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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
. . . could they resign him to anything more than the MLE?

His bird rights wouldn't transfer would they? So, if we did a direct trade (not sign and trade) then NJ would surely lose him, unless he decided to stay for the MLE.

Second question, could we do a sign and trade at this point in the season with Rasheed? If we did, then which salary number (current or extended) do you use for calculating the cap numbers for the trade?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Originally posted by <b>Schilly</b>!
Bird rights do transfer.
So NJ could resign him and go (stay) over the cap?
 

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Originally posted by <b>Reep</b>!


So NJ could resign him and go (stay) over the cap?
Yep.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Okay here it goes. It's three-way Friday:

We know that NJ is at least a little interested in Sheed because they have had the KMart discussion. They can also likely resign him for less than KMart. But KMart is not a good fit for us, so . . . how about these three ways.


TRADE 1

Portland trades:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 38.6 minutes)
and Memphis' first round pick
Portland receives:
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34.7 minutes)
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
C DeSagana Diop (2.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
SG Dajuan Wagner (2.0 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 0.0 apg in 8.0 minutes)

New Jersey trades:
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 35.8 minutes)
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34.7 minutes)
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
New Jersey receives:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 33 games)
Memphis' first round pick

Cleveland trades:
C DeSagana Diop (2.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
SG Dajuan Wagner (2.0 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 0.0 apg in 8.0 minutes)
Cleveland receives:
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 29 games)

TRADE ACCEPTED



TRADE 2

Portland trades:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Memphis' first round pick
Portland receives:
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34.7 minutes)
SF Nikoloz Tskitishvili (3.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 0.4 apg in 8.9 minutes)
PF Nene Hilario (3.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 0.4 apg in 8.9 minutes)

New Jersey trades:
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 35.8 minutes)
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34.7 minutes)
New Jersey receives:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 33 games)
Memphis' first round pick

Denver trades:
SF Nikoloz Tskitishvili (3.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 0.4 apg in 8.9 minutes)
PF Nene Hilario (3.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 0.4 apg in 8.9 minutes)
Denver receives:
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 29 games)

TRADE ACCEPTED


TRADE 3 (in my dreams . . .)

Portland trades:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 38.6 minutes)
Memphis' first round pick
Portland receives:
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
SG Tracy McGrady (25.2 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)

New Jersey trades:
PF Aaron Williams (6.8 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.1 apg in 19.4 minutes)
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 35.8 minutes)
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34.7 minutes)
New Jersey receives:
SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 33 games)
PG Shammond Williams (5.7 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 2.3 apg in 22 games)

Orlando trades:
PG Shammond Williams (5.7 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 2.3 apg in 17.9 minutes)
SG Tracy McGrady (25.2 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)
Orlando receives:
PF Kenyon Martin (17.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 2.5 apg in 29 games)
SG Kerry Kittles (12.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 2.7 apg in 34 games)
Memphis' first round pick

TRADE ACCEPTED
 

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I do like #3 but I am not sure what we would do with Aaron Williams



In sticking with the thread title, I still like a three way NJ-Memphis-Portland deal

principal players
NJ gets Sheed
Memphis get Martin + some filler from NJ + maybe a player from Portland ... Q?
Portland gets SG Kittles and Memphis players.. maybe SF Mike Miller and Battier
Alternatively Portland gets Kittles and Lorenzen Wright and Battier

ROSTER #1
PG Stoudamire, McInnis
SG Kittles, DA, Person
SF Miller, Battier, Patterson, Woods
PF Randolph, Davis
C ?, Stepania

IR Vranes, Outlaw


I also think Patterson, & Woods can be traded for a center thus moving Davis back to shorter minutes at the PF spot behind Randolph. He is more a PF than C anyways
We could add in another player as well to upgrade the C


As an alternate as suggested above
ROSTER #2
PG Stoudamire, McInnis
SG Kittles, DA, Person
SF Battier, Patterson, Woods
PF Randolph, Davis
C Wright, Stepania

IR Vranes, Outlaw

I actually like #2 best... Wright can be a decent center and allow Dale to backup Zach for a year or two more. Battier is msart and coudl be a good SF. This could be a very good shoooting team with Kittles, DA and Person at the 2 spot
 

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Originally posted by <b>Trader Bob</b>!
I do like #3 but I am not sure what we would do with Aaron Williams
Portland parlays Rasheed Wallace into Tracy McGrady and you're worried about what Portland does with Aaron Williams? ;)

I don't think Trade 3 is even a shadow of a possibility. Just scope it for a second from Orlando's end...they trade McGrady and Shammond for....Kenyon Martin and Kittles? Kittles may be a bit better than Shammond Williams, but Martin isn't even the same zip code of talent as McGrady.

Orlando may as well just let McGrady walk as do this deal, and work on opening cap room again.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!

Portland parlays Rasheed Wallace into Tracy McGrady and you're worried about what Portland does with Aaron Williams? ;)
:laugh:


Honestly, the only way I could have seen Orlando give McGrady away would have been if they had set a new record for losses (7-75 or the like). Now that they're winning again, no way.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!

Portland parlays Rasheed Wallace into Tracy McGrady and you're worried about what Portland does with Aaron Williams? ;)
Uncle :D

worried is a bit strong... I said not sure... Aaron can be backup behind Zach... good D and hustle ;)

And I agree.. Orlando does need more...
 

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Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
Orlando may as well just let McGrady walk as do this deal, and work on opening cap room again.
It would take them 2 seasons if they can't unload Grant Hill. He signed the same contract as T-Mac, and I doubt he is opting out. He is the rare athlete though that might, as he offered to restructure his contract with the Magic so they could get help.

-Petey
 

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Originally posted by <b>Petey</b>!
He is the rare athlete though that might, as he offered to restructure his contract with the Magic so they could get help.
Maybe a capologist can confirm this, but I think the reason this is rare in the league, is because it's not permitted under the CBA. It is permitted in the NFL and guys do it all the time, often several times over the length of a single contract.

STOMP
 

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orlando already has both drew gooden and juwan howard, two people they had pretty high hopes for and altho they certainly arent meeting expectations, they also play the same positition as kmart making it pretty pointless to trade their superstar away like that. same kinda goes for trade number 1, cleveland already has carlos boozer whos putting up very decent numbers this year and looks to be improving, and i really dont think cleveland would really be bettering their win column and would be losing a potential star in dajuan wagner.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Petey</b>!

It would take them 2 seasons if they can't unload Grant Hill. He signed the same contract as T-Mac, and I doubt he is opting out.
I agree that it would take a couple seasons. If I were the Magic, I'd appeal to McGrady not to opt out, be up front that they're looking to trade him (for his benefit and theirs, since neither side can be very happy atm) and then either let him walk with Grant Hill in two seasons, or hope they can get another superstar in a trade for McGrady.

What I wouldn't do, under any circumstances, is trade him for a player (or players) of equal salary who isn't nearly as talented and doesn't immediately expire. That would be the very best way to ensure a terrible team for years.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!


I agree that it would take a couple seasons. If I were the Magic, I'd appeal to McGrady not to opt out, be up front that they're looking to trade him (for his benefit and theirs, since neither side can be very happy atm) and then either let him walk with Grant Hill in two seasons, or hope they can get another superstar in a trade for McGrady.

What I wouldn't do, under any circumstances, is trade him for a player (or players) of equal salary who isn't nearly as talented and doesn't immediately expire. That would be the very best way to ensure a terrible team for years.
I don't think another superstar in Orlando would help. I'd think they would be better off trading for Barbosa, and Amare (besides expiring) or a similar package of guys still on their rookie contracts when Hill comes off. That keeps their space and allows them to go after a max player to compliment Amare.

-Petey
 

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Originally posted by <b>Petey</b>!


I don't think another superstar in Orlando would help.
I think a superstar without Grant Hill's contract on the books, would help. They can still have one superstar and cap room to build around him.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
I think a superstar without Grant Hill's contract on the books, would help. They can still have one superstar and cap room to build around him.
You know, with the Knicks trading for both Penny and Marbury, perhaps there is a team whom would trade for both.

-Petey
 

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Since Orlando has McGrady and Hill on the books for 3 more seasons including this one... lets get them out of cap hell

Portland trades: SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 38.6 minutes)
PG Damon Stoudamire (12.7 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 5.8 apg in 37.9 minutes)
Portland receives: SG Tracy McGrady (25.5 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)
SG Grant Hill (25.5 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -4.0 ppg, -4.0 rpg, and -2.7 apg.

Orlando trades: SG Tracy McGrady (25.5 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)
SG Grant Hill (25.5 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.8 apg in 39.4 minutes)
Orlando receives: SF Rasheed Wallace (16.8 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.7 apg in 33 games)
PG Damon Stoudamire (12.7 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 5.8 apg in 34 games)
Change in team outlook: +4.0 ppg, +4.0 rpg, and +2.7 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED



They drop the salary much faster. We get a superstar in TMAC
They get a great player in Sheed and can resign him much cheaper

This is essentially SHeed and Damon for TMac. I do not think Hill has any value with his injury problems and the league denying him a medical exception if I remember correctly

We can even throw in a draft pick
 

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Originally posted by <b>Petey</b>!


You know, with the Knicks trading for both Penny and Marbury, perhaps there is a team whom would trade for both.
I'd happily trade for both, if the cap room would tempt Orlando to deal McGrady. Hill clears in two years, McGrady, if he's re-signed, will be great for years.

McGrady and Randolph would be one hell of a foundation.

Using Wallace, Portland can help Orlando really clear the decks, cap-wise.
 
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