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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OK, I've checked this trade out and it seems to work. It's complicated because it's hard to trade Marion under the league rules because he's a BYC player. However, after a night in the lab, I came up with this:

Chicago trades:
Curry to Phoenix
Blount to Phoenix
Gill to Phoenix
Fizer to Utah
Brunson to Utah
Jeffries to Utah
Chicago receives:
Shawn Marion
Casey Jacobsen
Mo Williams

Utah trades:
Mo Williams to Chicago
Utah receives:
Marcus Fizer
Rick Brunson (likely cut)
Chris Jeffries (likely cut)

Phoenix trades:
Shawn Marion to Chicago
Casey Jacobsen to Chicago
Phoenix receives:
Eddy Curry
Corey Blount
Kendall Gill

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This trade gives everyone something they should like:

Chicago gets something better than Rasheed Wallace or Shareef for Curry. Marion is a legit all-star, a good defender and scorer. He's probably a step down from Paul Pierce or McGrady, but he's very good and still young. He said good things about Skiles, so they'll probably get along. We also get Jacobsen who's a legit outside shooter to back up Curry. Mo Williams could be a legit backup PG for us (in fact, I'm not sure the Jazz would trade him for Fizer, but more on that later). Aside from Curry, none of the guys we're giving up are long-termers. We're a little short, but we could probably sign back someone like Brunson if he gets waived after the trade (likely). And of course we're really no shorter than we are now since Fizer, Jeffries, and Brunson hardly play. From that perspective it's basically Curry, Blount, and Gill for Marion, Jacobsen, and Mo. I can live with that. In the long run, it gives us a guy who's very good to play with Kirk, Jamal, and Tyson. We'd need to find a long-term solution at the PF slot in the draft, but this seems like a deep draft in bigger guys.
1- Hinrich, Williams (Pippen)
2- Crawford, Jacobsen
3- Marion, Pippen, ERob, Dupree
4- AD, JYD (ERob)
5- Chandler (AD)

Phoenix gets its much desired cap room and gets a very good center prospect. They can go after Kobe, but if they don't get him, it's not like they've given Marion up for nothing. And in truth, there have been whispers that Marion isn't quite what he's cracked up to be there. Not that he sucks, but maybe the kind of "Elton Brand Disappointment" we've seen in Chicago- "Yeah, he's good, but he can't carry us". Johnson might be able to slide to the 3 and do just as good a job. Or Zarko with JJ at the 2. Instead, they've gotten Curry, who could always turn into a beast. At the very least, they head into next season with Curry, Amare, Joe Johnson, Zarko, Lampe, Barbossa, a bunch of draft picks and a boatload of cash.

Utah is in this deal because of their cap room, but it seems to me that they'd be willing to make a move like this. We could include a financial inducement of a couple million to counter the cost of buying out Chris Jeffries, so that would be a wash (IE, they could basically buy him out and cut him at no cost. Likewise they could cut Brunson if they want and we could re-sign him. So that's a wash for them too. Really, what it comes down to is them needing some help up front, and taking flier on a former #4 pick with an expiring deal (Fizer) in return for helping us dispose of Jeffries and Brunson. To make room for Fizer, however, someone would have to go, and despite the occasional nice game, the likely guy would be Mo Williams (given that they already have Arroyo and Lopez looking good at the point). In truth, Fizer for Williams and a money neutral laundering of Chris Jeffries and Brunson doesn't look like a bad deal. If they want, I'm sure someone would cough up a second round pick as compensation for Williams too if they really wanted it.
 

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Mike,

Well done to suggest a Marion trade that actually works under the cap. His BYC status makes it tough.

Keep in mind though that even if Utah cuts Brunson and Jeffries, Jeffries still would count almost a million dollars against their cap next year. This is not a big number, but it should be noted. We might have to sweeten the pot a little more, perhaps with a second round draft pick in the future?

Chicago trades: PF Marcus Fizer (6.1 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 13.7 minutes)
C Eddy Curry (12.8 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.8 apg in 27.3 minutes)
PF Corie Blount (4.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 1.1 apg in 17.4 minutes)
SF Chris Jefferies (2.5 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 0.3 apg in 5.5 minutes)
PG Rick Brunson (3.0 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 2.0 apg in 9.6 minutes)
SG Kendall Gill (10.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.8 apg in 26.1 minutes)
Chicago receives: PG Mo Williams (4.8 ppg, 1.4 rpg, 1.6 apg in 13.6 minutes)
SF Shawn Marion (18.3 ppg, 9.3 rpg, 2.6 apg in 40.6 minutes)
SG Casey Jacobsen (5.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 18.4 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -10.8 ppg, -7.6 rpg, and -1.8 apg.

Utah trades: PG Mo Williams (4.8 ppg, 1.4 rpg, 1.6 apg in 13.6 minutes)
Utah receives: PF Marcus Fizer (6.1 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 23 games)
SF Chris Jefferies (2.5 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 0.3 apg in 12 games)
PG Rick Brunson (3.0 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 2.0 apg in 20 games)
Change in team outlook: +6.8 ppg, +4.4 rpg, and +1.5 apg.

Phoenix trades: SF Shawn Marion (18.3 ppg, 9.3 rpg, 2.6 apg in 40.6 minutes)
SG Casey Jacobsen (5.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 18.4 minutes)
Phoenix receives: C Eddy Curry (12.8 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 0.8 apg in 34 games)
PF Corie Blount (4.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 1.1 apg in 33 games)
SG Kendall Gill (10.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.8 apg in 41 games)
Change in team outlook: +4.0 ppg, +3.2 rpg, and +0.3 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Due to Chicago and Phoenix being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. Chicago and Phoenix had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


You have been assigned Trade ID number 1430973
 

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Maybe Chandler instead of Curry would be slightly more likely.

I doubt that Curry or Chandler alone is enough for Marion.
 

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Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
Maybe Chandler instead of Curry would be slightly more likely.

I doubt that Curry or Chandler alone is enough for Marion.
BigAmare,

Curry is a more logical fit for you, a true center to pair with Amare, I would think.

What do you think about clearning cap room to try and get Kobe?
 

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That's an interesting idea, Mike. Nice job.

I'd love to have Marion, but I'm not sure Phoenix would trade Marion and Jacobsen for essentially just Curry and capspace (plus Eddy's a FA after next season and they'll have to pay him).

I'm also a little wary of trading Curry right now and just saying "Oh, well Tyson can slide over." I definitely think a healthy Tyson can slide over to the 5, but with his future health being somewhat up in the air, this would be a risk.

Amare and Curry together could "potentially" be an ENORMOUS force at some point. That would be very interesting to see.

Officially, I guess I'd do this trade.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
Maybe Chandler instead of Curry would be slightly more likely.

I doubt that Curry or Chandler alone is enough for Marion.
You could well be right about this. Alone, I think you're right. But when you consider the financial implications, the Suns are getting a big boost because they're wiping several million dollars in salary off the books. If their goal is to make a run at Kobe, then this trade gets them there by shedding enough salary to offer him the max in addition to giving them Curry.

If the Suns make this trade, (Blount and Gill have expiring or team option deals), the Suns will have only Curry's $3.9M under the cap this summer instead of Marion's $11.3M and Casey's $1.1M. Thus, they get a net savings of 12.4-3.9 = $8.5M in cap room in addition to getting Curry.

That's easily enough to allow them to go after Kobe (and probably some other guys too). So what you're really getting is Curry plus the chance to get Bryant (and other FAs). That's something you don't have now... you've got some cap room, but not enough to make a legit offer to Kobe.

Regarding Chandler vs. Curry, you could be right there too, but wouldn't Curry and Amare be a better fit than Amare and Chandler? Curry is a true center while Chandler is, like Amare, more of a hybrid type that relies purely on athleticism. Plus there's the question of Chandler's health.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Originally posted by <b>PC Load Letter</b>!
That's an interesting idea, Mike. Nice job.

I'd love to have Marion, but I'm not sure Phoenix would trade Marion and Jacobsen for essentially just Curry and capspace (plus Eddy's a FA after next season and they'll have to pay him).

I'm also a little wary of trading Curry right now and just saying "Oh, well Tyson can slide over." I definitely think a healthy Tyson can slide over to the 5, but with his future health being somewhat up in the air, this would be a risk.

Amare and Curry together could "potentially" be an ENORMOUS force at some point. That would be very interesting to see.

Officially, I guess I'd do this trade.
Thanks!

I think I would too. I don't know about Phoenix. I guess it depends on whether they think they have a legitimate shot at getting Kobe. If they do, they need the cap space in order to him. If not, I agree, they probably wouldn't do this.

Regarding Tyson, this is obviously a very good point. I guess you can look at it two ways. Yeah, Tyson at the 5 is a risk, but we could still make due for another year or two with AD at the 5 and let Tyson play the 4. Neither is really a true 5, but we'd probably be able to make due with it while we find another big guy.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!


BigAmare,

Curry is a more logical fit for you, a true center to pair with Amare, I would think.

What do you think about clearning cap room to try and get Kobe?
Maybe,

But, can you imagine a TY/Amare frount court. Would anyone else get a rebound?
 

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Amare doesn't rely on pure athleticism. He scores in all ways.

I would rather pair him with a long athletic guy who can defend and run the court with the Suns rather than Curry.

Only thing Chandler would have to learn is improving his J.
 

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Well you aren't going to get Chandler until he's healthy enough for Pax to evaluate.

So you're telling me you wouldn't trade Marion for a really good shot at Kobe and Eddy Curry?

The Suns aren't going to make the playoffs anyways. What's Marion bringing?

I'd jump all over this if I were the Suns.

And from the Bulls prospective, Marion ain't bad.
 

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That is the worst trade ever for the Suns. Marion is one of the best if not the best SF's in the game. You don't trade him for Curry who is inconsistent, Gill who is old, or Chandler who has a history of lower back problems. To say that proposal is a dream would be a stretch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Originally posted by <b>Chasemeifucan</b>!
That is the worst trade ever for the Suns. Marion is one of the best if not the best SF's in the game. You don't trade him for Curry who is inconsistent, Gill who is old, or Chandler who has a history of lower back problems. To say that proposal is a dream would be a stretch.
Yeah... I mean, that'd be like trading Marbury, one of the best PGs in the game, for an expiring salary, Howard Eisely, a rookie from poland and a couple of draft picks :)
 

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I see your point, but Eisley is not always hurt like Chandler. Point guards are a dime a dozen anyways. You can always get a point guard to step in (ie: Barbosa). However, you can't substitute guys like Marion. Especially for injury prone guys like Chandler who are already hurting at A YOUNG AGE.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Originally posted by <b>Chasemeifucan</b>!
I see your point, but Eisley is not always hurt like Chandler. Point guards are a dime a dozen anyways. You can always get a point guard to step in (ie: Barbosa). However, you can't substitute guys like Marion. Especially for injury prone guys like Chandler who are already hurting at A YOUNG AGE.
True, but 6'11 285lb centers like Curry aren't exactly a dime a dozen either :)

Nor is the kind of cap room necessary to get Kobe Bryant :)
 

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Kobe probably won't leave though and I don't think the Suns will take a chance on him until his legal problems are behind him. Colangelo is a no-nonsense type of owner.
 

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As a disinterested observer (Pistons fan), this trade looks terribly biased towards the Bulls. Marion is a star right now, with no questions of work ethic, character or development. Cap space is nice, but there are only two or three players in free agency even close to deserving max dollars. Nash is a possibility, but it's not likely he leaves Dallas. Martin plays the same position as Amare, so that won't work. This leave, basically, an unclear shot a Kobe. Do you trade a second tier superstar for an enigmatic prospect who's given plenty of reason for doubt and, say, a 1 out of 3 shot at Kobe? Considering how promising the Suns future looks in the current configuration, I sure wouldn't.
 

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It wouldn't surprise me to see the C's pull the trigger on a deal to unload Matrix, but looking at it from their perspective, I don't think that's the right deal.

90% of the Suns hope (from pretty much everyone EXCEPT Shawn, actually) is based on potential. It would seem to me more wise to keep the constant (and it's a good constant) in Shawn, and wait for your other young studs (Amare, Johnson, Barbosa, Lampe, Zarko) to develop.

I would have a hard time turning down Curry for just about anyone though.. Amare has developed a sweet jump hook, but a majority of his offense still comes off of dunks/facing the basket moves. Curry's game would actually not be a bad compliment to Amare's.. and maybe he just needs a change of scenery to come out of his funk..

Doesn't seem real likely to me, though, for what it's worth.. I can't imagine the C's endangering the fan base's love for the Suns twice in a short period of time.. they already lost fans from the Marbury trade, if they make another move that would be viewed on the surface as a "money deal", the effects could be disastrous..
 

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Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
Maybe Chandler instead of Curry would be slightly more likely.

I doubt that Curry or Chandler alone is enough for Marion.
i agree chandler is still young he needs to improve and after phoenix lost tehir star player, i don't think they would want to give up their new star player.
 

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Dunno about Curry for Marion.

Curry can score, but Suns will lose a scorer and a rebounder, not to mention a very versatile forward. Curry is just a scorer right now. It might be possible, depending on what other players are included or how desperate suns are for cap space.

But I'd keep marion till a better deal comes around.
 
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