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**ballocks** · 05-09-2008, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seifer0406

Kind of funny how the media went berserk on TJ when he said that he couldn't picture himself coming off the bench for the next 3 years. Now that Calderon declares that he wants to start, nobody is criticizing him for not being "team first."

People need to understand that everyone in the NBA wants to play more minutes. The only difference that separates those who are considered "selfish" from the "unselfish" ones is whether or not the player feel that the team has a better chance to win with him playing those minutes. For TJ it often felt like as if people just assume that he wants to play for the sake of himself, and no one really considers that perhaps he feels that he can help the team more by playing. Frankly this really isn't that fair and might not be accurate. It would be a shame if some team turns down Colangelo's trade offer of TJ Ford simply because of this "selfish" label that is perhaps wrongfully placed on TJ.

that's a good point. the thing is (and this is where it gets complicated) i think it always goes beyond words- in this case, to calderon's benefit and tj's detriment.

for me, tj's body language spoke louder than the words that came out of his mouth. when he said he wanted to start, we heard the emotion in his voice- and i think it's the emotion that we found most revealing, it's the emotion that we judged. in other words, we heard the way he said what he said- and that probably changed how we felt about the things he said.

conversely, with calderon, something tells me that what he was trying to say in his blog was lost in translation. i may be wrong, but i'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. something tells me that he may have been responding to the critics who said he doesn't want to start, that he doesn't want to lead. if he had said what he wrote in an interview that was broadcasted on the radio or tv, i think it would have come across a little differently.

even so, your point is well taken. it's clear that we're willing to give calderon the benefit of the doubt and far more reluctant to give it to tj. but i don't think that's necessarily unfair. i think it's just the result of the reputations they've built for themselves over their time in toronto. actions always speak louder than words.

peace

pac4eva5 · 05-09-2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfindlay10

Kleiza has great size at the 3 spot, 6'8" 245....that is the type of 3 man we need. This is a solid deal, although I would hate to see Jose go. Would a deal of Ford and Kapono get it done? Denver was always looking to improve their 3 point game.

i LOVE ford but he just doesnt fit our team, especially if we keep iverson :throwup:

seifer0406 · 05-09-2008, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ballocks

even so, your point is well taken. it's clear that we're willing to give calderon the benefit of the doubt and far more reluctant to give it to tj. but i don't think that's necessarily unfair. i think it's just the result of the reputations they've built for themselves over their time in toronto. actions always speak louder than words.

peace

I don't know, would people feel the same way about TJ if he doesn't have the big injury risk? It is true that some of TJ's body language may send a negative vibe to Raptor fans, but that vibe is often greatly magnified in the eyes of people who wanted him gone before these incidents. It is really unfortunate because at the end of the day, he is still an asset of the team since we did sign him to that big contract. With the media and the fans unnecessarily pushing TJ's stock even lower, it really isn't going to help Colangelo gain any leverage in any trade talk that he may engage this summer.

SkywalkerAC · 05-10-2008, 01:09 AM

BC could still very well trade Jose. he has an extremely tough decision ahead of him. there will be offers made on both of them. both are starting point guards and there will always be a demand. who can come up with the best offer?

i was cautiously optimistic that we could keep both but we all know it's not going to happen.

here's where BC really earns his money. he's forced into a tough decision that will define his reign in toronto. i have faith in him as a business man and he's in a position of power so I have confidence it will turn out in our favour.

tj's value is not dimished, nor is calderon's. both guys have shown what they can do in the nba. calderon's shooting percentage and assist to TO were ridiculous; and TJ's were among the best in the league as well.

with a team of finishers, TJ would be one of the best assist men in the nba. of that i have no doubt. if someone want to run a freelance PG-oriented offense and has the finishers to do it, TJ is the guy for you.

TJ and Rasho to the Oklahoma Sonics

Ridnour, Wilcox, Donyell, and the 24th pick to the Raps.

SkywalkerAC · 05-10-2008, 01:10 AM

32nd and 43rd picks could also be interesting in a deep draft.

pac4eva5 · 05-10-2008, 03:01 AM

didnt the raps have the best 3 point shooting team in the L? i cant see jose getting much better than he was this season, even with more minutes. isnt he already 27? not exactly young. im thinking somebody might pull a rashard lewis deal for him. i hope not tho...

seifer0406 · 05-10-2008, 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pac4eva5

didnt the raps have the best 3 point shooting team in the L? i cant see jose getting much better than he was this season, even with more minutes. isnt he already 27? not exactly young. im thinking somebody might pull a rashard lewis deal for him. i hope not tho...

Calderon turns 27 in September, so he isn't really that young. He's just entering his prime though and I would expect another 5-6 years of good basketball for him, which is about the length of his next contract.

**superdude211** · 05-16-2008, 09:00 AM

Why Raps should trade Calderon

Quote:

There is no market for T.J. Ford, while teams privately covet Jose Calderon, who would make both a playing and cultural fit in markets such as Miami and Los Angeles. Not that the Raptors needed further evidence of the growing divide at the point, but quotes attributed to Calderon highlight a rift with Ford. "I would like to start and that's the most important thing,'' Calderon is quoted as saying in yesterday's edition of the Spanish daily sports newspaper El Mundo Deportivo, a sentiment he first shared with visitors to his website. But now comes the kicker. Continued Calderon in the article: "I've been two years with him but I don't know if I could be another year because things would have to change." Barring a complete personality makeover by Ford, which doesn't seem likely, nothing can change in Raptorland. That is why a change in scenery for Calderon is best for all parties concerned.

http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/nba

Clips Maggette to Toronto?

Quote:

That is why a change in scenery for Jose Calderon is best for all parties concerned. People have been clamouring for a player such as Corey Maggette of the Los Angeles Clippers, an athletic wing who is capable of averaging 20 a night and attacking the rim. The Clippers can use a point guard and Calderon's family probably wouldn't object to southern California's warm climate. It's just one of many possibilities to ponder as July 1 approaches and as the Raptors try to solve their mess at the point position

http://msn.foxsports.com/rumors

**superdude211** · 05-16-2008, 09:04 AM

It looks like there is more and more hype being built around a Jose Calderon trade. I think among most Raptor fans that Jose Calerdon is the proffered player to keep . But if the Raptors can get a player like Maggette or Artest, should the Raps pull the trigger on such a deal

PG: Ford
SG: Parker
SF: Maggette
PF: Bosh
C: Bargnani

That lines up is a definite improvement over what the Raptors have now

**OneBadLT123** · 05-16-2008, 10:12 AM

If Jose wants to start, he should come to Houston. We will welcome him with open arms.

Yeah I know, I am still dreaming. We just really need him...

changv10 · 05-16-2008, 10:18 AM

I think there is a good market for TJ Ford. The media makes him a worst player than he really is. I prefer Calderon too, but Ford is a good point guard with great speed, can create his own shot, and can involve others. I like Calderon for being a better distributor and shooter. Ford is the better creator and defender (stealing, quick hands wise).

I like the idea of Ford for Artest or Ford for Maggette.

But how about this idea with New York,
Ford+Nesterovic+Graham for Curry+Crawford

This gets us a solid center, tough player that will improve our weakest position. TJ is the point guard that D'Antoni wants. Breaking out Randolph and Curry will do good for the Knicks.

Calderon / Ukic
Crawford / Parker
Moon / Kapono
Bosh / Garbajosa
Curry / Bargnani

Mr_B · 05-16-2008, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by changv10

I think there is a good market for TJ Ford. The media makes him a worst player than he really is. I prefer Calderon too, but Ford is a good point guard with great speed, can create his own shot, and can involve others. I like Calderon for being a better distributor and shooter. Ford is the better creator and defender (stealing, quick hands wise).

I like the idea of Ford for Artest or Ford for Maggette.

But how about this idea with New York,
Ford+Nesterovic+Graham for Curry+Crawford

This gets us a solid center, tough player that will improve our weakest position. TJ is the point guard that D'Antoni wants. Breaking out Randolph and Curry will do good for the Knicks.

Calderon / Ukic
Crawford / Parker
Moon / Kapono
Bosh / Garbajosa
Curry / Bargnani

BC does not believe in trading within the division

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