Professional and College Basketball Forums banner

1 - 20 of 89 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
920 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Point Guard
1. Jason Kidd
2. Andre Miller
3. Baron Davis
4. Gary Payton
5. Steve Francis
6. Mike Bibby
7. Steve Nash
8. Stephon Marbury
9. Jason Terry
10. Jamaal Tinsley

Shooting Guard:
1. Tracy McGrady
2. Paul Pierce
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Vince Carter
5. Allen Iverson
6. Michael Finley
7. Wally Szczerbiak
8. Jerry Stackhouse
9. Ray allen
10. Bonzi Wells

Small Forward:
1. Kevin Garnett
2. Dirk Nowitzki
3. Peja Stojakovic
4. Shawn Marion
5. Lamar Odom
6. Shareef Abdur-Rahim
7. Jalen Rose
8. Glenn Robinson
9. Pau Gasol
10. Ron Artest

Power Forward:
1. Tim Duncan
2. Chris Webber
3. Jermaine O'Neal
4. Ben Wallace
5. Elton Brand
6. Rasheed Wallace
7. Antonio McDyess
8. Antione Walker
9. Kenyon martin
10. Antonio Davis

Center:
1. shaq
2. Vlade Divac
3. Dikembe Mutombo
4. Theo Ratliff
5. Alonzo Mourning
6. Brad Miller
7. Raef Lafrentz
8. Michael Olowokandi
9. Keon Clark
10.Jake Tsakilidis
10. Jake Tsakilidis
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,356 Posts
I agree that Stockton should be in the top 10-but I'm not sure about Malone-he might barely squeak in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,019 Posts
Originally posted by Wilt_The_Stilt
I agree that Stockton should be in the top 10-but I'm not sure about Malone-he might barely squeak in.
He averaged 38 Min and played in 80 games. Here are his stats.
PPG RBG APG FG% 3% FT% SPG
22.4 8.6 4.3 45% 36% 80% 1.9
What 10 PF stats match these? Where is he lacking? He is definitely in the top 10.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
96 Posts
Malone

I think Malone is due for a fall this year. He definitely looked a lot older this year. Almost no inside game, all jump shots, and look at his 4th quarter shooting percentage. It has fallen a lot, always a sure sign of aging. (I don't have the numbers, but saw them in an article)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,019 Posts
Re: Malone

Originally posted by Dr. J
I think Malone is due for a fall this year. He definitely looked a lot older this year. Almost no inside game, all jump shots, and look at his 4th quarter shooting percentage. It has fallen a lot, always a sure sign of aging. (I don't have the numbers, but saw them in an article)
Age is a factor in his shot selection and lack of inside game but not the entire story. I think there are also a couple other factors that are just as important. Defensive rule changes and the Jazz's pathetic outside shooting are major factors they allow teams to double him easier and force him to take shots from farther out. In the past Hornacek and Russell made people pay for double teaming Malone. Last year teams didn't pay for double teaming because no could hit an outside shot. His numbers may drop some but I think he will have a year similiar to last year. He will also have some motivation. This year is the final year of his contract. He still wants to break the all time scoring record and I doubt he wants to take a large pay cut. He needs to prove he is still worth $$$ and can still play at a high level.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,356 Posts
Originally posted by JoeF


He averaged 38 Min and played in 80 games. Here are his stats.
PPG RBG APG FG% 3% FT% SPG
22.4 8.6 4.3 45% 36% 80% 1.9
What 10 PF stats match these? Where is he lacking? He is definitely in the top 10.
I said he would barely make it....as in #9-thats not bad
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
172 Posts
Whoa Whoa Whoa

Originally posted by Malakian
Point Guard
1. Jason Kidd
2. Andre Miller
3. Baron Davis
4. Gary Payton
5. Steve Francis
6. Mike Bibby
7. Steve Nash
8. Stephon Marbury
9. Jason Terry
10. Jamaal Tinsley

Shooting Guard:
1. Tracy McGrady
2. Paul Pierce
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Vince Carter
5. Allen Iverson
6. Michael Finley
7. Wally Szczerbiak
8. Jerry Stackhouse
9. Ray allen
10. Bonzi Wells

Small Forward:
1. Kevin Garnett
2. Dirk Nowitzki
3. Peja Stojakovic
4. Shawn Marion
5. Lamar Odom
6. Shareef Abdur-Rahim
7. Jalen Rose
8. Glenn Robinson
9. Pau Gasol
10. Ron Artest

Power Forward:
1. Tim Duncan
2. Chris Webber
3. Jermaine O'Neal
4. Ben Wallace
5. Elton Brand
6. Rasheed Wallace
7. Antonio McDyess
8. Antione Walker
9. Kenyon martin
10. Antonio Davis

Center:
1. shaq
2. Vlade Divac
3. Dikembe Mutombo
4. Theo Ratliff
5. Alonzo Mourning
6. Brad Miller
7. Raef Lafrentz
8. Michael Olowokandi
9. Keon Clark
10.Jake Tsakilidis
10. Jake Tsakilidis

Andre Miller ahead of Baron Davis, Steve Francis, and Gary Payton with his inflated numbers? Yeah....right.

Wally world in the top 10 period? Paul Pierce ahead of Kobe Bryant? You've got some serious bias going on there I bet.

Peja Stojakovic isn't a top 3 SF in the league. Not even top 5 if you ask me. He's a glorified 3 pt. shooter. Marion averages nearly 20 and 10, Odom can give you 15, 7, and 5 when he's out there. And the only top 10 list Ron Artest should be no is a "Most big headed player" one.

Theo Ratliff didn't even play last year. How you gonna have him on a top 10 list? Same with Mcdyess.

And Ben Wallace is a top 10 defender, but not overall player at PF. Wallace, Brand, Martin, and Walker are all better players than him.

I really don't even know what to say about that top 10 Center list.
 

·
Hokeamaniac
Joined
·
5,775 Posts
And Ben Wallace is a top 10 defender, but not overall player at PF. Wallace, Brand, Martin, and Walker are all better players than him.
So defense doesn't matter? Ben's defense changes games. He can shut down the interior play, and he can 'd' up wing players. He is truly a franchise player, even though he scores roughly 8 points per game. Somebody that leads the league in rebounds and blocked shots at 6'9" deserves to be on a top ten list for PF's. In my opinion, Ben was underrated on that list as I feel he is better than Jermaine O'Neal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
920 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Re: Whoa Whoa Whoa

Originally posted by BigChris



Andre Miller ahead of Baron Davis, Steve Francis, and Gary Payton with his inflated numbers? Yeah....right.

Wally world in the top 10 period? Paul Pierce ahead of Kobe Bryant? You've got some serious bias going on there I bet.

Peja Stojakovic isn't a top 3 SF in the league. Not even top 5 if you ask me. He's a glorified 3 pt. shooter. Marion averages nearly 20 and 10, Odom can give you 15, 7, and 5 when he's out there. And the only top 10 list Ron Artest should be no is a "Most big headed player" one.

Theo Ratliff didn't even play last year. How you gonna have him on a top 10 list? Same with Mcdyess.

And Ben Wallace is a top 10 defender, but not overall player at PF. Wallace, Brand, Martin, and Walker are all better players than him.

I really don't even know what to say about that top 10 Center list.

Age factored into my list. Andre Miller has inflated numbers? What does that mean? He averaged 16 and 11. Artest can shut down anybody that plays the 1, 2, or 3.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
Point Guards

1. Jason Kidd - Really a given since he does so much on the court. The closely thing to Magic Johnson that their may ever be again.

2. Gary Payton - Still very good and even though age is catching up he still is leading his team to the playoffs year after year. Can score, is an excellent defender and sets his teammates up.

3. Baron Davis - Proved how clutch he is in the playoffs the last two years. Very strong point who has a lot of athleticism and a good outside shot. This ranking is based on his playoff performance keeping the idea that he will keep in during the regular season.

4. Mike Bibby - This ranking is also based on his playoff performance and that he can keep it up during the season. Single-handly made the Kings-LA series close several times in every game. A good shooter, who can drive and is a brillant passer.

5. Steve Nash - Outside shot is unquestionable and he is perfect with the high flying Mavs. Very creative player who can make something out of nothing and sets up his teammates very well.

6. Stephon Marbury - He isn't Jason Kidd but all of Phoenix's problems can't be placed on his shoulders. On a team with an inside option, he could be very good. Although he is a ball hog, their is no denying his scoring ability.

7. John Stockton - Still very good and is keeping his old, untalented team competitive. Still a master with the jump shot and can D is up as well.

8. Steve Francis - Super athletic and can put points on the board when he is healthy. Should move up on this list if he can play a full season injury free.

9. Andre Miller - Best player on a horrible team. Know telling how he would fare on a good team but he isn't a scoring point. Sets up his teammates well and is a good defender but Cleveland is right in thinking he doesn't deserve the max.

10. Jason Terry - Big dropoff here between him and Miller but Terry can put up points in bunches. A natural SG who plays the point because of his height. Has yet to prove he is a winner.

Watch out for - Jason Williams, Tony Parker

Shooting Guard

1. Tracey McGrady - It's highly debatable and I'm sure we could debate it for years. This is just my opinion. Has lead his team to he playoffs with little help and is at the top of the statistal categorys for SG's in just about everything.

2. Kobe Bryant - Has the luxury of playing with Shaq and not being the focus of other teams. Still, very good and he would be the franchise player for almost any other team. Very athletic and a smooth shooter who has proven to be a clutch player and a team player.

3. Paul Pierce - Lifted his game to another level this year and showcased his talent. Has a better supporting cast than McGrady but not Kobe. Still made a serious threat to win the East almost single-handly.

4. Vince Carter - Had a difficult year with injuries but when he's healthy he is a heck of a player. Best known for his amazing dunks and leaping ability but he is close to a complete player with a jump shot and good ball handling abilities. A step below the top 3.

5. Michael Jordan - If he plays this year it will be at his natural 2-guard spot. Still does so much on the court and puts up the numbers. Athleticism isn't nearly what it was but is still a shooter. The conseus greatest player ever.

6. Allen Iverson - Was at the top of this list for most people just last year but has since suffered injuries and the 76ers overall have shown a decline in play. Can score and is almost impossible to stop on offense. Size limits his defense though.

7. Michael Finley - Physical shooting guard who is a great back to the basket player. A good shooter and athlete who can score and play D. Seeing a reduced role for Dallas but still puts up good numbers.

8. Ray Allen - A poor season dropped his rankings but the long and lean shooting guard can still hit the long range shot. Very good shooter who shots a very high % for a 2-gurd. A good athlete although he isn't the in Vince's, Tracey's or Kobe's class their.

9. Jerry Stackhouse - Physical presence who is forced to shot a lot for the Pistons. Great athlete who is best as a slasher. Pistons give him credit for their success last year even though their were more talented teams.

10. Wally Szczerbiak - Doesn't deserve the max but had a terrific year for the Timberwolves. Great shooter who can be dependent on Garnett to create his shots but he shots a very high %. More of a natural SF and struggles defensively with smaller guards.

On the bubble - Eddie Jones, Allan Houston

Watch Out For - Jason Richardson, Bonzi Wells, Richard Hamilton

Small Forwards

1. Kevin Garnett - Became a full time SF but still spends much of his time in the post. Very good in the high post and is an amazing force on defense. Not a dominant offensive player and hears it around playoff time. Impact on the boards and on defense still makes him a top 5 NBA player.

2. Dirk Nowitzki - Another guy who really doesn't have a position on the court. Spends most of his time in the half-court knocking down three pointers but he usually guards big men on the defensive side of the ball. A very difficult match-up and he is a very good rebounder.

3. Peja Stojakovic - A significant drop here but Strojakovic is still a good player. Great scorer who can shot the ball and really benefits playing in the up-tempo system of the Kings. Solid rebounder, too.

4. Shawn Marion - Amazing athlete who is a rebounding machine for his size. A fun player to watch even though he relies on his athleticism a lot to dominant.

5. Latrell Spreewell - A natural SG, who is forced to play SF. Super quick and a very good perimeter defender. Can score but he shouldn't be a number one option.

6. Lamar Odom - Could and probably should be number 3 on this list. Has amazing physical talent but his desire has been questioned. Clippers are hoping he turns from a question mark to a franchise player and a leader.

7. Jamal Mashburn - Limited by injuries this year espically in the playoffs but it a terrific scorer who the Hornets. Had he played in the playoffs, the Hornets possible could have came out of the East. Great with his back to the basket.

8. Shareef Abdur-Rahim - Good player on a poor team. Can score and is athletic but he isn't in the elite class in either. Good rebounder and solid defender.

9. Keith Van Horn - When he plays well the Nets usually win. Too bad he failed to show up for the finals. Shares the SF role with Kenyon Martin, who could have also made this list as a SF. Good shooter but has trouble with the quicker SF's.

10. Jalen Rose - Move to the Bulls proved to be a good for his career. Once appeared destined for standorm with the Pacers but got caught up in a loop of good, young talent there.

On the bubble: Glenn Robinson

Watch Out For: Pau Gasol, Mike Dunleavy, Darius Miles, Andrei
Kirilenko (thanks) and Rashard Lewis

Power Forwards

1. Tim Duncan - Really no debate here. Continues to lead his team well into the playoffs without a good supporting cast. Not the most fun guy to watch but he gets the job done and he is argueably the second best player in the league.

2. Rasheed Wallace - I may take some heat for this one. Rasheed puts up good numbers on a team with a very overrated supporting cast. He is a clutch player and although his play has slip a bit over the last year he still can score on anyone. I believe that if Rasheed was in the right situation, he could be a top 5 NBA player.

3. Chris Webber - Wonderful passer and a good jump shooter but he really isn't a go to player down the stretch. He failed to exploit the Robert Horry match-up enough to give the Kings the advantage. Still a very good player. Not the athlete that Wallace and Garnett are though.

4. Ben Wallace - Terrific defender and rebounder but he doesn't offer as much on the offensive end. If his play continues he could be compared to Dennis Rodman, without the hair and incidents. Big time player defensively but he also doesn't have a lot of great PF's going up against him.

5. Elton Brand - Became the "man" on the young Clipper team and put up very good numbers. Good low post threat and he has developed a soft jumper. Plenty of good years ahead and he should only move up on this list.

6. Jermaine O'Neal - Inconsistenct but he's on, he is on. Great shot blocker and has a developing offensive game that includes a nice hook. Was outplayed by Kenyon Martin in the Nets-Pacers series and but his best years are still ahead of him.

7. Antoine Walker - Difficult to rank him since he spends most of his time on the perimeter. Top of the notch scorer though and is a very good tough match-up because of his thee point shooting.

8. Kenyon Martin - Really brought it during the playoffs espically in the Indiana and LA series. If he continues to play like that during the season he should shoot up this list.

9. Karl Malone - Old, grumpy and angry but he is still effective. His jump shot is good as they come and he runs the pick up beautifully. Still has the sharpe elbows and says he plans to try to break Kareem's scoring record.

10. Antonio McDyess - It's real hard to rank a guy that only played 8 games last year. Will he return to his old form or not? Before last year he would have been a top 5 PF but age and injuries are catching up. Edged out Antonio Davis for this spot, who also suffered through injuries.

On the Bubble: Antonio Davis, Antwain Jamison, PJ Brown, Derrick Coleman

Watch out For: Eddie Griffin, Nene Hilario, Chris Wilcox, Tyson Chandler, Drew Gooden and Kwame Brown

Centers

1. Shaquille O'Neal - After hours of debating I decided on Shaq. Get mad if you want but that's just my opinion.

2. Alonzo Mourning - Running on a low tank of gas but Zo stills puts up solid numbers. He should be better this season with a year of conditioning under his belt but he probably will never be the same again.

3. Dikembe Mutombo - He still can block shots and rebound and he's good at both of them. Running on a low tank of gas as well. Still is very limited on offense and he isn't a Shaq stopper.

4. Theo Ratliff - If he could get healthy he could move up to number 2 quite easily. Very athletic presence who blocks a lot of shots and can rebound. A decent offensive player as well.

5. Vlade Divac - The old man still manages to get up and down the court and provides a big body on defense. Makes some great plays but also has the ability to screw up an easily one. Frustrates teammates a lot with his off-the-wall moves and passes. Still a very good passer.

6. Raef LaFrentz - Good three point shooter and a solid body on defense, LaFrentz is going to win games for you but he isn't going to lose them either.

7. Michael Olowokandi - Big body who should only move up on this list. A solid jump shooter and has decent moves around the goal. Limited by foul trouble a lot. Good rebounder and shot blocker when he plays aggressive.

8. Elden Campbell - Perfected the 15 to 18 foot jumper and lives off of it. Has some solid post moves and he still can rebound. Lost the spring in his legs but their is little else out their.

9. David Robinson - No longer in the elite class but he still can rebound, block shots and hit the jumper. Bothered by injuries last year and his best days are behind him.

10. Brad Miller - Big body guy who has worked his way into the league and into the starting role with hard work. Limited by his athleticism but has a soft touch around the goal.

On the Bubble: Keon Clark, Zydrunas Ilgauskas


Watch Out For: Eddy Curry, Yao Ming, DeSanga Diop


KC,

Jalen Rose put up good numbers on a very poor team. They weren't many more worse teams than Chicago last year. Their also wasn't another legit scorer on Chicago team. He became expendable in Indiana for a reason. Part of it was the fact that they thought they had young guys who were better. Stats don't mean everything. Michael Adams once put up 29 points a game in Washington, yet during that year (early 90's) you wouldn't have found a single person who would have put him in the top 5 point guards. Now, their isn't a single point who puts up close to those numbers, yet I would take several before I took him.

And until you make your own lists, I don't hear anything about my list being weak.
 

·
A!
Joined
·
9,434 Posts
C'mon, Jalen Rose should be much higher than that..... He averaged 23, 5, 4 with the Bulls. IMO, he should be at #4 SF.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
133 Posts
im still tryna figure out how Wally Szczerbiak is better than Ray Allen
 

·
A!
Joined
·
9,434 Posts
Originally posted by Bean the pimp
im still tryna figure out how Wally Szczerbiak is better than Ray Allen
Just like I'm still trying to figure out how sorry Keith Van-Horn is better than Jalen Rose
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,356 Posts
Originally posted by KC
C'mon, Jalen Rose should be much higher than that..... He averaged 23, 5, 4 with the Bulls. IMO, he should be at #4 SF.

Kevin Garnett
Dirk Nowitzki
Peja Stojakovic
Shawn Marion
Latrell Spreewell
Jamal Mashburn
Shareef Abdur-Rahim


All of these guys are better than Rose-and Robinson is just as good IMO
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,019 Posts
Originally posted by UNCStateGuy

Watch Out For: Pau Gasol, Mike Dunleavy
Watch Out For Andre Kirilinko. Good slasher, Good feel for the game, and a pretty good althete. Good defensive player. Can defend SG and SF. Great weakside shot blocker. Needs work on offensive game. Particularly outside shooting.
 

·
A!
Joined
·
9,434 Posts
Originally posted by Wilt_The_Stilt



Kevin Garnett
Dirk Nowitzki
Peja Stojakovic
Shawn Marion
Latrell Spreewell
Jamal Mashburn
Shareef Abdur-Rahim


All of these guys are better than Rose-and Robinson is just as good IMO

Shareef basically plays PF.... Marion is debateable. He averages 4 leass points and 3 less asists per game. He gets 5 more rebounds per game, but again, he plays some PF as well. Sprewell is only better than Rose if you would rather have 19,3,3 instead of 23,5,4. Rose also shoots a higher FG % and a higher 3pt. FG %age.... Glen Robinson averages 3 less points and 3 less asists per game. He averages 2 more rebounds while shooting a lower 3pt. %age. Rose is right up there in the top 4 or 5.

Weak list you put up.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,356 Posts
Originally posted by KC


Weak list you put up.....
Rose plays on a weak team...;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,447 Posts
Kobe's the best shooting guard ,you could debate TMac but not Pierce, Since when did it become a flaw to play with other great players seems as if Kobe gets penalized for this more than anything, Tmac plays more like a small forward and when he was the second fiddle to Vince in a comparable role to Kobe kobe does more for his team than Tmac did for Toronto that's how i see it Who know's how good kobe could be without Shaq all I know stats are comparable playing with another 25+per game scorer, He'd surely put up more points per game if he was the only option even if teams solely focused on him based on the games I've seen him play without Shaq I just think he's slightly more knowledgeable about the game for the mere fact that he's been around the pro game more through his dad that has to count for something and he seems to make better decision at the end of games than Tmac who always seems to screw up at the end but this are just my view which I 'm sure have been debated ad nauseum .Pierce outplayed Mcgrady everytime they played this past year, Kobe slightly outplayed Tmac also.
 
1 - 20 of 89 Posts
Top