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Discussion Starter #1
....will always be critized and compared to Andre Iguodala..


i'm not here saying 'what if', obviously Andre is in Philly and we have a work in progress (lack of better statement) in Aarujo.

but the writing was on the wall from the moment that Aarujo got drafted to everything that unfolded in last nights game...

andre believed he was going to be picked by the raps in the draft, and in fact the tv production crew at the draft believed the same thing as they had the camera on him when the 8th pick was going to be announced...

"The cameras were actually put on me when Toronto's pick came up so I thought I was going here, but they passed. I think I'm in a good situation right now," Iguodala said.
source

but to add insult to injury, at VC's charity classic last year, VC invited Iggy to be one of the players, where he didn't even offer sprite zone seats to Hoffa...writing on the WALL, yes...

what's worse, is that Hoffa never had the confidence of VC from the beginning, and that only could hurt his own ego, muchless every paper, local to national to international dogged the raptors at picking hoffa...

now he's in a situation where he should prove the critics wrong and bring some respectablity to babcock and the organization, but yet we have to see a glimps of promise from our center....he has shown flashes, but, that's about it....

Hoffa, will always be compared to his fellow draft'e' swingman iguodala who can play D', drive the ball and hit from the paremeter which he showed his 'potential adoptive family' to the North last night...

Toronto center Rafael Araujo, who was selected one pick before Iguodala in the draft two years ago, didn't score or get a rebound in three minutes.
 

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Everytime I hear someone mention how we could have got Iguodala, my heart hurts a little...
 

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Discussion Starter #3
undefined_playa said:
Everytime I hear someone mention how we could have got Iguodala, my heart hurts a little...

me too, but it creates more optimism to wish that Aarujo could wake up tomorrow and bonnified center and rip the league up...

babcock is the one that got screwed in this...last year he drafted for needs rather than take the best available player in the draft,...this year he drafts in his mind the best available player rather than to draft for the teams needs...(so far drafting talent over needs this year is probably the only thing saving his job)
 

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It all comes down to MLSE not realising that VC needed to be traded as soon as their GM was hired since it was not DR. J.

If they had recognised he was not in their plans (given that he would request a trade), they would not have perceived such depth at Iggy's position and just taken the BPA, that being Iggy, rather than trying to fill holes to supplement VC et al.
 

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blowuptheraptors said:
It all comes down to MLSE not realising that VC needed to be traded as soon as their GM was hired since it was not DR. J.

If they had recognised he was not in their plans (given that he would request a trade), they would not have perceived such depth at Iggy's position and just taken the BPA, that being Iggy, rather than trying to fill holes to supplement VC et al.

Exactly the Hoffa pick was to be a compliment to Vince. They were naive enough to think they could convince him to stay. And then when they couldn't, everyone already knew he was desperate to go and his value was ****. Iggy sure is a hell of a player though :cry:
 

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yeah that draft sucked

Utah's sucked too.
-They picked Chris Humphries right before Al Jefferson.
-Then they picked Kirk Snyder right before Josh Smith (think it was for someone else though. can't remember)

but still, ouch
 

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Last game is when I finally gave up on Hoffa for good.

Still will not use it to indict Babcock... Babcock has done a great job since draft day 2005.
 

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blowuptheraptors said:
It all comes down to MLSE not realising that VC needed to be traded as soon as their GM was hired since it was not DR. J.

If they had recognised he was not in their plans (given that he would request a trade), they would not have perceived such depth at Iggy's position and just taken the BPA, that being Iggy, rather than trying to fill holes to supplement VC et al.

I think this is Peddie's major failing. I don't know how often it happens but GG should have been let go before the season or mid-season at the very least, the latter seemingly pretty tough to do. Of course the VC trade demands weren't out there then but GG the lame duck was bound to confound matters. An interim guy should have been brought in, the right man for the job hired well in advance of the draft, VC moved on draft night, and Iggy selected.

Of course then we were still trying to hold on to the dream of Vince and the mediocrity he might be able to give us. I certainly wasn't screaming for us to fire GG early and make VC's last season with us under the coaching of KO. But hey, I'm not the guy in charge.

VC to Boston for Raef and their two later first rounders? Select Iggy, Delonte West, and David Harrison (not a great guy but we needed another big in the worst way).

Delonte
Mo
Iggy
Bosh

Still, with Vince not being moved for further depth I found it very difficult not wanting a big man more than anything. And take a look at the guys after Iggy and you'll see that we didn't do that badly in comparison- Luke Jackson, Biedrins, and Robert Swift.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
more quotes, this from the Toronto Star:

Toronto shot 54.2 per cent, which most times should get them a W. But they allowed the 76ers to drain nine of 16 three-pointers, six of them (on eight attempts) by guard Andre Iguodala, who was taken one spot after the Raptors drafted — gulp — Rafael Araujo in 2004. Iguodala finished with 26 points. Araujo has accumulated eight points in eight games.
source
 

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Real fair comparison. Hoffa has 8 points in only 37 total minutes this season. 37 TOTAL minutes. Iggy probably played more than that last night. Hoff's minutes were scattered across 7 games no less, not eight. Anyone who says he has been given a chance this year is just kidding themselves.

Last year he put up 3 and 3 in only 12mpg and had very nice stats in games where he played 18mpg or more. He came into camp leaner and quicker this year. So naturally Sam plays him less? I honestly believe that if Philly had taken Araujo he would have come in here and smoked us for 15 and 15 just like the other scrub centers do. And we'd all be crying about missing him.

The whole Iggy comparison makes little sense to me. Kirk Snyder was rated the best athlete at the draft combines that year. If the Raps were going to draft a wing I would think that is who they were looking at. Many draft sites had him ranked higher. More likely they would have taken PG Jameer Nelson who everyone was shocked fell so far.

Iggy was thought to be very weak offensively. I really don't think we would have picked him.

Biedrins or Jefferson or Swift would have been 'project' big men that would have pissed off VC. Hoff looked more nba ready based on his college play but Jefferson has really surprised.

The big failure of the Babcock draft record is that he failed to look at HS talent. Rob has a clear dislike of HS players, which is strange coming from MIN. Over his two drafts he has passed on JR Smith, Al Jefferson, Josh Smith, Dorrel Wright, Biedrins, Swift, Gerald Green, Andrew Bynum, CJ Miles, Andray Blatche. I am willing to bet that somewhere in that group is a star that we will regret not taking more than Iggy.

We still had MoP and I don't see Iggy adding much more than MoP going into that draft. Two MoP's does not seem like a great lineup. To draft a wing it would have to be someone with more star potential.

In hindsight I'd obviously prefer to have Iggy than Hoff right now. But later it will be another player we will all say was the 'obvious' choice.
 

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There's a reason Hoffa's only played 37 minutes...

And the other thing is that Iggy was an obvious pick. I've stated the entire time that I would have rather had Al Jefferson but when the first eight picks were more or less set in stone for that draft, and we take a raw 24-year old just because Utah wants him, you better expect criticism. Everyone and I mean everyone figured we would have gotten the last of that big eight. Then again, Granger and Green were the consensus picks for our spot this year and our pick hasn't turned out that bad.
 

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Two things to add

- Iggy plays beside one of the best nba players ever. It's nice to play with superstars who draw double and triple teams all the time. This is not a knock against iggy - he desreves all the acolades coming his way, but... AI makes things alot easier for everyone!

- Rob was hired a week or so before the draft. Under the circumstances i have to put the blame on Peddie as well.
 

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lucky777s said:
Real fair comparison. Hoffa has 8 points in only 37 total minutes this season. 37 TOTAL minutes. Iggy probably played more than that last night. Hoff's minutes were scattered across 7 games no less, not eight. Anyone who says he has been given a chance this year is just kidding themselves.

Last year he put up 3 and 3 in only 12mpg and had very nice stats in games where he played 18mpg or more. He came into camp leaner and quicker this year. So naturally Sam plays him less? I honestly believe that if Philly had taken Araujo he would have come in here and smoked us for 15 and 15 just like the other scrub centers do. And we'd all be crying about missing him.

The whole Iggy comparison makes little sense to me. Kirk Snyder was rated the best athlete at the draft combines that year. If the Raps were going to draft a wing I would think that is who they were looking at. Many draft sites had him ranked higher. More likely they would have taken PG Jameer Nelson who everyone was shocked fell so far.

Iggy was thought to be very weak offensively. I really don't think we would have picked him.

Biedrins or Jefferson or Swift would have been 'project' big men that would have pissed off VC. Hoff looked more nba ready based on his college play but Jefferson has really surprised.

The big failure of the Babcock draft record is that he failed to look at HS talent. Rob has a clear dislike of HS players, which is strange coming from MIN. Over his two drafts he has passed on JR Smith, Al Jefferson, Josh Smith, Dorrel Wright, Biedrins, Swift, Gerald Green, Andrew Bynum, CJ Miles, Andray Blatche. I am willing to bet that somewhere in that group is a star that we will regret not taking more than Iggy.

We still had MoP and I don't see Iggy adding much more than MoP going into that draft. Two MoP's does not seem like a great lineup. To draft a wing it would have to be someone with more star potential.

In hindsight I'd obviously prefer to have Iggy than Hoff right now. But later it will be another player we will all say was the 'obvious' choice.

http://www.nbadraft.net/index.asp?content=mock2004
 
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