[Talkhard]

Maybe I'm being too hard on the guy, maybe I'm old-fashioned, and maybe I expect too much, but I can't help but be turned off by seeing Zach Randolph so happy-go-lucky and carefree after such a bad loss, particularly one in which he played so poorly.

http://www.oregonlive.com/weblogs/b...live_blazersbeat/archives/2005_11.html#096086

 

[GrandpaBlaze]

Who is the person you are quoting? Do you have a link to the quote?

Thanks.

Gramps...

 

[Talkhard]

The quote is from Jason Quick, in the Oregonian. I've been trying to paste in the URL, but the site is not allowing me to do it for some reason. I'm not being allowed to edit my posts, either, so something is obviously wrong.

 

[WebZen]

Here is the link

 

[barfo]

I've been trying to paste in the URL, but the site is not allowing me to do it for some reason. I'm not being allowed to edit my posts, either, so something is obviously wrong.

It's Zach's fault.

barfo

 

[barfo]

The guy is cracking jokes, singing, etc., which reminds me so much of Rasheed Wallace and how he handled losses.

And, let's see, Rasheed Wallace has a championship ring, so Quick's point is...

barfo

 

[hasoos]

You can't throw your whole life out the window and become upset over basketball losses. There is way too many things in life way more important then basketball to get truly upset over. The only way the team can bounce back is with a good positive attitude, if it is joking, then so be it.

 

[Fork]

You can't throw your whole life out the window and become upset over basketball losses. There is way too many things in life way more important then basketball to get truly upset over. The only way the team can bounce back is with a good positive attitude, if it is joking, then so be it.

I agree.

To demand a person to react the way you want them to is ridiculous. It doesn't mean he doesn't care, it just means he deals with things differently than Jason Quick wants them to. Some people laugh off very serious matters. Police at crime scenes often make jokes to defuse the tension of a very serious situation. I don't think it means they're bad people or that they don't want to do their job well or that they don't care about what has happened. They just deal with it differently.

 

[TheBlueDoggy]

....because everyone knows the only way to pick yourself up from a loss afterwards is to start thinking and behaving negatively... Yes, that Jason Quick is a smart man. Next time I mess up, I'm going to spend the rest of my life beating my self up over it, instead of having a positive attitude.

 

[blazerboy30]

I don't know what the posters above are talking about......I know that I don't start cracking jokes after a pick-up game loss. Maybe I just hate to lose more than others.

I want players on my team that take losing personally. I want players on my team that HATE to lose. We need competitors on this team. Not players who go through the motions just to get the paycheck.

I guarantee Jordan didn't crack jokes after a loss.

 

[barfo]

I don't know what the posters above are talking about......I know that I don't start cracking jokes after a pick-up game loss. Maybe I just hate to lose more than others.

Others being Zach, in this case. Well, it could well be that you hate to lose more than Zach.

But, I'm guessing he's a better player than you, since he's in the NBA and you are posting here. (Of course, this is only a guess, no offense intended if I'm wrong).

I want players on my team that take losing personally. I want players on my team that HATE to lose. We need competitors on this team. Not players who go through the motions just to get the paycheck.

I'd rather have Zach on the team than you, even if you hate to lose more than he does. Hating to lose might be an attractive feature, but it is hardly the most important qualification.

Unfortunately, pretty much any player we get is going to have some sort of imperfection. I prefer the off-court imperfections to the on-court imperfections.

Would you be in favor of replacing Zach with a player who didn't perform as well on-court but didn't joke after the game?

barfo

 

[blazerboy30]

Others being Zach, in this case. Well, it could well be that you hate to lose more than Zach.

But, I'm guessing he's a better player than you, since he's in the NBA and you are posting here. (Of course, this is only a guess, no offense intended if I'm wrong).



I'd rather have Zach on the team than you, even if you hate to lose more than he does. Hating to lose might be an attractive feature, but it is hardly the most important qualification.

Unfortunately, pretty much any player we get is going to have some sort of imperfection. I prefer the off-court imperfections to the on-court imperfections.

Would you be in favor of replacing Zach with a player who didn't perform as well on-court but didn't joke after the game?

barfo

I would be in favor of having a team full of players who will do whatever it takes to win, whether it is putting aside personal stats, making the extra pass, diving for loose balls, and this sort of play.

The behavior that zach displayed, by joking after a loss just goes along with what I, and many other fans believe is a major problem on this team.........too much emphasis on personal stats, and not caring enough about winning the game.

also, in my opinion, joking in the locker room after a loss is NOT considered an "off court imperfection." i believe this to be a HUGE flaw and problem on this team, not a personallity imperfection.

i believe that once teams become "ok" with losing, that team will spend a long, long time at the bottom of the league. things will only change when losing becomes unacceptable.

 

[cimalee]

Its good to see him making hjokes after the game , because he had a horrible game in orlando , im glad hes not down about it

 

[barfo]

I would be in favor of having a team full of players who will do whatever it takes to win, whether it is putting aside personal stats, making the extra pass, diving for loose balls, and this sort of play.

Sure. But are you willing to trade for (even) less talented players to get that?

The behavior that zach displayed, by joking after a loss just goes along with what I, and many other fans believe is a major problem on this team.........too much emphasis on personal stats, and not caring enough about winning the game.

Well, we could sign you tomorrow (and me too!), and you'd care about winning, right? Would that be a good idea? It would for you and I, obviously... what about the many other fans? What would they think?

also, in my opinion, joking in the locker room after a loss is NOT considered an "off court imperfection."

Is the locker room on the court? If so I'm not going to stick around after games anymore.

i believe this to be a HUGE flaw and problem on this team, not a personallity imperfection.

Why? Do you have some evidence that this is a bigger problem on the Blazers than other teams?

i believe that once teams become "ok" with losing, that team will spend a long, long time at the bottom of the league. things will only change when losing becomes unacceptable.

So, winning is just a matter of will? Talent doesn't matter?

barfo

 

[TheBlueDoggy]

The behavior that zach displayed, by joking after a loss just goes along with what I, and many other fans believe is a major problem on this team.........too much emphasis on personal stats, and not caring enough about winning the game.

Wow, the guy joked around after a game and that means he doesn't care about winning? See, everyone hates losing. But there are two types of people. Those who dwell on it because they are negative people or people who need to dwell on that to push themselves to improve, and there are those who understand that a loss is not the end of the world. There is time for improvement, and cracking a joke with your team mates and having a positive atmosphere does not equate to lack of effort. In fact, social studies show that positive atmospheres and positive reinforcement after a loss tend to improve morale and improve performance.

I play pickup games hard, as do most people I play with. Win or lose though, I still joke around and try not to be a jerk after a game. Doesn't mean I try any less hard to win the next time.

Also, I know for a fact that the greats joke around in the locker room after losses. I've seen it. I can recall countless times guys like Scottie Pippen, MJ, Shaq, Kobe, etc were smiling and joking in the locker room interviews after a loss.

There's no logic to the link between joking with team mates after a loss and the amount of effort put into said loss or future games.

 

[barfo]

I guarantee Jordan didn't crack jokes after a loss.

I can recall countless times guys like Scottie Pippen, MJ, Shaq, Kobe, etc were smiling and joking in the locker room interviews after a loss.

Does not compute... inconsistent... does not compute... inconsistent... does not compute.... abort program... fatal error... abort...

barfo

 

[blazerboy30]

. Those who dwell on it because they are negative people or people who need to dwell on that to push themselves to improve, and there are those who understand that a loss is not the end of the world. There is time for improvement, and cracking a joke with your team mates and having a positive atmosphere does not equate to lack of effort.

Also, I know for a fact that the greats joke around in the locker room after losses. I've seen it. I can recall countless times guys like Scottie Pippen, MJ, Shaq, Kobe, etc were smiling and joking in the locker room interviews after a loss.

There's no logic to the link between joking with team mates after a loss and the amount of effort put into said loss or future games.

You haven't been involved in very much REAL competition then, huh? Maybe we shouldn't even keep score. that way everybody will have that feel-good feeling after games, and we won't have to worry about who won and lost.

I'm not saying he should be a bad sport about losing, and pout, or be a jerk. But, if losing bothers you as much as it should these professional athletes, then they wouldn't be joking around right after a loss.

You're very wrong about Pippen and MJ joking around after losses. MJ would not tolerate a lack of effort in practice, let alone not taking games seriously. Ask Steve Kerr, who was on the recieving end of Jordan's lack of acceptance of losing.

Pippen has been cited many, many times for being upset with teammates joking in the lockeroom after losses.

I bet you wouldn't see Kobe joking after a loss......or AI, or Jason Kidd, or Charles Barkley, or Stockton, or Malone, or Bird, or Maurice Lucas. These guys are true, fierce competitors that would not allow their teamates to accept losing either.

 

[Ed O]

You haven't been involved in very much REAL competition then, huh? Maybe we shouldn't even keep score. that way everybody will have that feel-good feeling after games, and we won't have to worry about who won and lost.

Or how about we kill the losers and use their heads for balls in the next game?

THAT'D teach those professional athletes to take things more seriously!

Ed O.

 

[ebott]

I would be in favor of having a team full of players who will do whatever it takes to win, whether it is putting aside personal stats, making the extra pass, diving for loose balls, and this sort of play.

Do you think maybe we could trade Zach for a guy like that? Maybe we could get Malik Rose? I've heard Denver is shoping Eduardo Najera. You think we could get a hold of Mark Madsen?

Point being you need talent. You can't win without talent. You'd prefer to have hard working guys rather than guys that don't work hard but talent is more important. Your odds of winning are better if you start with a talented guys and work on their deficiencies(sp?) than you are if you go with hard workers and hope that over time they can develop talent.

The behavior that zach displayed, by joking after a loss just goes along with what I, and many other fans believe is a major problem on this team.........too much emphasis on personal stats, and not caring enough about winning the game.

Well I believe that Zach, like many other professional atheletes, is simply not that bright. So it's entirely possible that he was distracted by something shiny and thought of something funny to say that wasn't related to the loss.

I don't want the guy to do my taxes or watch the wall so prisoners don't escape. He doesn't need to be a genius. And he doesn't need to be constantly vigilant.

There's something we all need to focus on when it comes to Zach. Zach Randolph is an offensive beast. If you get him the ball in good position he'll put it in the basket. If it doesn't go into the basket he'll get it back and make sure it goes into the basket the second time. Some times that transfers to the defensive end and when it does it is quite a site to behold.

I believe Shaquille O'neal put it best after a game where he had something like 7 shot attempts and was criticized for his lack of defensive intensity. "If you don't feed the dog, the dog won't guard the yard." This is true of most NBA players. If they don't get their chance to score it negatively effects the rest of their game. This goes double for big men because they depend on guards to get them the ball and are often charged with a greater defensive burden.

I'm not saying that Zach will turn into Ben Wallace if we give him enough touches but it will up his intensity on both ends of the floor. I'd rather he had that intensity to start with. But he doesn't. So it's up to management and the other players to help him get to the necessary level of intensity.

also, in my opinion, joking in the locker room after a loss is NOT considered an "off court imperfection." i believe this to be a HUGE flaw and problem on this team, not a personallity imperfection.

You may be 100% correct here. But if so then this is a HUGE flaw that lots of NBA players share. 82 games is a lot of games. Most players don't put enough value into most regular season games to get upset when they lose one.

i believe that once teams become "ok" with losing, that team will spend a long, long time at the bottom of the league. things will only change when losing becomes unacceptable.

f'shizzle. But I don't think this necessarily indicates that Zach is "ok" with losing. Lots of people take stress differently. Some folks get all huffy and some folks crack jokes. But the crappy part is that the huffy folks never understand the folks that crack jokes. And eventually the crack jokes types get suck of the huffy folks talking **** and that's how a guy like Zach ends up punching a guy like Ruben Patterson in the face.

 

[barfo]

Or how about we kill the losers and use their heads for balls in the next game?

THAT'D teach those professional athletes to take things more seriously!

Ed O.

Ed, this is an excellent idea, but may I suggest a modification? After the winning team leaves the court we should let the lions loose. I think the spectacle of unsuccessful NBA players vs. lions would be highly entertaining.

barfo