Professional and College Basketball Forums banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Sunlight in a distant sky
Joined
·
2,810 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
He only has 1 year left on his contract after this season at $5M.. turning 30

Would Songaila and Pike get it done ?

I know .. I know .. the Kings let him go but the need a passing big man on the frontline not named Brad Miller ..and it ain't Scoreless, KennyMiniMe or Reef Rahim

The Kings get two face up shooters to complement KennyMiniMe's face up game ..Allen is a fair rebounder ( and would back upBrad Miller ) and Songaila would be the best passer they got outside of Brad Miller

I'd do it in a flash if we could

See..if you say we need a vet defensive big and he's half decent you going to be paying at least $3M to $4M a year

He earns $5M for one season and sucks up at least say $4M that would ( in theory ) be allocated for a Tony Battie / Lorenzen Wright type

So he earns $1M more for one season - more than what had been allocated . No big deal.

He's just the guy we need and a guy that could really benefit Tyson with some further muscle and defense upfront

For this season Malik Allen would have to step into the breach and be our shooting bigman ..or Tim Thomas if he can get his crap soughted out
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,148 Posts
SausageKingofChicago said:
He only has 1 year left on his contract after this season at $5M.. turning 30

Would Songaila and Pike get it done ?

I know .. I know .. the Kings let him go but the need a passing big man on the frontline not named Brad Miller ..and it ain't Scoreless, KennyMiniMe or Reef Rahim

The Kings get two face up shooters to complement KennyMiniMe's face up game ..Allen is a fair rebounder ( and would back upBrad Miller ) and Songaila would be the best passer they got outside of Brad Miller

I'd do it in a flash if we could

See..if you say we need a vet defensive big and he's half decent you going to be paying at least $3M to $4M a year

He earns $5M for one season and sucks up at least say $4M that would ( in theory ) be allocated for a Tony Battie / Lorenzen Wright type

So he earns $1M more for one season - more than what had been allocated . No big deal.

He's just the guy we need and a guy that could really benefit Tyson with some further muscle and defense upfront

For this season Malik Allen would have to step into the breach and be our shooting bigman ..or Tim Thomas if he can get his crap soughted out
I wouldn't deal Songaila for Skinner, and I don't think it would take Songaila to get him either. 5 million is steep for what he brings, and I bet the Kings would be happy to be rid of the contract. Allen and Pike would probably do it, but do we want that 5 million on the books next year?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,148 Posts
ace20004u said:
We released Skinner as a throw in before, why would we trade for him now?
Why does it matter? That was a) a move made by a different GM and b) a totally different set of circumstances.

Why form an opinion regarding Skinner based on that?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
8,802 Posts
jbulls said:
Why does it matter? That was a) a move made by a different GM and b) a totally different set of circumstances.

Why form an opinion regarding Skinner based on that?
I like Skinner but it seems clear that the Bulls scouting brass don't. Sure, the GM has changed but we still have a lot of the same scouts on board so I doubt the orginizations opinion of him has changed much..
 

·
Sunlight in a distant sky
Joined
·
2,810 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
ace20004u said:
I like Skinner but it seems clear that the Bulls scouting brass don't. Sure, the GM has changed but we still have a lot of the same scouts on board so I doubt the orginizations opinion of him has changed much..
Scouts get it wrong a lot of the time

Have a look at 2nd round success stories and late 1st round gems in recent years

The undrafted like Ben Wallace ..Brad Miller etc

The long line of lottery busts

Fact is Skinner was an unproven and unknown quantity when we released him ..so was Bruce Bowen

By your rationale I guess we would not trade for Bruce Bowen either
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,148 Posts
ace20004u said:
I like Skinner but it seems clear that the Bulls scouting brass don't. Sure, the GM has changed but we still have a lot of the same scouts on board so I doubt the orginizations opinion of him has changed much..
Given Skinner's contract I'm not really sure is he's worth it, but I just don't see how releasing him 4 years ago is relevant.

At that time, Skinner was a third year player who'd never played more than 39 games in a season or averaged more than 5.4 points, we'd just drafted 2 big men. Since then he's established himself as a decent interior presence, averaging 10 and 7 with Milwaukee over a season and 7 and 9 last year with Sacramento.

There's a lot of evidence that suggests pretty strongly that Paxson and Krause have very different opinions on a lot of players. We've got a need right now (defensive presence at the 5, rebounding), Skinner seems like a guy who's not getting PT in the Kings frontcourt and could help us. Paxson has gutted the team of every single Krause acquisition outside of Tyson Chandler, the idea that he wouldn't consider dealing for Skinner because Krause released him when he was a trade throw in 4 years ago seems a little silly...
 

·
Sunlight in a distant sky
Joined
·
2,810 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
jbulls said:
I wouldn't deal Songaila for Skinner, and I don't think it would take Songaila to get him either. 5 million is steep for what he brings, and I bet the Kings would be happy to be rid of the contract. Allen and Pike would probably do it, but do we want that 5 million on the books next year?
Kings need another passing bigman on the frontline . They screwed up in not retaining Songaila given their system/style of play

But Skinner is a big body back up. So is Malik Allen

So yeah I think Malik Allen gives them a rebounding face up shooting big man that they could use ..but they have got more need for a passing big man

I'm kind of reticient to give up 2 x bigs for one and would prefer to deal Pike with Songaila - to give them value but also to retain Allen as the 5th big

Chandler and Skinner backed by Sweetney Harrington and Allen is fine by me

How much do you think we will have to pay for a big next year ?

And how much do you think a big like Skinner is worth ?

I say he's in a $3.5M to $4M value range over the next few years if he gives you 8 and 8 and 1.5bpg in 25mpg.

To me we need a vet defensive big and I'd rather overpay him by $1M rather than spend similar money on Tony Battie or Lorenzen Wright..or overpay for much longer term for Joel Pryzibilla or Nene at over the market odds at $8M per

We get a vet defensive big at reasonable cost ..add a big through the draft and continue to develop with Tyson and Sweetney and keep Othella as a reserve post scorer .. and add a shooting big across the 3 and 4 spots

We really don't need to do anything glamorous to our frontline IMO - just a vet defensive big and a the best big available with the Knicks pick in the draft...and that's it
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,148 Posts
SausageKingofChicago said:
Scouts get it wrong a lot of the time

Have a look at 2nd round success stories and late 1st round gems in recent years

The undrafted like Ben Wallace ..Brad Miller etc

The long line of lottery busts

Fact is Skinner was an unproven and unknown quantity when we released him ..so was Bruce Bowen

By your rationale I guess we would not trade for Bruce Bowen either
I believe we also cut Bonzi Wells in camp one year.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,148 Posts
SausageKingofChicago said:
Kings need another passing bigman on the frontline . They screwed up in not retaining Songaila given their system/style of play

But Skinner is a big body back up. So is Malik Allen

So yeah I think Malik Allen gives them a rebounding face up shooting big man that they could use ..but they have got more need for a passing big man

I'm kind of reticient to give up 2 x bigs for one and would prefer to deal Pike with Songaila - to give them value but also to retain Allen as the 5th big

Chandler and Skinner backed by Sweetney Harrington and Allen is fine by me

How much do you think we will have to pay for a big next year ?

And how much do you think a big like Skinner is worth ?

I say he's in a $3.5M to $4M value range over the next few years if he gives you 8 and 8 and 1.5bpg in 25mpg.

To me we need a vet defensive big and I'd rather overpay him by $1M rather than spend similar money on Tony Battie or Lorenzen Wright..or overpay for much longer term for Joel Pryzibilla or Nene at over the market odds at $8M per

We get a vet defensive big at reasonable cost ..add a big through the draft and continue to develop with Tyson and Sweetney and keep Othella as a reserve post scorer .. and add a shooting big across the 3 and 4 spots

We really don't need to do anything glamorous to our frontline IMO - just a vet defensive big and a the best big available with the Knicks pick in the draft...and that's it
A couple of days ago I posted advocating a deal for Skinner or Etan Thomas, I like Skinner fine. My points are as follows:

1. We wouldn't have to give up Songaila. The Kings are probably quite eager to get rid of a guy who's not in their rotation and will collect 5 million dollars next year. We could probably get him for a big of Doritos if we didn't have to get salaries to match.

2. As far as the salary goes, I bet market value is about 3 million a year for Skinner. I don't mind paying him 5 million next year as long as it doesn't hamstring us in free agency - I'm not sure if it would or not, I haven't really looked at the numbers and the potential free agent class, nor do I know what Pax wants to do.
 

·
Sunlight in a distant sky
Joined
·
2,810 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
jbulls said:
A couple of days ago I posted advocating a deal for Skinner or Etan Thomas, I like Skinner fine. My points are as follows:

1. We wouldn't have to give up Songaila. The Kings are probably quite eager to get rid of a guy who's not in their rotation and will collect 5 million dollars next year. We could probably get him for a big of Doritos if we didn't have to get salaries to match.

2. As far as the salary goes, I bet market value is about 3 million a year for Skinner. I don't mind paying him 5 million next year as long as it doesn't hamstring us in free agency - I'm not sure if it would or not, I haven't really looked at the numbers and the potential free agent class, nor do I know what Pax wants to do.
Yeah if we didn't have to give up Darius ..well and good

I am just saying I would to do the deal

And yeah I put Skinner at $3M to $4M ..I think closer to $4M given that guys like Othella are paid $3M per and James got paid $5M ( principally for his size )

I think Skinner is better than both players in what he can bring us

So let's say he's worth marginally more than Othella ... at $3.5M

If we overpay for one year at $1.5M I could not give a stuff and think that it does not impact on us in free agency one bit

I stress.. a guy like this could really allow Tyson to come into his own a lot more
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top