benches our bench is just as good as our starters (with TJ and Jose at point)...meaning there is no dropoff in production and we are able to comeback or build up a lead on the other teams scrubs. Thats how we win games...purely on depth...but that depth relies on having a solid PG off the bench...which leads me to the next point....GET RID OF DERRICK MARTIN...we need someone out there that can at least defend scrubs

seifer0406 · 01-05-2008, 11:24 AM

I think TJ's importance has been magnified by the lack of backup PG. If Calderon was out today, we would run into the same problem with Martin and Dixon backing up TJ.

People can talk about the negatives of TJ's game all they want, but the fact is that his game contains many things that the Raptors currently lack.

southeasy · 01-05-2008, 02:58 PM

we are missing TJ we are missing Jorge.

it's what it is, tj hate or not, he brings something to the team we don't have without him.

**bigbabyjesus** · 01-05-2008, 03:36 PM

we are really missing tj.

him and calderon compliment each other very well. tj does a lot of things jose can not.. and vice versa.

we need them both to succeed imo.

**madman** · 01-05-2008, 05:50 PM

i co-sign with everything you said very good points

**ballocks** · 01-05-2008, 09:47 PM

i'm sitting on the fence... sort of. to me, while it's clear the raptors have been anything but impressive since the horford incident, i also firmly believe that they cannot attribute their total struggles to the players missing (tj ford, jorge garbajosa). that's the tempting thing to do since it would allow us all to feel better about the team, but that's also what mediocre teams do- and as long as they/we do that, imo, they/we will remain mediocre (or worse).

there are obviously things that tj does well but i've said it all along: this team has been playing this way (way up and way down) since well before tj ford got hurt. for example, anyone remember the blowout to milwaukee? tj ford was there. in fact, those kinds of blowouts have begun to characterize the raptors; they did not just start with one injury to an important piece.

i'll bring another team into my argument: the toronto blue jays. when it comes to speaking publicly, they will never let you believe that they're simply not good enough- their injuries are always a more convenient excuse. the problem arises when you begin to believe what you're saying (as i think the blue jays have): as long as you do that, you fail to allow yourself to address problems and, as a result, fail to improve.

sam mitchell, chris bosh, bryan colangelo and the rest will use tj ford's absence as an excuse whenever they are given the opportunity- after all, it causes them less hurt to maintain that tj ford's injury is the problem here as opposed to the way the team is built. you actually see it all the time in sports- failing teams unable (scared?) to identify what plagues them. think 2003 toronto raptors: it was always the injuries, wasn't it? that was the only thing holding them back from becoming part of the elite. turns out that that team never got healthy, never became elite (even with the addition of current all-star chris bosh to the group) so the proof is in the pudding, imo: injuries were not the problem then; that team was simply not good enough.

did they have to fail for three or four seasons before they came to that realization? i mean, i would rather not do that with the team we have today. that's just wasting time. with or without tj ford, there is a missing piece, whether it would come in the form of another player or intangible. but i can't hold it back any longer- we are not good enough, imo. the sooner we do something to change our look the better. we will inevitably have to do it. i'd rather do it now and save some time.

to be clear, tj ford's injury has not helped the team, per se (nor has jorge garbajosa's). but it is not the key reason why we struggle as mightily as we do to take the next step, either. "we're young." well, we're not even that young anymore. with the exception of bargnani, the rest of our foundation is pretty experienced. moon's young, ok, but we don't rely on him to win us games, and parker, nesterovic, delfino and kapono more than offset that one youthful starter. what's more, teams like portland are far younger, quite frankly, and yet have managed to turn the corner (in a superior conference, no less) while we continue to wait to turn the same corner.

it's a plague that may be eating us alive. i noticed it in the playoffs last year. all this talk about, "putting on a good show, it's our first time here, we're just learning" drove me up the wall. that's not the way champions are built- by putting it (success) off for later. do you really have to lose in order to learn how to win? effectively, we're doing the same thing here- we're putting it off for later. why? and why did we feel the need to lose to the nets last may? we're clearly superior to them now, so what happened? would that not imply that we were superior to them then? i mean, it wasn't that long ago at all. our approach is just the approach of, imo, a team that is scared to win.

it's been that way with or without tj ford, with or without jorge garbajosa, and is clearly not going away by itself. it's a problem that needs to be addressed as soon as possible, imo. i hope it will be because what we have today is not the formula, imo.

peace

narrator · 01-05-2008, 11:17 PM

Ford's important mainly because the Raptors operate on a two PG system. Ford and Calderon are complimentary players. This is what drives the Raptors. Missing a co-pilot is damaging. But I don't see that as the main problem. What the Raptors need - rebounding - is hard to find. They need to find someone athletic enough to keep up and big enough to battle. Humphries can keep up and Nesterovic can battle but they absolutely cannot be on the floor at the same time. The Raptors also need a more reliable third PG. Martin is awful and Dixon isn't a PG.

Bosh needs to be more aggressive. Bargnani was impressive with his aggression against the Pistons. They both need to drive more. The Raptors, as a team, need more free throws. Parker couldn't hit the ocean from the beach so he should've driven. But he didn't. The team needs to create its own luck. The talent is there. Now they need the will.

SkywalkerAC · 01-06-2008, 02:10 AM

With Ford at full strength and the Raps on their game, which will hopefully still happen this season, are we really that far off from where we need to be at this stage of our development? We certainly haven't hit any kind of stride yet, which is alarming and relieving. Yet we're well positioned to stay avoid a 1st round playoff matchup with Detroit and Boston and beyond that, anything can happen. I still like our team composition but we have some issues that can be easily addressed through the draft, free agency, and trades while Bosh and Bargnani actually get some experience playing together (anyone have a stat on that? people forget how infantile their playing relationship is).

All of that becomes pretty meaningless without having TJ Ford. I just don't see it. Without TJ, I would see this core doomed for mediocrity and might prefer a trip to the lottery but right now I have to hope that TJ can come back and this group can start playing the kind of ball I had imagined.

TJ
Delfino
Moon
Bosh
Bargnani

The upside is there. Championship caliber upside. But right now we just need to be patient and pray that our team gets its identity back.

lucky777s · 01-06-2008, 06:28 AM

I would say that the Raptors are not missing TJ Ford specifically, but that the are missing having a top quality 2nd PG. And this has been a very tough schedule after the Portland/Seattle games that we should have won. Our shooting has been horrible and its been Calderon/Bosh keeping us in games until Bargs started playing well. We looked just as bad with TJ in the lineup earlier in the season and got blown out many times.

The production we got from a 2 PG system was unbelievable. Just guessing the numbers would average 25ppg, 15apg, 8rpg. Neither one of the 2 PGs by themselves can consistently give us that.

I would say that the Raps looked much worse when Bargnani was struggling than they have without TJ. Our team TO's are down without TJ in the lineup which is keeping us in games where we shoot only 40%. The ideal scenario for me would be to bring TJ back as the backup PG. Let him bring that energy off the bench to spark us when we need it. And he may be open to that now given how scared he was by this injury. Keep his minutes down and try to keep him healthy. Look for a new second guard when his contract comes up unless he takes a decent discount

seifer0406 · 01-06-2008, 06:54 AM

The reason that we are shooting so poorly may have something to do with TJ being out as well. A big part of our offense relies on TJ penetrating into the paint and kicking the ball out to our many shooters. Calderon does this primarily using the pick and roll. Not saying that either way is more effective, but without TJ, it allows our opponents to lock in on what the Raptors are trying to do on offense and limit our open shot opportunities. When you run that pick and roll every single possession, it does get less effective as the game goes on.

When TJ comes back, I don't think he would ask for reduced minutes. I mean, he was playing about 28 minutes a game as a starter. The risk of getting injured playing 15-20 minutes a game isn't that much different from playing 28 minutes a game. I would have him play the backup role and see how he reacts. If he can be a good backup, then all is well, if not, we might still have to start him if he can't adjust to being the 6th man of our team. Calderon has already proven that he can fill the backup role to perfection. Rather than having a good starter and a bad backup, I rather have a good starter and a good backup.

lucky777s · 01-06-2008, 07:13 AM

I don't think there have been more shots contested than normal, except against the top defensive teams like BOS and SAS who really pressure the perimeter. But I would agree that our offense is painfully predictable under Sam and having TJ just 'freelance' to mix it up at times is good. He just does it too much and quite often gets himself into bad spots.

Having 2 small guards means you can't post them up ever which also limits some options on O. But I think it is more the lack of slashing wings who finish strong at the hoop that allows team to focus on taking away the 3 ball more without running up the FTA's. We rarely even run simple backdoor cuts for easy layups. Everything is outside the lane which is exactly where defenses want you.

Moon seems reluctant to attack off the dribble and has turned the ball over quite a bit when he tries. I really wanted to see some Graham on this road trip with Delfino and Moon in slumps and playing some physical wings. Parker doesn't seem to know what his role is anymore, or is struggling for other reasons.

Its so hard to say what is wrong with the Raps right now because they are really a totally different team than last year. Garbo and Rasho out of the starting lineup. MoP gone from the bench. Now TJ out most of the year. That's 4 of our top 8 gone. We replace Mo with 3 guys (Moon, Delfino, and Kap) who each do one thing better than Mo but also have weaker areas than MoP.

The team has not looked as exciting on O this year. There is some type of chemistry or IQ issue that we can't see out there.

Thread Tools Display Modes

Thread Tools

Display Modes