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It is a challenging time and painful for Phil and his family. I personally won't begrudge anyone for being upset. It is undeniably emotional.
True and on the flip side of it, "that school" gave him a chance to do what he loves for 25 years.
 

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I should have said for 34 years. One thing about this, I find it hard to believe that SJU gave him the boot like is being portrayed. I just saw Rothstein throw the school under the bus on TV and there is definitely more to this. He will get a big buyout and was probably offered other options. He should not allow the school to look like dirtbags even if he feels shunned. They put food on his table and helped him get his kids through school. He needs to be a man about this and at least step up with some thanks. Just my opinion. I hate that he went out like this but there has to be more to this story.
 

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I see that there is a lot of fan support for Jameer Nelson. This seems like a risky hire given he has no coaching experience and he is replacing a legend that the new AD just fired. Is this just emotional reaction or does it have legs?
That sort of thing doesn't work. Chris Mullin barely scraped into the tourney in his fourth year. They're going to be terrible next year, and he's going to be gone. You can hire an ex player, but he has to have some coaching experience somewhere. Both Patrick Ewing, and Penny Hardaway were coaching before they got hired, and are having some success.
 

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I should have said for 34 years. One thing about this, I find it hard to believe that SJU gave him the boot like is being portrayed. I just saw Rothstein throw the school under the bus on TV and there is definitely more to this. He will get a big buyout and was probably offered other options. He should not allow the school to look like dirtbags even if he feels shunned. They put food on his table and helped him get his kids through school. He needs to be a man about this and at least step up with some thanks. Just my opinion. I hate that he went out like this but there has to be more to this story.
I watched that too. Problem is we don't know what happened behind closed doors and until someone from behind those doors says so, the narrative will be formed and, like everything in this stupid F'ing social media whore society, be considered gospel until we hear otherwise, or until 48 hours blow over then no one cares anymore, even if the truth is eventually revealed.

I have to think, based on the daughter's tweet and the deafening silence from the Dean himself, that it was not a happy departure. And as we opined a little with '13 back during the season - the worst case scenario is they ask Phil to step down and Phil says no - because then the business side takes over and they do what they want done.

SJU brass is finding out Phil was respected and loved, and they're getting lambasted for it, right or wrong. Phil is just 3 years removed from getting ***ed against Oregon to get to the S16, and the team has had horrible injury problems the last two years. Maybe the training staff needed to be fired instead. It's a tough one. No one affiliated with SJU basketball should be happy with this situation.
 

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How much of this is the Villanova effect?

You see what your chief rival is doing and it clouds your judgment.
 

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It's been a while since I posted here. Anyway, yesterday was most certainly a sad day for Hawk fans but the move was necessary. Aside from two seasons, this decade has been the same old faces with the same old mediocre results. And, he lost this past season's team very badly. New blood is needed.

I have no problem with the way SJU handled this aside from maybe that they did it on the Feast of St. Joseph. Simply put, there was no good way to handle this from a PR perspective.

As for Rothstein's diatribe, it struck me as butthurt from the college basketball old boy network.

Regardless, I thank Phil Martelli for his thirty-four years of service to SJU and for being a great ambassador for both the university and the game of college basketball. I wish him well in his future endeavors whether that be another coaching gig, broadcasting or simply the proverbial grandfather business.

There is pain now, as seen in his daughter's tweet (but, it should be noted that Elizabeth Martelli has had loose twitter fingers in the past, for example, when she ridiculed CJ Aiken getting an NBA contract, probably tweeting a sentiment that ultimately came from her father's mouth) but I hope that it subsides and, in time, he'll be welcomed back to the Hagan Arena as an honored guest with a thunderous ovation.
 

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How much of this is the Villanova effect?

You see what your chief rival is doing and it clouds your judgment.
Piggybacking on my earlier comment, in the next 5 years, who will St. Joe's more resemble, Villanova or La Salle?

For any La Salle fans wondering why I picked them, it is only b/c you are part of the Big 5 and have been weaker than St. Joe's since being in the A10. I also would not pick Fordham b/c I do not think they would ever be that bad.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
I watched that too. Problem is we don't know what happened behind closed doors and until someone from behind those doors says so, the narrative will be formed and, like everything in this stupid F'ing social media whore society, be considered gospel until we hear otherwise, or until 48 hours blow over then no one cares anymore, even if the truth is eventually revealed.

I have to think, based on the daughter's tweet and the deafening silence from the Dean himself, that it was not a happy departure. And as we opined a little with '13 back during the season - the worst case scenario is they ask Phil to step down and Phil says no - because then the business side takes over and they do what they want done.

SJU brass is finding out Phil was respected and loved, and they're getting lambasted for it, right or wrong. Phil is just 3 years removed from getting ***ed against Oregon to get to the S16, and the team has had horrible injury problems the last two years. Maybe the training staff needed to be fired instead. It's a tough one. No one affiliated with SJU basketball should be happy with this situation.
I agree there have been some bad breaks and I was calling for new training staff ten years ago. But it didn't happen, and I can surmise a few reasons why but that's neither here nor there now.

There was never going to be a good way to do this. Phil's identity is as a coach. From what I know, he had every intention of coaching many more years. Retirement was never in his mind. There wasn't an easy, amenable out for any party. There may have been some alternatives suggested and they didn't work out. I don't know. But it's done now and it had to be. I don't like that it had to happen, as I've said, and yeah I wish this wasn't worthy of discussion on SC and tourney coverage. We all move forward now.
 

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Sad to see him go....


And who could ever forget his masterpiece - Young Frankenstein!
 

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In the past five years, was SJU closer to Villanova or La Salle?
Since this season is not over, I will go back 5 season from 2018 and notice 2 A10 Championships, so I guess Villanova because you actually won something.

I answered your question, now you answer mine.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
Since this season is not over, I will go back 5 season from 2018 and notice 2 A10 Championships, so I guess Villanova because you actually won something.

I answered your question, now you answer mine.
SJU isn't going to be winning national championships. I'm not deluded. Our goal is to compete for NCAA bids every year. We have the resources and commitment to doing that.

So, yeah, the answer is neither. This doesn't have to do with Villanova. Forgive me if this seems terse, ace, but you've always seemed to have a particular twang of provincialism when it comes to SJU. One of the "what do they expect to do better" crowd. Now, I could be off base with that and if so I apologize, but you seem to tend more toward that than the "Saint Joe's can be a real, consistent winner like they used to be but aren't now."
 

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SJU isn't going to be winning national championships. I'm not deluded. Our goal is to compete for NCAA bids every year. We have the resources and commitment to doing that.

So, yeah, the answer is neither. This doesn't have to do with Villanova. Forgive me if this seems terse, ace, but you've always seemed to have a particular twang of provincialism when it comes to SJU. One of the "what do they expect to do better" crowd. Now, I could be off base with that and if so I apologize, but you seem to tend more toward that than the "Saint Joe's can be a real, consistent winner like they used to be but aren't now."
"Our goal is to compete for NCAA bids every year."
So is ours. Compete...but we define that as "being eligible for a NCAA bid when the season starts"
 

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SJU isn't going to be winning national championships. I'm not deluded. Our goal is to compete for NCAA bids every year. We have the resources and commitment to doing that.

So, yeah, the answer is neither. This doesn't have to do with Villanova. Forgive me if this seems terse, ace, but you've always seemed to have a particular twang of provincialism when it comes to SJU. One of the "what do they expect to do better" crowd. Now, I could be off base with that and if so I apologize, but you seem to tend more toward that than the "Saint Joe's can be a real, consistent winner like they used to be but aren't now."
I do not have a strong opinion on how good St. Joe's can be. I do think that it will be difficult to get to being a consistent winner, but that's mainly b/c I don't know enough about your new AD.

I do have a little bit of trouble with the "again", as I am not sure what period you are referring to. Martelli seemed to be up and down a lot, save for the years with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West. There have been exceptions in the A10, but finishing 5th or 6th does not usually put you in the category of competing for NCAA bids.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
I do not have a strong opinion on how good St. Joe's can be. I do think that it will be difficult to get to being a consistent winner, but that's mainly b/c I don't know enough about your new AD.

I do have a little bit of trouble with the "again", as I am not sure what period you are referring to. Martelli seemed to be up and down a lot, save for the years with Jameer Nelson and Delonte West. There have been exceptions in the A10, but finishing 5th or 6th does not usually put you in the category of competing for NCAA bids.
A top 4 finish puts you in the conversation. That is what Saint Joseph's is aspiring to do. It was determined that either Phil didn't have the same vision or wasn't capable of carrying that out. We can disagree on whether that's possible, but vision matters.
 

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Since this season is not over, I will go back 5 season from 2018 and notice 2 A10 Championships, so I guess Villanova because you actually won something.

I answered your question, now you answer mine.
Over the past 10 seasons Phil’s record is 166 -161 with 5 losing seasons and one .500 season.

Over the past 5 years his record is 82-81 with 3 losing seasons and one .500 season. He had one really good season in five years. Take this one season out and his record is 54-73 over the other four years.

Over the past ten years Phil had 4 winning seasons.

It’s not unreasonable for SJU to expect more than three good seasons over a ten year period.
 

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Over the past 10 seasons Phil’s record is 166 -161 with 5 losing seasons and one .500 season.

Over the past 5 years his record is 82-81 with 3 losing seasons and one .500 season. He had one really good season in five years. Take this one season out and his record is 54-73 over the other four years.

Over the past ten years Phil had 4 winning seasons.

It’s not unreasonable for SJU to expect more than three good seasons over a ten year period.
I remember when our fans used to debate which of these 9 year record would you rather have:

25-6
11-20
15-16
25-6
11-20
15-16
25-6
11-20
15-16
153-126

or

17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
17-14
153-126
 
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