NCAA Credit Payouts

res · Mar 6, 2017

Rich93 said:
Make money off the buy games and make money on the tournament/tv revenue share. Don't forget the h in Fordham when you write the check.

I thought it relevant to repost this here.

paulxu · Mar 6, 2017

Gormin71 said:
Noone gave Dayton any extra money during the Gregory under-achieving years.

You had to finish in the top 100 :rules:

Steve81 · Mar 20, 2017

2012: 7 (Xavier 3, SLU 2, St. Bona. 1, Temple 1)
2013: 12 (LaSalle 4, SLU 2, Butler 2, Temple 2, VCU 2)
2014: 10 (Dayton 4, Saint Louis 2, St Joe's 1, VCU 1, UMass 1, GW 1)
2015: 5 (Dayton 3, VCU 1, Davidson 1)
2016: 5 (Dayton 1, VCU 2, St Joe's 2)
2017: 4 (Dayton 1, VCU 1, URI 2)
------------------------------------------------------------------
Total 43 with 35 current and 8 departed members. 2012-2017

OK using jpsmack's numbers and please correct me, because I'm not 100% sure of the departed members credits go to the general fund and there are a few members entering later and gave them a full share to keep things simpler. Also Forbes said an NCAA credit was worth $250,106 in 2014, so figured the 255,379 would be close enough for 2016.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/2014/03/20/how-a-single-ncaa-tournament-win-is-worth-1-6-million/#429b03a332b0

43 units at $255,379 = $10,981,297

General fund the 8 plus 25% of 35 credits (2,234,566* + 2,043,032) = 4,277,598 divide by 14* teams = 305,543 each*

Code:

URI            2 (75% = 383,068) + $305,543 = $688,611#
St. Louis    6 (75% = 1,149,205) + $305,543 = $1,454,748
St. Bonnies    1 (75% = 191,534) + $305,543 = $497,077
LaSalle       4 (75% = 766,137)  + $305,543 = $1,071,680
VCU          7 (75% = 1,340,740) + $305,543 = $1,646,283
Dayton       9 (75% = 1,723,808) + $305,543 = $2,029,351
St Joes     3 (75% = 574,603)    + $305,543 = $880,146
UMass       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
G'Dub       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
Davidson    1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
Duquesne                                    = $305,543
Fordham                                     = $305,543
GMU                                         = $305,543
Richmond                                    = $305,543

*Note this is rough as GMU, VCU, Davidson probably do not get the departed member share factor in.

# Rounded up for the pool so will not round up on the 75% of credits earned as well.

Used below link and then clicked on the teams to fill in 2015 and 2016.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_Men's_Basketball_Tournament_bids_by_school_and_conference#Atlantic_10_Conference

Been out very late last 2 nights and did not double check the math. Not concern by a dollar or two with this rough estimation.

But please feel free to point out errors.

fixed and close enough.

mm4cc · Mar 20, 2017

Does the NIT have payout units like the NCAA tournament?

Steve81 · Mar 20, 2017

Good question, know the Richmond will get a little. Not sure if it's just for getting to the Final Four. It's what I heard when we made it to the NIT Final Four.

jpschmack · Mar 20, 2017

Usually teams end up losing money on the NIT, because you have to guarantee ticket revenue to the NIT. Most schools that let their students in free continue to do so, so it's a good environment and basically have to buy their tickets from the NIT.

jpschmack · Mar 20, 2017

Steve81 said:

Code:

URI            2 (75% = 383,068) + $332,905 = $715,973#
St. Louis    6 (75% = 1,149,205) + $332,905 = $1,482,110
St. Bonnies    1 (75% = 191,534) + $332,905 = $524,439
LaSalle       4 (75% = 766,137)  + $332,905 = $1,099,042
VCU          7 (75% = 1,340,740) + $332,905 = $1,373,645
Dayton       9 (75% = 1,723,808) + $332,905 = $2,056,713
St Joes     3 (75% = 574,603)    + $332,905 = $907,508
UMass       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $332,905 = $524,439
G'Dub       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $332,905 = $524,439
Davidson    1 (75% = 191,534)    + $332,905 = $524,439
Duquesne                                    = $332,905
Fordham                                     = $332,905
GMU                                         = $332,905
Richmond                                    = $332,905

Crap - cross check of adding the totals comes out more $593,828

593,828 off not sure were the error is and need to get some sleep.

You're over-thinking or focusing too much on details. The exact dollar figures are relatively trivial.

The NCAA is going to cut a check for the conference share, right?

The A-10 gets that money. They also get their money from their TV deals with NBC Sports & CBS Sports; And their checks from all their conference sponsors. They also have travel reimbursements from the NCAA. They also have conference tournament revenue from this year Pittsburgh.

But they also have the conference championship reimbursements to pay out to the hosts of other championships in A-10 sports. Where the host pays for stuff an the A-10 reimburses them.

And of course, the A-10 sends a rep to each NCAA site one of our schools are at; and the league deducts that cost from the NCAA share. And dues for each member of the league, whatever those are.

The conference will take all that money coming in, add up all the money they owe each member for the year; and they settle up with everyone at once, probably around late June.

So there's no real "NCAA Check" to each school. You're just trying to ballpark roughly how much of each school's "A-10 Check" is NCAA Unit revenue. Horseshoes & Hand grenade rules apply. Good work.

BillyBilli · Mar 20, 2017

mm4cc said:
Does the NIT have payout units like the NCAA tournament?

Yes, but really not much. $5,220/unit in 2016.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/sdut-sdsu-basketball-nit-ncaa-benefits-2016mar26-story.html

ur2k · Mar 20, 2017

mm4cc said:
Does the NIT have payout units like the NCAA tournament?

I think the team gets a bunch of Subway coupons and a few pallets of Powerade

twisted3829 · Mar 20, 2017

we have 43 credits you have 41

JAF_1962 · Mar 20, 2017

paulxu said:
You had to finish in the top 100 :rules:

We always finished in the top 100. The top 64 not so much.

paulxu · Mar 20, 2017

mm4cc said:
Does the NIT have payout units like the NCAA tournament?

Pizza!

Steve81 · Mar 21, 2017

twisted3829 said:
we have 43 credits you have 41

Thanks twisted3829. Another late night and just got in. Will have to fix it in the next week.

Steve81 · Mar 21, 2017

jpschmack said:
You're over-thinking or focusing too much on details. The exact dollar figures are relatively trivial.

The NCAA is going to cut a check for the conference share, right?

The A-10 gets that money. They also get their money from their TV deals with NBC Sports & CBS Sports; And their checks from all their conference sponsors. They also have travel reimbursements from the NCAA. They also have conference tournament revenue from this year Pittsburgh.

But they also have the conference championship reimbursements to pay out to the hosts of other championships in A-10 sports. Where the host pays for stuff an the A-10 reimburses them.

And of course, the A-10 sends a rep to each NCAA site one of our schools are at; and the league deducts that cost from the NCAA share. And dues for each member of the league, whatever those are.

The conference will take all that money coming in, add up all the money they owe each member for the year; and they settle up with everyone at once, probably around late June.

So there's no real "NCAA Check" to each school. You're just trying to ballpark roughly how much of each school's "A-10 Check" is NCAA Unit revenue. Horseshoes & Hand grenade rules apply. Good work.

Thanks, re did the numbers a bit.

2012: 7 (Xavier 3, SLU 2, St. Bona. 1, Temple 1)
2013: 12 (LaSalle 4, SLU 2, Butler 2, Temple 2, VCU 2)
2014: 10 (Dayton 4, Saint Louis 2, St Joe's 1, VCU 1, UMass 1, GW 1)
2015: 5 (Dayton 3, VCU 1, Davidson 1)
2016: 5 (Dayton 1, VCU 2, St Joe's 2)
2017: 4 (Dayton 1, VCU 1, URI 2)
------------------------------------------------------------------
Total 43 with 35 current and 8 departed members. 2012-2017

OK using jpsmack's numbers and please correct me, because I'm not 100% sure of the departed members credits go to the general fund and there are a few members entering later and gave them a full share to keep things simpler. Also Forbes said an NCAA credit was worth $250,106 in 2014, so figured the 255,379 would be close enough for 2016.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/2014/03/20/how-a-single-ncaa-tournament-win-is-worth-1-6-million/#429b03a332b0

43 units at $255,379 = $10,981,297

General fund the 8 plus 25% of 35 credits (2,234,566* + 2,043,032) = 4,277,598 divide by 14* teams = 305,543 each*

Code:

URI            2 (75% = 383,068) + $305,543 = $688,611#
St. Louis    6 (75% = 1,149,205) + $305,543 = $1,454,748
St. Bonnies    1 (75% = 191,534) + $305,543 = $497,077
LaSalle       4 (75% = 766,137)  + $305,543 = $1,071,680
VCU          7 (75% = 1,340,740) + $305,543 = $1,646,283
Dayton       9 (75% = 1,723,808) + $305,543 = $2,029,351
St Joes     3 (75% = 574,603)    + $305,543 = $880,146
UMass       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
G'Dub       1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
Davidson    1 (75% = 191,534)    + $305,543 = $497,077
Duquesne                                    = $305,543
Fordham                                     = $305,543
GMU                                         = $305,543
Richmond                                    = $305,543

*Note this is rough as GMU, VCU, Davidson probably do not get the departed member share factor in.

# Rounded up for the pool so will not round up on the 75% of credits earned as well.

Used below link and then clicked on the teams to fill in 2015 and 2016.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_Men's_Basketball_Tournament_bids_by_school_and_conference#Atlantic_10_Conference

twisted3829 · Mar 19, 2018

2013: 12 (LaSalle 4, SLU 2, Butler 2, Temple 2, VCU 2)
2014: 10 (Dayton 4, Saint Louis 2, St Joe's 1, VCU 1, UMass 1, GW 1)
2015: 5 (Dayton 3, VCU 1, Davidson 1)
2016: 5 (Dayton 1, VCU 2, St Joe's 2)
2017: 4 (Dayton 1, VCU 1, URI 2)
2018: 5 (URI 2, SBU 2, Davidson 1)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
41 credits (37 current and 4 departed)

I used $257,807 per unit, the 75/25 split and the 25 was split by the teams that did not make it, 4 abandon were split between everyone except Davidson and GMU

Code:

Team		Credits	Earned credits	Pool		Total
Dayton		9	$1,740,183.75	$201,166.02	$1,941,349.77
VCU		7	$1,353,476.25	$115,231.02	$1,468,707.27
URI		4	$773,415.00	$322,535.26 	$1,095,950.26
La Salle	4	$773,415.00	$289,333.10	$1,062,748.10
SLU		4	$773,415.00	$197,259.89	$970,674.89
St Joes		3	$580,061.25	$253,898.86	$833,960.11
St Bona		2	$386,707.50	$345,972.08	$732,679.58
Umass		1	$193,353.75	$283,194.89	$476,548.64
Davidson	2	$386,707.50	$52,732.84	$439,440.34
GW		1	$193,353.75	$283,194.89	$476,548.64
Duquesne	0	$0.00		$375,268.10	$375,268.10
Fordham		0	$0.00		$375,268.10	$375,268.10
Richmond	0	$0.00		$375,268.10	$375,268.10
George Mason	0	$0.00		$203,398.10	$203,398.10

mm4cc · Mar 19, 2018

twisted3829 said:
2013: 12 (LaSalle 4, SLU 2, Butler 2, Temple 2, VCU 2)
2014: 10 (Dayton 4, Saint Louis 2, St Joe's 1, VCU 1, UMass 1, GW 1)
2015: 5 (Dayton 3, VCU 1, Davidson 1)
2016: 5 (Dayton 1, VCU 2, St Joe's 2)
2017: 4 (Dayton 1, VCU 1, URI 2)
2018: 5 (URI 2, SBU 2, Davidson 1)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
41 credits (37 current and 4 departed)

I used $257,807 per unit, the 75/25 split and the 25 was split by the teams that did not make it, 4 abandon were split between everyone except Davidson and GMU

Code:

Team Credits Earned credits Pool Total Dayton 9 $1,740,183.75 $52,732.84 $1,792,916.59 VCU 7 $1,353,476.25 $85,935.00 $1,439,411.25 URI 4 $773,415.00 $322,535.26 $1,095,950.26 La Salle 4 $773,415.00 $289,333.10 $1,062,748.10 SLU 4 $773,415.00 $197,259.89 $970,674.89 St Joes 3 $580,061.25 $174,102.08 $754,163.33 St Bona 2 $386,707.50 $203,398.10 $590,105.60 Umass 1 $193,353.75 $283,194.89 $476,548.64 Davidson 2 $386,707.50 $52,732.84 $439,440.34 GW 1 $193,353.75 $283,194.89 $476,548.64 Duquesne 0 $0.00 $375,268.10 $375,268.10 Fordham 0 $0.00 $375,268.10 $375,268.10 Richmond 0 $0.00 $289,333.10 $289,333.10 George Mason 0 $0.00 $197,259.89 $197,259.89

Why does Richmond get less than Fordham and Duquesne?

twisted3829 · Mar 19, 2018

my excel messed up, sorry

I have updated everything (multiple teams were messed up when I reordered it)

mm4cc · Mar 19, 2018

twisted3829 said:
my excel messed up, sorry

I have updated everything (multiple teams were messed up when I reordered it)

I am getting slightly different numbers. I assume a share of units are only distributed to schools if they were earned after the school joined the conference, so units earned in 2012 are not shared with GMU or Davidson for example.

Code:

School	Pool	Earned	Total	Payout
Dayton	0.91	6.75	7.66	$1,974,642.37
VCU	0.95	5.25	6.20	$1,597,284.13
URI	1.01	3.00	4.01	$1,034,307.86
SLU	1.00	3.00	4.00	$1,031,678.71
LAS	1.00	3.00	4.00	$1,030,702.17
SJU	1.03	2.25	3.28	$845,497.29
SBU	1.05	1.50	2.55	$657,513.02
DAV	0.33	1.50	1.83	$470,993.56
UMass	1.07	0.75	1.82	$468,702.44
GW	1.07	0.75	1.82	$468,702.44
UR	1.09	0.00	1.09	$280,718.17
DUQ	1.09	0.00	1.09	$280,718.17
FOR	1.09	0.00	1.09	$280,718.17
GMU	0.57	0.00	0.57	$147,908.50

twisted3829 · Mar 19, 2018

I also did that the teams that made the tourney did not get part of the pool.

so for this year URI, SBU and Davidson get 75% of their units and the other 11 teams split the 25%

mm4cc · Mar 19, 2018

twisted3829 said:
I also did that the teams that made the tourney did not get part of the pool.

so for this year URI, SBU and Davidson get 75% of their units and the other 11 teams split the 25%

Ahhh, I see. I split each team's credits 75% earned, 25% gets split between the other 13 schools even if they also earned credits.

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