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But it is sufficient. Even if the rule doesn't explicitly say "private messages," it's certainly implied or could be interpreted that way. And even if you (the proverbial "you") don't grasp the implication in that rule already posted -- which is don't deliberately spam advertisements or steer traffic away from the forum out of pure spite -- it should be basic common sense.
Was it "out of pure spite"?

Do you even KNOW ABM?

I don't know him that well, but I've hung with him a few times, and I have been reading his posts for years now. While no one is perfect, I think that "spite" and "ABM" are words that have rarely been linked.

I am under the impression that he wanted to offer another option to Blazers fans who enjoyed talking about politics and everything else with other Blazers fans. Is this against the rules? Evidently.

Does it follow that it was out of pure spite? Definitely not.

You don't like sites with vague rules? Here's a dandy from the site where ABM's posting right now.
That is ambiguous, no doubt. Any site on the Web is going to have ambiguities. The enforcement and communication regarding those ambiguities are just as important--if not moreso--than the rules themselves.

But in THIS case, specific language was quoted as THE reason that ABM was banned.

(Incidentally, I don't like the word "banned" here... "Banned" seems permanent, when it evidently isn't always. It's too bad there's not a "Suspended" status when the banning is NOT permanent.)

Lollerz, Ed. I couldn't make it up if I tried. And I'm not laughing at how they spelled "judgments."
One of the first things they taught me in law school was how to spell "judgment"... unless someone is Canadian, there's no defense. And there's little defense for being Canadian.

With that being said, reading the grammar and punctuation of this site's FAQ is a bit of a joke, too, so I don't think that you ought to cast stones about an alternate (if strictly, IMO, incorrect) spelling. :)

Ed O.
 

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Links to other message boards; not just links in general. Sorry I didn't make that clarification.
So does this mean like it can't be a message board about german shepherds? Or just sports? And if just sports does that mean you can't have like a strictly boxing message board? Not being a smart *** at all, I just want to know the rule for the future.
 

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Mr Basel, I haven't been on here as long or as often as a lot of you guys. But in my opinion, this is getting out of hand. I had never seen you on here before until a couple days ago.
Let me address this issue as it seems many have the same question as to why Basel has been assisting with our forum and may have appeared out of no where to many of you. I have been out of town on and off for the last 3 weeks due to two deaths in my family, thus Basel has kindly stepped into my role as CM for this forum and others.
 

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As a former supporter of this site and long time member, please consider my concerns:

1) Blazer fans are not asking for special treatment, just a complete listing of the rules and enforcement of the rules as they are printed. If you have unwritten policies then you better get them into the rules, and then the market can decide if we want to play by those rules or go elsewhere.

2) Your site will or won't continue based on your service to the forum members in general. It will not happen by suppression. People will not leave this site if is is a better product. If it is a worse product, then no amount of censoring or suspension will save you.

3) This is a forum. That implies free speech. I can understand rules against certain kinds of unprotected speach (racial hate, pornographic, etc.). But, commercial speech from one member to a limited list of friends should not be limited.

Admins better loosen their grip or you can kiss this site bye-bye.
 

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As a former supporter of this site and long time member, please consider my concerns:

1) Blazer fans are not asking for special treatment, just a complete listing of the rules and enforcement of the rules as they are printed. If you have unwritten policies then you better get them into the rules, and then the market can decide if we want to play by those rules or go elsewhere.

2) Your site will or won't continue based on your service to the forum members in general. It will not happen by suppression. People will not leave this site if is is a better product. If it is a worse product, then no amount of censoring or suspension will save you.

3) This is a forum. That implies free speech. I can understand rules against certain kinds of unprotected speach (racial hate, pornographic, etc.). But, commercial speech from one member to a limited list of friends should not be limited.

Admins better loosen their grip or you can kiss this site bye-bye.
:clap::clap:
 

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Legal Smeagol
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As a former supporter of this site and long time member, please consider my concerns:

1) Blazer fans are not asking for special treatment, just a complete listing of the rules and enforcement of the rules as they are printed. If you have unwritten policies then you better get them into the rules, and then the market can decide if we want to play by those rules or go elsewhere.

2) Your site will or won't continue based on your service to the forum members in general. It will not happen by suppression. People will not leave this site if is is a better product. If it is a worse product, then no amount of censoring or suspension will save you.

3) This is a forum. That implies free speech. I can understand rules against certain kinds of unprotected speach (racial hate, pornographic, etc.). But, commercial speech from one member to a limited list of friends should not be limited.

Admins better loosen their grip or you can kiss this site bye-bye.
Regarding point three, I'm afraid that the implication you derive is completely incorrect as it relates to general First Amendment applicability and jurisprudence, not limited to applicable commercial speech doctrines. Posting on a website, whether it be here or any other, is a privilege granted by the site owners, subject to certain conditions. It is not a 'public forum' as would be a town square or other governmentally-controlled space, but a commercial site which can institute policies without regard to the restrictions that a governmental entity would have to comply with vis a vis free speech considerations.

In point of fact, there would not be any justification under 1st Amendment doctrine (much less international norms) that applies in any event, as the commercial nature of the site grants plenary power within, ESPECIALLY to control commercial speech that is directly adverse to the site. That should be self-evident from the fact that all website forums are to a varying degree commercial enterprises.

If you would like to understand more of how free speech is actually applicable (in concept, not as any legal or quasi-legal doctrine) feel free to inquire further. Having spent the night and morning responding to requests of several Congressmen regarding a key free speech issue, I will gladly run the course of free speech in America from Zenger's Case through recent cyberlaw decision from various federal jurisdictions.

I hope we can have a productive dialogue, seeing as how you're clearly interested in the subject.
 

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Regarding point three, I'm afraid that the implication you derive is completely incorrect as it relates to general First Amendment applicability and jurisprudence, not limited to applicable commercial speech doctrines. Posting on a website, whether it be here or any other, is a privilege granted by the site owners, subject to certain conditions. It is not a 'public forum' as would be a town square or other governmentally-controlled space, but a commercial site which can institute policies without regard to the restrictions that a governmental entity would have to comply with vis a vis free speech considerations.

In point of fact, there would not be any justification under 1st Amendment doctrine (much less international norms) that applies in any event, as the commercial nature of the site grants plenary power within, ESPECIALLY to control commercial speech that is directly adverse to the site. That should be self-evident from the fact that all website forums are to a varying degree commercial enterprises.

If you would like to understand more of how free speech is actually applicable (in concept, not as any legal or quasi-legal doctrine) feel free to inquire further. Having spent the night and morning responding to requests of several Congressmen regarding a key free speech issue, I will gladly run the course of free speech in America from Zenger's Case through recent cyberlaw decision from various federal jurisdictions.

I hope we can have a productive dialogue, seeing as how you're clearly interested in the subject.

Very impressive and you are completely correct. And, your attitude is exactly why so many people are leaving. This is a private site, that is operated to look somewhat like a public forum (social not legal definition). As you, within your legal rights, legally close your fist on people's content, why would they stay when there are numerous other alternatives where they can communicate how they like? The only thing that keeps them here are the other posters. As soon as a critical mass leaves, then it is too late.

This is where it is important to balance customer service, competitor benchmarking and other market considerations. You had market domination (at least for a very large Blazer forum). You became too heavy handed (prideful?) and next thing you know it's gone. Maybe you can rebuild it with newbs, but you could have had growth.
 

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Legal Smeagol
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Very impressive and you are completely correct. And, your attitude is exactly why so many people are leaving. This is a private site, that is operated to look somewhat like a public forum (social not legal definition). As you, within your legal rights, legally close your fist on people's content, why would they stay when there are numerous other alternatives where they can communicate how they like? The only thing that keeps them here are the other posters. As soon as a critical mass leaves, then it is too late.

This is where it is important to balance customer service, competitor benchmarking and other market considerations. You had market domination (at least for a very large Blazer forum). You became too heavy handed (prideful?) and next thing you know it's gone. Maybe you can rebuild it with newbs, but you could have had growth.
You are more than welcome to your opinion. However, I will point out that the same legal definition that I cited will apply to you wherever you go - merely perhaps in different form. And what you conveniently call heavy handed has been, in reality, nothing of the sort - and certainly nothing compared to options that were discarded out of notions of fairness. Finally, criticizing my attitude is absurd in light of the efforts I have personally made over the last several days, when it would have been infinitely easier to NOT reopen the OT Forum, and to NOT post explanations several times. On that matter, I find your criticism insulting, misrepresentative, and downright ignorant, and will not mince words about it. I do not have time to waste explaining the complexity of what we as staff members are faced with when everything is ignored in favor of repeated complaints. If at some point you wish to actually engage in constructive dialogue, let me know. Otherwise, I will save my efforts for posters who actually are curious regarding how things are run, and not merely using that rhetoric as an excuse for repetitive complaints.
 

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Very impressive and you are completely correct. And, your attitude is exactly why so many people are leaving. This is a private site, that is operated to look somewhat like a public forum (social not legal definition). As you, within your legal rights, legally close your fist on people's content, why would they stay when there are numerous other alternatives where they can communicate how they like? The only thing that keeps them here are the other posters. As soon as a critical mass leaves, then it is too late.

This is where it is important to balance customer service, competitor benchmarking and other market considerations. You had market domination (at least for a very large Blazer forum). You became too heavy handed (prideful?) and next thing you know it's gone. Maybe you can rebuild it with newbs, but you could have had growth.
Well stated. I think the established rules work ok for smaller communities, but when a board reaches a certain critical mass it may start expecting special treatment. More leniency in how it governs itself, more opportunities for it's own OT forum.

Unfortunately, I think this site interpreted that as a violation of policy, instead of what it was: A huge opportunity.

This was a great opportunity for you guys to split off this board into its own full-fledged Blazers-only bulletin board. It could have had two or three different OT forums (Politics, Portland music, etc). You could have drawn a lot more Blazer fans (and their ad clicks) to a growing organization. And it could have been the flagship in how to handle any of your other forums once they started getting too big for their britches.

Instead you fought us tooth and nail, and here you've destroyed the equity of tens (hundreds?) of thousands of page views a day.

In the past 14 months, I personally have worked to build my own website with a massive amount of traffic out of nothing. It's cost me into the six figures to do it, not counting all the time I've invested in it. I doubt I had as many visitors as you guys did on this board.

It just astounds me how you'd righteously stand on a rule book while it all just withered away. Carefully following the existing rule book isn't always good for business.
 

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BTW--I'm not saying this as an "I told you so!" I'm actually just trying to speak as one small business man making a buck on the internet to another. I've got no stake in what you decide to do next.

But if I were running this site, I'd learn my lesson and put in a new rule book for the four or five biggest team boards on this site. They are opportunities, not threats, when they start getting whiny and petulant. If they reach that stage, encourage them to take it to the next level. Buy them a domain name like "BlazersBoards.com" or whatever is available. Cross link to your other sites, but let them think their site is all about them. Then expand, expand, expand.
 

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Legal Smeagol
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BTW--I'm not saying this as an "I told you so!" I'm actually just trying to speak as one small business man making a buck on the internet to another. I've got no stake in what you decide to do next.

But if I were running this site, I'd learn my lesson and put in a new rule book for the four or five biggest team boards on this site. They are opportunities, not threats, when they start getting whiny and petulant. If they reach that stage, encourage them to take it to the next level. Buy them a domain name like "BlazersBoards.com" or whatever is available. Cross link to your other sites, but let them think their site is all about them. Then expand, expand, expand.
These are indeed the kinds of constructive suggestions I'm looking to see. I'm not sure I agree, or that the changes could be implemented, but appreciate the thinking.
 

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These are indeed the kinds of constructive suggestions I'm looking to see. I'm not sure I agree, or that the changes could be implemented, but appreciate the thinking.
Thanks. What do you disagree with?

Implementation-wise, it'd be pretty easy to buy the biggest teams their own domains. You could even leave in the existing forum structure, but just put in multiple "OT" boards. In the banner at the top, put BlazerBoards.com (or whatever) really large, and then "A BasketballForum.com Community" pretty small and off to the side. (I always hated having to browse to the Blazers board from the home page anyway.)

You could even help customers sell the site to others by selling crap on CafePress.

As a customer of this site, if I could buy a baseball cap with the Basketball Forum logo on it, I definitely wouldn't. But if I could buy a baseball cap with BlazerBoards.com (or whatever) I might at least consider it. (In fact, the Blazers have been pretty cool to us in the past. They might even consider giving us permission to use a small copy of their logo if we promise to donate all profits to, say, Brandon Roy's favorite charity. Think about the publicity your site and the Blazers would get on that one.)

Anyway, most small businesses have a real tough time transitioning to bigger businesses. They try to run things the same way they used to, because it used to work fine. I think a similar problem happened here. The thing to remember is that the whole goal is to have huge communities, not small ones. So when one of them starts giving you massive headaches, that's the time to switch gears because they want to take the next step (even if they don't exactly know it).
 

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I am surprised at how many of the BBF regulars are now posting over at the other forum that caused all this drama. I'm sure most of them will visit both forums regularly. :cheers:
 

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Mr Basel, I haven't been on here as long or as often as a lot of you guys. But in my opinion, this is getting out of hand. I had never seen you on here before until a couple days ago. It seems like you are just on here continuing to stir it up and bait guys into arguing with you. You seem to be upsetting a lot of people. I don't know what happened or what would cause all this drama, but you just keep firing back at these guys left and right. Just let it go, whatever happened. No disrespect intended here man, but if you would quit responding to each and every complaint these guys have, I think this drama would go away. I'm not telling you this to start an argument with you, I just think it would be addition by subtraction, sorry. I just had somebody on here PM me and said they aren't going to come on here any more because of all this. This guy will be missed. Trust me, you all know him well. I don't know what the rules are about calling out a mod in public like I just did, but I hope I don't get banned like everybody else seems to be. I love this place and I wish we could all get back to talking hoops.
This forum is dying right before our eyes and it's a damn friggin' shame. I hate this. It's a MESSAGE BOARD. These are JUST WORDS. The only complaint I ever had about this board is that I felt it was too heavily moderated. I, for one, like to cuss. I like to argue and sometimes bait people. At least I USED to be that way, before I came here in 2003. I appreciate that this site is FORCED to be civil, and I agree civility has a purpose on the internet, especially when we start diving in to political discussion. But for the record, I may not post much on the political stuff, but I read all of it, and at no time have I found MYSELF offended by what anyone here has TYPED. TYPED!!!!!!!!!!

Grrrr....I guess I just don't understand why people are so touchy over words.

In any case, I love this Blazers community, and I don't want to see it die. And it's dying.
 

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All this business talk is going above my head . . . and the sad thing is I am a business owner.

All I can add to this is the city of beaverton is one of our biggest clients. And as such, and because they are savy, we give them reduced rates, increased attention and constantly adjust what we do in the office to make sure they are happy.

Maybe that is bad business, I never went to business school, but there are many companies trying to steal our account with them and they have stayed with us for 3 years now (renew each year) and know how much we appreciate their business. (The donuts to the mayor and staff every Friday probably helps)

And BBF . . . you guys have your work cut out for you because they just made Ed O a moderator. I better see donuts this Friday . . .
 

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All this business talk is going above my head . . . and the sad thing is I am a business owner.

All I can add to this is the city of beaverton is one of our biggest clients. And as such, and because they are savy, we give them reduced rates, increased attention and constantly adjust what we do in the office to make sure they are happy.

Maybe that is bad business, I never went to business school, but there are many companies trying to steal our account with them and they have stayed with us for 3 years now (renew each year) and know how much we appreciate their business. (The donuts to the mayor and staff every Friday probably helps)

And BBF . . . you guys have your work cut out for you because they just made Ed O a moderator. I better see donuts this Friday . . .
Ed O? Did he used to post here? :biggrin:
 
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