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Old 03-20-2019, 06:48 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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So you are basically saying that in your opinion it would be ok to just barrell through a guy and for said guy to move so that his opponent has to barrel through him?

Let's keep going and eliminate illegal picks and running through picks.

After that, since blocks are allowed, bumping the guy with the ball is allowed too.

Lastly, let's put pads on the players and give them points for running to the other end of the court instead of having to put it through the basket.
As long as you don't allow anyone to hit the point guard after he's dished the ball or if he goes into a slide feet first, I'm on board!
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Old 03-20-2019, 06:52 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Originally Posted by ace93 View Post
So you are basically saying that in your opinion it would be ok to just barrell through a guy and for said guy to move so that his opponent has to barrel through him?

Let's keep going and eliminate illegal picks and running through picks.

After that, since blocks are allowed, bumping the guy with the ball is allowed too.

Lastly, let's put pads on the players and give them points for running to the other end of the court instead of having to put it through the basket.
I just do not know what a charge is anymore. I see defenders sliding under offensive players in every single game. It just seems that if you jump in front of a offensive player you have a great chance to draw the charge. I hate it. If an offensive player has already made a move toward the rim to shoot and a defender moves into the player call it a block. A charge is when a defender has control of the space not takes the space away. I have no idea how to fix it. Back in the day it was difficult to get the charge call. These days a guy can stick half his body in front of a driving player and get the call. What is a charge and what is a block? I need to have a talk with Jamie Luckie.
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:11 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

Here's a good test for you AA.

Charge or block?

https://twitter.com/Local12Jed/statu...17111131492353
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:14 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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I just do not know what a charge is anymore. I see defenders sliding under offensive players in every single game. It just seems that if you jump in front of a offensive player you have a great chance to draw the charge. I hate it. If an offensive player has already made a move toward the rim to shoot and a defender moves into the player call it a block. A charge is when a defender has control of the space not takes the space away. I have no idea how to fix it. Back in the day it was difficult to get the charge call. These days a guy can stick half his body in front of a driving player and get the call. What is a charge and what is a block? I need to have a talk with Jamie Luckie.
At what point is the player making a move toward the rim? I think that would be too hard to judge and therefore call. That is similar to the upward motion that was in place for a season and the referees said was impossible to call.

Here is a good take:
https://www.bannersontheparkway.com/...-march-madness
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:17 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Here's a good test for you AA.

Charge or block?

https://twitter.com/Local12Jed/statu...17111131492353
Clear block to me. Defender takes several steps and hops toward offensive player's landing position. Refs got that wrong.
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:27 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

Kanacevic should have been called for a block on Tre Graham.

Never forget.
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:28 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Originally Posted by paulxu View Post
Here's a good test for you AA.

Charge or block?

https://twitter.com/Local12Jed/statu...17111131492353
That is easy. It is a block.
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Old 03-20-2019, 07:51 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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The shot clock reset is good. It generates more possessions and it doesnt allow teams to get a rebound, kick it out and stand around for 20 more seconds, which isnt good for anybody.


I like the lane being wider because I think the charge arc is too big. Its hard for a defender to guard the hoop and get outside that arc to draw a charge. Now with the offense being forced out a little further, they can get outside the arc easier.
I hadn't thought about that with the lane, are you saying this is because the 3s violation gives the defenders more room underneath?

Regarding block/charge, I'm so sick of seeing late slides under the offensive player - when they have clearly initiated takeoff - being called charges. Same when said offensive player dishes it off. If they're in the act of going airborn whether to shoot or pass, I thought the defender wasn't allowed to late slide like that but we see them called charges all the time. Then inexplicably you'll have a guy clearly set, outside the arc, and get a block call.

They have to make it easier on the officials. I'm not necessarily blaming them, it's a hard job. And that may be one of the hardest calls. But the "draw a charge" mentality pisses me off, and yeah I know Courtney Stockard was one of the best in our league at it, but I'd rather give the defender a little more leeway and get rid of some of those charge calls. I like the cylinder rule, now the defender can go straight up and leave their feet and it's usually play on. Let them play defense, and not have their only out be to draw a charge.
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Old 03-20-2019, 08:53 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Kanacevic should have been called for a block on Tre Graham.

Never forget.
Pfft.
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Old 03-20-2019, 10:02 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Call me crazy but for the last 10 years I have been on an internal crusade to rid basketball of the charge/block call. Not sure who to contact or how to do it though.
I with you AA. A proposal I heard a long while back that I really liked and try to convince people of is this: Get rid of the charge call all together but keep the blocking foul.

The idea is this: I think refs see contact and feel like they have to make a call, but this can be bang-bang plays so it is hard to get the call right. And when they don't make a call, fans are up in arms because they all saw bodies colliding. So everyone is always upset.

How it would work: Defenders could still take a charge, however there wouldn't be an offensive foul. On the face of it, one might ask what wouldn't stop on offensive player from barreling into a defender. Well, if the defender has position, the outcome is likely for the offensive player to lose control of ball, leading to a potential turnover. Or cause them to miss their attempted shot. So it wouldn't always be in their best interest to just barrel thru guys.

If the defender doesn't have position, then it would still be a blocking foul. If its close, the refs can swallow their whistles and not feel forced to call something.

Flopping would disappear, because flopping would no longer draw a foul and instead lead to open lanes for the offensive player. A flop doesn't force a turnover.

It might lead to more shot blocking attempts, because drawing the charge isn't advantageous anymore. This could lead to more exciting moments.

The only caveat I would have is the charge still would remain for "off ball" actions, ie, after passing the ball, an offensive player couldn't just take out the defender if they have position. In this case, the contact due to the charge couldn't lead to a turnover as the ball has already been passed and the action could lead to a disadvantage for the defending team. That should still be a foul.
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Old 03-20-2019, 11:05 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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Originally Posted by 434 View Post
I with you AA. A proposal I heard a long while back that I really liked and try to convince people of is this: Get rid of the charge call all together but keep the blocking foul.

The idea is this: I think refs see contact and feel like they have to make a call, but this can be bang-bang plays so it is hard to get the call right. And when they don't make a call, fans are up in arms because they all saw bodies colliding. So everyone is always upset.

How it would work: Defenders could still take a charge, however there wouldn't be an offensive foul. On the face of it, one might ask what wouldn't stop on offensive player from barreling into a defender. Well, if the defender has position, the outcome is likely for the offensive player to lose control of ball, leading to a potential turnover. Or cause them to miss their attempted shot. So it wouldn't always be in their best interest to just barrel thru guys.

If the defender doesn't have position, then it would still be a blocking foul. If its close, the refs can swallow their whistles and not feel forced to call something.

Flopping would disappear, because flopping would no longer draw a foul and instead lead to open lanes for the offensive player. A flop doesn't force a turnover.

It might lead to more shot blocking attempts, because drawing the charge isn't advantageous anymore. This could lead to more exciting moments.

The only caveat I would have is the charge still would remain for "off ball" actions, ie, after passing the ball, an offensive player couldn't just take out the defender if they have position. In this case, the contact due to the charge couldn't lead to a turnover as the ball has already been passed and the action could lead to a disadvantage for the defending team. That should still be a foul.
A good play to run would be to have a big run into the defender under the basket as he hands it off to a guard who scores.

I don't see a potential turnover as being enough disincentive for not barrelling into a guy who you are pissed off at. Also, how do you defend a guy that is going to the basket with a full head of steam and is built like Zion Williams?
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Old 03-20-2019, 01:35 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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That is easy. It is a block.
The ref disagreed with you.
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Old 03-20-2019, 04:15 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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The ref disagreed with you.
Refs have disagreed with me on many an occasion.
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Old 03-20-2019, 05:44 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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I hate the foul rule and the reset to 0 team fouls at 10 minute mark. You shouldn't get bailed out for having fouled the crap out of the other team first the first 50% of the half, and v.v. Just plain go to quarters at that point. But i like the 1-and-1. Maybe play quarters, 4th and 5th fouls are 1-and-1's, 6th+ are 2 shots.
The only reason they're "resetting fouls" is to retain the number of media timeouts (aka Commercials TV can sell!) of halves while playing quarters.

WBB went to quarters four years ago. It's better.

Free throws are boring. Let’s say you foul once every 90 seconds.

Halves: 14 per half, 28 per game. There’d be 19 minutes of bonus time, 22 to 28 free throws per team.

Same frequency of fouls in quarters format: 10 minutes of bonus time, 16 free throws per team.

Free throws are boring. Action is better.
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Old 03-20-2019, 08:27 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Re: The 2019 NIT

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The only reason they're "resetting fouls" is to retain the number of media timeouts (aka Commercials TV can sell!) of halves while playing quarters.

WBB went to quarters four years ago. It's better.

Free throws are boring. Let’s say you foul once every 90 seconds.

Halves: 14 per half, 28 per game. There’d be 19 minutes of bonus time, 22 to 28 free throws per team.

Same frequency of fouls in quarters format: 10 minutes of bonus time, 16 free throws per team.

Free throws are boring. Action is better.
They are not playing quarters, though.
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