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Pau or JO?

  • Pau Gasol

    Votes: 36 76.6%
  • Jermaine O'Neal

    Votes: 11 23.4%

  • Total voters
    47
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Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Dunno if this debate has been done before, but it crossed my mind and I think it'll be very interesting to see what people have to say. Who would you build your team around, Pau or JO? Both are All-Star PFs and a notch or two below the superstar level.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

this depends. are we talking about the players heading into next season or in their prime? cuz then my answers would be different.

JO in his healthy prime, but pau for next season no doubt
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Gasol, Gasol, Gasol.

This was already laid to rest about a year ago.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

O'Neal, no questions asked. He's got everything on Gasol except passing, and I don't consider passing as a big priority for big men. Scoring, rebounding, defense, winning attitude, etc. all heavily in favor of O'Neal.

Factoid of the Day: Pau Gasol has won the same number of playoff games as everyone reading this. 0.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

One of the big issues here is, you're comparing a guys best year (Gasol) vs a guy coming of his worst year in probably 5 seasons (O'Neal). That right there will influence voters to the point the entire poll is useless.

Gasol had a great year. I applaud him. But regardless, he's still a terrible rebounder, only a so-so defender, and he's never proven himself to be a team leader or a winner. Now some could say a single player can't will his team to victory alone, but Spain's terrible performances in various international tournaments confirm to me that Gasol just isn't a winner.

O'Neal on the other hand, has consistently put up better production despite playing signifigantly less minutes on a deeper team in Indiana. If O'Neal were to play 39+ mpg like Gasol, he'd be putting up 24/11/3 blocks on a yearly basis and this thread would be non-existent because it would be so obvious the answer. Unfortuantely he only plays around 35 mpg and has to settle for 21/10/2, which equals Gasol's best season ever.

I can't see how any non-biased, non-Grizzlies fans, non-Euro's can honestly say Gasol. That is unless you consider passing a more important quality than rebounding and defending to a big man.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
One of the big issues here is, you're comparing a guys best year (Gasol) vs a guy coming of his worst year in probably 5 seasons (O'Neal). That right there will influence voters to the point the entire poll is useless.

Gasol had a great year. I applaud him. But regardless, he's still a terrible rebounder, only a so-so defender, and he's never proven himself to be a team leader or a winner. Now some could say a single player can't will his team to victory alone, but Spain's terrible performances in various international tournaments confirm to me that Gasol just isn't a winner.

O'Neal on the other hand, has consistently put up better production despite playing signifigantly less minutes on a deeper team in Indiana. If O'Neal were to play 39+ mpg like Gasol, he'd be putting up 24/11/3 blocks on a yearly basis and this thread would be non-existent because it would be so obvious the answer. Unfortuantely he only plays around 35 mpg and has to settle for 21/10/2, which equals Gasol's best season ever.

I can't see how any non-biased, non-Grizzlies fans, non-Euro's can honestly say Gasol. That is unless you consider passing a more important quality than rebounding and defending to a big man.
False.

JO has played 37 minutes and his numbers were 20/10 and 19/10 and had NEVER shot .500 from the feild in his entire career. Also, he is not that much better of a rebounder than Gasol. It is not like the KG thing where KG is a vastly superior rebounder and effecient. JO is a sightly better rebounder and tons more ineffiecient. JO also has ALWAYS been supported by a better supporting cast and arguably has not even been the best or most important person on his team until last seasons debacle. Pau Gasol, on the other hand , has ALWAYS been the best player on his team and has never had the luxury of playing with veteran All Stars.

Gasol>JO and has been for awhile.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
O'Neal, no questions asked. He's got everything on Gasol except passing, and I don't consider passing as a big priority for big men. Scoring, rebounding, defense, winning attitude, etc. all heavily in favor of O'Neal.

Factoid of the Day: Pau Gasol has won the same number of playoff games as everyone reading this. 0.
Factoid of the Day: Jermaine O'Neal has shot .500 from the field the same number of times as everyone reading this. 0.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Here is their respective production for the past four seasons. O'Neal is on the top; Gasol on the bottom.



It's fairly close, neither man with a huge advantage over either in anything, but overall O'Neal provides more game changing ability. He better at both ends of the court than Gasol, and to top it off he's a signifigantly better rebounder and a much bigger winner. Gasol's advantages in assists per game and field goal percentage just aren't enough.

If I were to rate them NBA Live-style, it'd be like this:



Anyone who votes for Gasol is wrong. That's not an opinion, that's a fact, as my post has just proven.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
Here is their respective production for the past four seasons. O'Neal is on the top; Gasol on the bottom.



It's fairly close, neither man with a huge advantage over either in anything, but overall O'Neal provides more game changing ability. He better at both ends of the court than Gasol, and to top it off he's a signifigantly better rebounder and a much bigger winner. Gasol's advantages in assists per game and field goal percentage just aren't enough.

If I were to rate them NBA Live-style, it'd be like this:



Anyone who votes for Gasol is wrong. That's not an opinion, that's a fact, as my post has just proven.
You do understand that they are not the same age right?

Compare their stats at similar ages...

JO on top again



...and that does not even include JO's injury years. I won't even round Pau's numbers down like you did :rolleyes: or include Portland's playoff wins...lol. :clap:
 

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I don't watch Pau mutch in NBA but in his NT he is true leader the one that fires them up and takes responsibility also he is true post player as Pacers fan I must say JO has everithing to be better in NBA standards but he just don't show up he is soft, doesn't box out shoots jumpers... but he has skills for so much more I would take Pau over him (for long time but I am bit of Pau homer).
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

MemphisX said:
You do understand that they are not the same age right?

Compare their stats at similar ages...

JO on top again



...and that does not even include JO's injury years. I won't even round Pau's numbers down like you did :rolleyes: or include Portland's playoff wins...lol. :clap:
The age thing isn't even worth menitoning. It's less than 2 years, and you could even make the case Gasol's best year was his second year, and O'Neals best year was 4 seasons ago. So thats just plain dumb. Also nice of you to include O'Neal's 1st season in Indiana, a season where he was still an unknown and was maybe 4th option tops. That weighs his scoring way down, without that "rookie" year its more like 20/10.4/2.4 blocks which is still better than anything Gasol's ever done. That is unless you consider assists more crucial to a big mans game than shot blocking and rebounding :gbanana:
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
The age thing isn't even worth menitoning. It's less than 2 years, and you could even make the case Gasol's best year was his second year, and O'Neals best year was 4 seasons ago. So thats just plain dumb. Also nice of you to include O'Neal's 1st season in Indiana, a season where he was still an unknown and was maybe 4th option tops. That weighs his scoring way down, without that "rookie" year its more like 20/10.4/2.4 blocks which is still better than anything Gasol's ever done. That is unless you consider assists more crucial to a big mans game than shot blocking and rebounding :gbanana:
When did the debate become who has the prettier stats? There is more to the game than PPG, RPG & BPG. You know, like being clutch via data from 82games.com

Clutch FT's - While Gasol's FT% dips slightly (-.020) in clutch time, JON's takes a huge hit (-.198)

Game Winning Shot - Gasol hit 6 of his 12 game winning shots and JON hit 2 of 14.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
O'Neal, no questions asked. He's got everything on Gasol except passing, and I don't consider passing as a big priority for big men. Scoring, rebounding, defense, winning attitude, etc. all heavily in favor of O'Neal.

Factoid of the Day: Pau Gasol has won the same number of playoff games as everyone reading this. 0.
I'd use playoff success as a major factor if the Pacers had won anything, but they haven't. And the Grizzlies have played in the much stronger conference in this time period, and more often then not duing that time, JO had a better team around him them Pau did.

Also, is winning attitude what they call being a cry baby and complaining constantly during and after the few games you play a year now?
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

cpawfan said:
When did the debate become who has the prettier stats?
Which is immediatly followed by you listing stats....... :shy:

cpawfan said:
There is more to the game than PPG, RPG & BPG. You know, like being clutch via data from 82games.com

Clutch FT's - While Gasol's FT% dips slightly (-.020) in clutch time, JON's takes a huge hit (-.198)

Game Winning Shot - Gasol hit 6 of his 12 game winning shots and JON hit 2 of 14.
Game Winning Shots...Steve Francis 8-20 (.400).......Steve Nash 1-15 (.067)........"Mr. Big Shot" Chauncey Billups 5-26 (.192)

Using your logic, Steve Francis is better than the back-2-back MVP and Mr. Big Shot. Brilliant.

From everything I've seen, both from watching the games and researching the numbers, O'Neal's a better scorer, rebounder, defender, and a bigger winner. In my book, that equals better player.
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

ToddMacCulloch11 said:
I'd use playoff success as a major factor if the Pacers had won anything, but they haven't. And the Grizzlies have played in the much stronger conference in this time period, and more often then not duing that time, JO had a better team around him them Pau did.
That may be an acceptable excuse for not winning a playoff series, but a truly great player would atleast lead his team to a single victory. O'Neal single handedly rallied his banged up Pacers team to a game 3 victory over the Nets this past postseason. Thats something you'll never see Pau Gasol do. 8th seeds have won games all throughout the history of the NBA playoffs, against far better teams than the teams the Grizzlies have faced, that's no excuse. He's just not good enough. He's a stat padder.

ToddMacCulloch11 said:
Also, is winning attitude what they call being a cry baby and complaining constantly during and after the few games you play a year now?
O'Neal's had two serious injuries in his time in Indy. The first was late in 2005 when Shaq landed on him during a game, the other this past season when Francisco Elson nearly ripped his arm out of socket while going for a rebound. Thats not called being injury prone, thats called being unlucky. Injury prone players are the pussies who go down for weeks at a time when they land on their ankle wrong (Vince Carter) or don't take care of their bodies (Shaq).
 

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Re: Jermaine O'Neal or Pau Gasol?

Quis said:
Which is immediatly followed by you listing stats....... :shy:
Different stats. You keep wanting to go back to the "pretty" stats.

Game Winning Shots...Steve Francis 8-20 (.400).......Steve Nash 1-15 (.067)........"Mr. Big Shot" Chauncey Billups 5-26 (.192)

Using your logic, Steve Francis is better than the back-2-back MVP and Mr. Big Shot. Brilliant.
You obviously didn't understand. Nowhere did I say Pau was better just because of this.

From everything I've seen, both from watching the games and researching the numbers, O'Neal's a better scorer, rebounder, defender, and a bigger winner. In my book, that equals better player.
JON isn't a better scorer. PER & shooting percentages are in Gasol's favor across the board. JON simply just takes more shots. Also, Gasol is just as good, if not better an offensive rebounder.

If JON were such a winner, then why do his stats go down in the playoffs from the regular season?
 
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