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Discussion Starter #1
Blame KG for Ebi?

There was a Part II to the comments former NBA point guard and coach John Lucas made to the Houston Chronicle the other day about failed Wolves draft pick Ndudi Ebi. Lucas, who has helped counsel a number of players with chemical dependency problems, works with young players in the Houston area and reportedly will help Ebi develop his skills. Ebi, drafted out of Houston's Westbury Christian High School in 2003 as the 26th pick overall, has been working out at a rec center in the suburb of Bellaire.

Lucas -- whose son John, a quick point guard, was with the Wolves in the summer league and training camp -- blamed Ebi's decision to prematurely turn pro, in part, on the success that Garnett had doing precisely that eight years earlier.

"He may be a guy who hurt basketball," Lucas said of Garnett. "Because of his success, people began to look at athleticism rather than talent. But Garnett proved to be a rare case.

"Great basketball players were overlooked because NBA teams wanted athletes. NBA people thought that they could take size and athleticism and teach the skills, but Garnett was different. He had the total package."

Interesting theory, especially since Kevin McHale, Wolves VP of basketball operations, drafted them both.
Thats out of the star tribune. Interesting read. I mean he did open the gate for guys like Kobe and JO ect, it is just too many HSers think they can make the jump.. Truth is, if they are not a sure lottery pick, if not top 10 at that, they are not ready. Too many people around guys like Ebi want to be the guy who said "I am the one who told him that he should go" so when they are in a 6-year contract, there will be a present there waiting for them... But reality is, this could've just messed up his life, not just finacially but mentally. They has this mental mind set that they are good enough at this, and that they are too good for that ect... It is not KG's fault though, you can not blame a guy who is that gifted because someone has troubles making their own personal decisions... I could go for ever since I wrote a paper on this very subject, but I will allow you to take your own stand on this.
 

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Like you said, interesting article here.

It is really depending on individuals. Players like KG, Kobe, and Lebron they are ready to play in NBA mentally and physically. Ebi, like Dajuan Wagner, was not very ready to jump right away to the NBA from high school level. Like I said, it's really depending on each player and their making preparations and all that.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Wagner did play one year at Memphis, But I see what you mean.... There have been plenty who fall into the 2nd round or late 1st and sometimes undrafted.
 

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Dajuan or not, there are players are not very ready to play in this level. It doesn't matter how they fared in college or high school.

Pardon me for my mistake regarding Wagner, but yeah, I'm tryin' to emphasize about the preparation of every individuals.
 

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I was confused when I saw that headline this morning. But in a way I guess it's right. Alot of young guys are coming into the league way too early now, and I think it's making the league worse as well as hurting those young players' careers. And KG is pretty much what started that trend. Ya can't really blame him for it, but the article does make a valid point.
 

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Every potiental high school players can't go on and thinking I can go on into the NBA and play like Kevin Garnett and LeBron.

The funny thing was, prior to the draft night when Kevin was drafted, he received the news. He found out that he passed the test (either ACT or SAT), unlike he originally thought he did not. If the news he received not so late, he probably was going to college and the NBA. Sometimes things can be happening too fast, but hey, KG went on the good path into his 10th year in the league.

That's why most of us can't blame on him and why he opted out of going to college and played professionally right out from high school.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
KG is not to blame, it is themselves and the people around them, including coaches, that push them to think they are ready.. Also the media. They make a personal choice. KG just brings the idea out, it is them that need to know if they are ready. Lebron, Howard, Kobe, JO, ect ect have the physical ability and the mental ability.
 

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sheefo13 said:
Thats out of the star tribune. Interesting read. I mean he did open the gate for guys like Kobe and JO ect, it is just too many HSers think they can make the jump.. Truth is, if they are not a sure lottery pick, if not top 10 at that, they are not ready. Too many people around guys like Ebi want to be the guy who said "I am the one who told him that he should go" so when they are in a 6-year contract, there will be a present there waiting for them... But reality is, this could've just messed up his life, not just finacially but mentally. They has this mental mind set that they are good enough at this, and that they are too good for that ect... It is not KG's fault though, you can not blame a guy who is that gifted because someone has troubles making their own personal decisions... I could go for ever since I wrote a paper on this very subject, but I will allow you to take your own stand on this.
truth be told there aren't nearly as many Ebi's as the media makes it out to be

especially since the most HS'ers drafted in any given year was 6 in '04 I think
 

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The point of the article isn't just that there are lots of young guys coming out. Lucas is saying that after Garnett, many teams thought they could develop their own skilled, perimeter-oriented big man. However, it turns out that KG was a one-of-a-kind talent.

I must say, I couldn't agree more.

This is something that I picked up on last year while scouting. There are plenty of players that are tall, amazingly skilled and quite athletic, but there are only a handful that can effectively play a true perimeter game. Just look at the struggles of guys like Ebi, Darius Miles, Travis Outlaw, Jonathan Bender, and many more.

It is one thing to take a big man out on the perimeter and use athleticism/skill to blow by him. It is another thing entirely to do those things as a 6'10 guy against top level NBA guards on a nightly basis. Even Kevin Garnett's game is based in the paint. If players like Josh Smith and Marvin Williams don't realize this, they will go the way of Bender very soon.

The next time you sit down to watch a game and hear about how a certain player is "the next Garnett", watch closely. Is he basing his game off of fundamental post play, and bringing slower, thicker post players out on the perimeter? If he is attempting to play like a true guard, the odds of him turning out are almost nil.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Jonathan Watters said:
The point of the article isn't just that there are lots of young guys coming out. Lucas is saying that after Garnett, many teams thought they could develop their own skilled, perimeter-oriented big man. However, it turns out that KG was a one-of-a-kind talent.

I must say, I couldn't agree more.

This is something that I picked up on last year while scouting. There are plenty of players that are tall, amazingly skilled and quite athletic, but there are only a handful that can effectively play a true perimeter game. Just look at the struggles of guys like Ebi, Darius Miles, Travis Outlaw, Jonathan Bender, and many more.

It is one thing to take a big man out on the perimeter and use athleticism/skill to blow by him. It is another thing entirely to do those things as a 6'10 guy against top level NBA guards on a nightly basis. Even Kevin Garnett's game is based in the paint. If players like Josh Smith and Marvin Williams don't realize this, they will go the way of Bender very soon.

The next time you sit down to watch a game and hear about how a certain player is "the next Garnett", watch closely. Is he basing his game off of fundamental post play, and bringing slower, thicker post players out on the perimeter? If he is attempting to play like a true guard, the odds of him turning out are almost nil.

That is a great point. But I don't think we will another "next garnett" type anytime soon... Well I have not seen much of Oden quite yet.
 

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Does anyone know where Garnett would have gone if he attended college?

This is interesting. I've always felt it would help if the NBA required ALL players to attend an extensive pre-draft camp, maybe expand the events at Moody so that they last a whole week. Then, guys who rely on hype and hearsay won't have anywhere to hide. Too often, it seems that European players and high schoolers skip the pre-draft camps because they know it will expose their flaws. I think it is unfortunate that so many high schoolers do not understand the hard work KG had to put in to become the player he is now- things weren't just handed to him.
 

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Agent K said:
He would have played for the Michigan Wolverines
I thought I remembered hearing that the Kentucky Wildcats were a strong possibility, also...
 

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I'm of the opinion that the players are not to blame. They may be suffering from an inflated ego - influenced by the people around them; but ultimately the blame must go to the teams that draft them, and take the financial risk.

Looking at the big scheme of things, these kids are learning the hard way - and high schoolers today are thinking twice, with the knowledge that it's not a sure thing.
 
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