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Krause had rebuilt this Bulls team perfectly. Trading Brand for Chandler, drafting Curry and JWill, trading for Rose, and NOT letting MJ make managerial decisions were all superior decisions by Krause.

Four years. That's how long the rebuilding took. Four years.

It took the Lakers TWELVE years (between titles) to rebuild and that was only 12 years only because Shaq knocked on their door because he wanted to make movies and rap CDs. If not for that bit of luck, they'd still be on the outside looking in.

See you in the playoffs,

Gaucho Maniac
 

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I agree with you 100%, except for we haven't won another championship. All of our core pieces are in place, which is what I assume you mean.
 

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Let's not put the cart before the horse.

While the future looks bright, the Bulls have still not played in a playoff game, yet alone sniffed a 7th championship. A lot can still happen to derail this train.
 

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True, but you gotta admit that JK, in spite of his faults, is a basketball genius.
 

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Originally posted by Gaucho Maniac
Krause had rebuilt this Bulls team perfectly. Trading Brand for Chandler, drafting Curry and JWill, trading for Rose, and NOT letting MJ make managerial decisions were all superior decisions by Krause.
What about his superior management decisions to offer max deals to Grant Hill, Tim Thomas, Eddie Jones, and near max deals to Glen Rice and Antonio Davis?

It's not through lack of trying that Chicago isn't capped out with Thomas and Hill right now, so before you go tooting Krause's horn, you might consider the fact that luck has had quite a bit to do with his success.

Four years. That's how long the rebuilding took. Four years.
I didn't realize we'd already won next year's championship.

It took the Lakers TWELVE years (between titles) to rebuild and that was only 12 years only because Shaq knocked on their door because he wanted to make movies and rap CDs. If not for that bit of luck, they'd still be on the outside looking in.
Luck like Tim Thomas having a last second change of heart after agreeing to take a huge chunk of the Bulls money?
 

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how has our rebuilding compared with that of other storied championship teams??


since the Lakers are the only team to return to championship form in recent history. what about returning to solid playoff contender??

how long did it take --

the Pistons
the Celtics
the Rockets


to return even to respectability??
 

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Wait a minute? Krause is getting blamed for offering Thomas, Jones, Hill and Glen Rice large contracts? What about the teams that actually signed them? Shouldn't Milwaukee be consiederd even worse for actually signing their 6th man for that much money? Should Krause get blamed for JuWan Howard and Nick Van Exels contracts b/c he scouted them once in college?

I know a lot of people hate Krause and that's fine. I don't care. I'd rather have him as a GM than almost anyone else. But now he's being criticized for contract offers that didn't get signed. I guess he should be blamed for almost trading Pippen for Shawn Kemp, too. :upset:
 

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Re: Re: Krause's Brilliance Cannot Be Denied

Originally posted by Mikedc


What about his superior management decisions to offer max deals to Grant Hill, Tim Thomas, Eddie Jones, and near max deals to Glen Rice and Antonio Davis?

It's not through lack of trying that Chicago isn't capped out with Thomas and Hill right now, so before you go tooting Krause's horn, you might consider the fact that luck has had quite a bit to do with his success.



I didn't realize we'd already won next year's championship.



Luck like Tim Thomas having a last second change of heart after agreeing to take a huge chunk of the Bulls money?
Yeah, what comes to my mind is, when we pray to God for some things and wonder why he did not answer some of our prayers, when in actuality, he did......he KNEW if he had answer those prayers as we had desired, that it would not have been good for us. wow, where'd that come from? LOL I agree guys, the rebuilding time is measured "in between" championships....I believe we will still be in it two years to come....at least! LOL:yes:
 

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Originally posted by Wishbone
how has our rebuilding compared with that of other storied championship teams??



the Celtics

to return even to respectability??
Here's a quote from one of Bill Simmon's columns about the Celtics. He's a Celts fan:

And nobody knows this game than Boston fans, where the post-Bird Celtics were saddled by clunker contracts to Dee Brown, Dana Barros, Dino Radja, Xavier McDaniel, Dominique Wilkins, Anderson, Walter McCarty, Potapenko ... the only deadbeats missing were Michael Jackson and Mariah Carey. For nearly a decade, we were in Basketball Hell. Instead of wondering if we might make the playoffs again, we were wondering things like, "If so-and-so suffered an unfortunate hunting accident, would his contract come off the cap?" and "Can we hire Jeff Gillooly and Shawn Eckardt as team trainers?"
Even the greatest NBA dynasty had to endure some garbage. I think the fact that the bUlls have a team to be excited about, not necessarily a great team yet, but one to really cheer for after only 4 years is a sign that Krause is doing a good job.
 

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Originally posted by Lizzy
Wait a minute? Krause is getting blamed for offering Thomas, Jones, Hill and Glen Rice large contracts? What about the teams that actually signed them?
What about them? I'm not concerned about some other team offering a player too much money... I'm concerned about my team offering a player too much money.

Shouldn't Milwaukee be consiederd even worse for actually signing their 6th man for that much money?
No. The fact that Milwaukee actually signed Thomas is dependent only on the fact that Thomas accepted Milwaukee's offer (which was about equal to the Bulls).

If I jump off a cliff and miraculously happen to be unhurt by the fall, it doesn't make my decision any better than the guy who jumped off right next to me and broke his neck. It just makes me luckier.

Should Krause get blamed for JuWan Howard and Nick Van Exels contracts b/c he scouted them once in college?
Obviously, no.

I know a lot of people hate Krause and that's fine. I don't care.
And similarly, I observe that a lot of people are unwilling to consider any criticism of him as having any validity.

I'd rather have him as a GM than almost anyone else. But now he's being criticized for contract offers that didn't get signed. I guess he should be blamed for almost trading Pippen for Shawn Kemp, too. :upset:
Well, was it Krause that pulled out of that deal, or the Sonics (I can't remember)? If Krause tried to do it, but the Sonics pulled out, then I think Krause is blameworthy. If Krause merely considered it, but then said no, he deserves praise.

The larger point is that one can't simply look at how things have panned out. One has to look at the active choices Krause (or anyone else, for that matter) has made, given the possibilities available at that given moment.
 

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good point, Lizzy. By the way, it was Krause who pulled out of the Kemp deal as I hear it, Mikedc.
 

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I think there are FAR more Bulls fans that hate Krause than fans that like him. I think he's made mistakes and he's not blame free but it seems that it's in vogue to blame him for everything bad that happens to the team. With that, I disagree.
 

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i have said many times. JK is not free from blame. He has his faults!! But he is not to blame for everything just because someone says so!
 

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The difference between the mistakes Krause makes and those of others is that he recovers quickly...

...he researches the options well, and always seems to have a contingency in case of emergency or mis-handling. Many thought Hill would be worth the MAX. Timmy Thomas may be -- if he could get out from behind the shadow of Big Dog.

I have an alternate hypothesis. I believe that once the other GMs changed the CBA to prevent Krause's master plan, he purposefully drove up salaries all around the league to cap out every other team. Now -- a couple of years later -- he has everyone in the league capped out with mediocore talent while he grows his own kids at home.

That, my friends, is my version of genius. :grinning:
 

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Those teams will be ready to sign FAs again as soon as Curry and Chandler come out of their rookie deals. :)

I hope the CBA changes somewhat. I think player movement is too restrictive and the penalty for taking a chance is way too stiff. You have too many GMs sitting on their hands it is ridiculous.

I think the Luxury tax is going to stay but player movement will be better when a new CBA is done. Matching salaries is a foolish way to allow trading.
 

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Originally posted by Wynn
The difference between the mistakes Krause makes and those of others is that he recovers quickly...

...he researches the options well, and always seems to have a contingency in case of emergency or mis-handling. Many thought Hill would be worth the MAX. Timmy Thomas may be -- if he could get out from behind the shadow of Big Dog.

I have an alternate hypothesis. I believe that once the other GMs changed the CBA to prevent Krause's master plan, he purposefully drove up salaries all around the league to cap out every other team. Now -- a couple of years later -- he has everyone in the league capped out with mediocore talent while he grows his own kids at home.

That, my friends, is my version of genius. :grinning:
Wynn, this is really intelligent stuff. Not sure about the other teams thwarting Krause, but maybe, maybe not. The rest, you got some brains buddy, excellent post.
 

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Originally posted by truebluefan
i have said many times. JK is not free from blame. He has his faults!! But he is not to blame for everything just because someone says so!
Nobody's perfect trueblue and remember, the draft is total speculation. Still, if someone compiled a comparative list of different teams activity, we'd be at or near the very top.
 

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Brilliant?

Things look alot brighter now but we're still talking about potential and not actual wins. I think we can all say the last four years have been filled with truly horrible basketball games. Sure we've had some glimmers of hope but mostly we saw the Bulls get their arses handed to them.

The first team was built to lose and often it is very difficult to get out of that mindset. I will never forgive Krause for that team after the championships. It was built to lose and I disagree with that mentality.

Don't get me wrong, I have faith in the Bull's future but it's a long road to ahead. Shaq isn't shaking just yet about the Bulls youngins. Until Jerry wins those next championships, I still remain skeptical about the penguin. Once bitten, twice shy, you might say.
 

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Lizzy, you make some excellent points in Krause's behalf. Kudos to you. I agree that Krause has made a some mistakes along the way, but there's no denying that the guy knows that he's doing. As far as his attempts to court or sign players like Antonio Davis and Tim Thomas, that's nothing more than media heresay. In fact, Krause never tendered an offical offer to either of those players. Antonio Davis tired to play Krause just to drive up his market value and it worked, because the Raptors ended paying him way more than he was worth. Thomas decided to play in Milwaukee for less money (than what the Bulls had allegedly offered) for reasons that are only known to him. Perhaps he felt that he would have a better chance of winning a ring with the Bucks, than with the Bulls. As for McGrady, Hill, and Jones. Krause tried to get each of there players, but was not successful. He tried to spend the money, but they wanted to play elsewhere. And no one could have predicted that Grant Hill would have turned out as he did. McGrady wanted to play in his hometown state and Jones wanted to play for Riles. Now they all stuck on teams who will not win a title before the Bulls do.

Whether you like Krause or not, he knows how to put together a championship caliber team. Krause is clearly from the school of thought that believes that anything less than an NBA title is losing. Which is why Krause refuse to re-sign Pippen to a long term deal. He knew that we couldn't carry a team on his own. And getting to the playoffs only to be eventually eliminated, would be cruel and unusual punishment.

Now Krause has assembled a team that is not only capable of winning a championship in a couple/few years, but one that is exiciting, diverse, deep, and will not be held hostage to extraordinary salary demands when then Bulls are poised to make their run.
 
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