[Bona03]

What could UCLA's and USC's moves from the Pac-12 to the Big Ten mean for college basketball?

The anticipated decision of Pac-12 mainstays USC and UCLA to move to the Big Ten in 2024 has sent shock waves through college sports. What does it mean for college basketball?

www.espn.com

 

[Bill Russell]

I am being a contrarian Bill. Money is blowing up college athletics. ND is only “nationally powerful” if it can add more TV revenue than the west coast markets. Maybe so, but you have to think ND is squirming a little bit right now.

Personally, I don’t have a dog in the hunt as far as B10 expansion goes, but it is interesting to see the P5 hamstringing each other and scrambling to stay close to the money.

This is the part that is so irksome to me. Right now, it’s the Big 12, PAC 12, and ACC getting “other’d” and culled. Over time, schools like Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Nebraska, Mississippi State, and Arkansas will be cut out and seen as “mouths to feed”. The entity will continue eating itself because the top tier won’t focus on the money and power they do have, but the extra cash they don’t.

It’s a cash grab right now, but few administrators see (or care about) the long term picture. Nothing will ever be enough for whichever schools sit atop the pile. It’s a python slowly swallowing its own tail.

 

[Bona03]

What is going on is pretty sickening. Its only a matter of time before they wreck the NCAA tournament and the A10 and the MW on down are essentially D2 because the 64 teams will all be from the largest conferences.

 

[JAF_1962]

How does a college join the Amateur Athletic Union?

Hire an agent, I mean coach from one of the shoe companies

 

[Community Bank 3Pt Tee]

This is the part that is so irksome to me. Right now, it’s the Big 12, PAC 12, and ACC getting “other’d” and culled. Over time, schools like Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Nebraska, Mississippi State, and Arkansas will be cut out and seen as “mouths to feed”. The entity will continue eating itself because the top tier won’t focus on the money and power they do have, but the extra cash they don’t.

It’s a cash grab right now, but few administrators see (or care about) the long term picture. Nothing will ever be enough for whichever schools sit atop the pile. It’s a python slowly swallowing its own tail.

Did you give Unfurled express, written consent to post this? Did he plagiarize you? Are you actually him, and he you, and I’ve been to naive to this all along? Einhorn is Finkle? Finkle is Einhorn?

 

[Bill Russell]

Did you give Unfurled express, written consent to post this? Did he plagiarize you? Are you actually him, and he you, and I’ve been to naive to this all along? Einhorn is Finkle? Finkle is Einhorn?

Hahaha… I am not Unfurled, but he did ask if he could borrow it.

 

[AlienAiden]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1543024136099880961

 

[res]

Did you give Unfurled express, written consent to post this? Did he plagiarize you? Are you actually him, and he you, and I’ve been to naive to this all along? Einhorn is Finkle? Finkle is Einhorn?

Ha, I've accused him of the same thing and he has always denied it. I still have my suspicions. Bill has always reveled living in a house of mirrors of his own creation.

 

[AlienAiden]

Hahaha… I am not Unfurled, but he did ask if he could borrow it.

Everyone steals from you Bill.

 

[BigE]

rumors are Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, and Utah are discussing moving to the Big 12.

https://twitter.com/jasonscheer

 

[GMUfan17]

Anyone see Wichita State potentially coming to the conference? I mean if the 4 PAC schools go to the B12 and then the other four go to the B1G it would leave Oregon and Washington State to the MWC. That could maybe push SMU and Tulsa to the MWC as well. I mean at that point the shocker would have to go somewhere. What do you guys think? It's funny how the A10 said they're open to a 16th school a month before this haha.

 

[JAF_1962]

Anyone see Wichita State potentially coming to the conference? I mean if the 4 PAC schools go to the B12 and then the other four go to the B1G it would leave Oregon and Washington State to the MWC. That could maybe push SMU and Tulsa to the MWC as well. I mean at that point the shocker would have to go somewhere. What do you guys think? It's funny how the A10 said they're open to a 16th school a month before this haha.

Or Oregon State and Washington State head to the B12 vs the MWC. That would put the B12 at 18 assuming that no other schools leave. I would think that the B12 would be looking for as many members possible vs maximizing TV revenue.

I would love to see WSU in the A10 from a basketball standpoint, but I bet they see themselves as a better institutional fit with the new AAC

 

[jpschmack]

Why aim for Wichita State? If the rest of college sports is in total chaos, let's land Gonzaga and Stanford.

 

[jpschmack]

Tons of the rumors are the natural reaction to the shock of the initial announcement; and another sizeable chunk of them are ESPN propaganda.

No different than when their reporters were tweeting rumors about Big 12 schools talking to the American last year; if Pac-12 members join the Big 12, then ESPN can give the Big 12 a big contract and the Pac-12 and American small ones.

If the Pac-12 raids the Big 12 for four schools from Texas, and the Big 12 raids the American for their Texas schools, then ESPN has to pay the Pac-12 and Big 12 big contracts and the AAC a small one.

 

[Rich93]

We all know how this ends: college football on its own 60 teams either 2 or 4 conferences. The only question is it 2 years or 4.

The real question is how does this effect basketball. Have not seen this suggested. In addition to the football schools you have three basketball conferences 20 teams each. Big East, Big Midwest and Big West. Let the basketball conference Hunger Games begin.

 

[BigE]

Sports Business Journal
@SBJ

The Big 12 is in discussion to add up to six Pac-12 teams.
• Arizona
• Arizona State
• Colorado
• Oregon
• Utah
• Washington

There's also possibility of a merger between the two conferences

 

[jpschmack]

I have been proven wrong many times by administrators doing foolish things or losing their minds (Or someone like Texas radically changing their historical stance).

But Pac-12 teams joining the Big 12 seems crazy to me. Like it's more ESPN leaking propaganda to save them money.

Ten months ago, the Big 12 lost Texas/Oklahoma to the SEC. And EVERY STORY for the next week or two was about the breakup of the Big 12, members getting rejected by the Big Ten and Pac-12; how bad their media rights deal would be, how their members would be willing to join a LESSER CONFERENCE (The American).

And the Big 12 stayed together, raided the American and started negotiating a decent TV deal.


Now the exact same path is happening with Pac-12 stories. How is it that the Pac-12 didn't want THE BEST REMAINING Big 12 members LAST YEAR, but now 6 of the remaining 10 would gladly ditch two schools in the #4 CSA to join up with Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St, West Virginia, Texas Tech and Oklahoma State?


It sounds to me like ESPN doesn't want to pay TWO $500 million contracts to the Big 12 and Pac-12, so if they can get everyone but Cal, Stanford, Wash St and Oregon St into the Big 12, they can pay ONE $750 million contract and save a quarter of a billion dollars.


The Pac-12 needs to invite TCU, Baylor, Houston, SMU, Oklahoma State and Kansas.

 

[JAF_1962]

I have been proven wrong many times by administrators doing foolish things or losing their minds (Or someone like Texas radically changing their historical stance).

But Pac-12 teams joining the Big 12 seems crazy to me. Like it's more ESPN leaking propaganda to save them money.

Ten months ago, the Big 12 lost Texas/Oklahoma to the SEC. And EVERY STORY for the next week or two was about the breakup of the Big 12, members getting rejected by the Big Ten and Pac-12; how bad their media rights deal would be, how their members would be willing to join a LESSER CONFERENCE (The American).

And the Big 12 stayed together, raided the American and started negotiating a decent TV deal.


Now the exact same path is happening with Pac-12 stories. How is it that the Pac-12 didn't want THE BEST REMAINING Big 12 members LAST YEAR, but now 6 of the remaining 10 would gladly ditch two schools in the #4 CSA to join up with Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St, West Virginia, Texas Tech and Oklahoma State?


It sounds to me like ESPN doesn't want to pay TWO $500 million contracts to the Big 12 and Pac-12, so if they can get everyone but Cal, Stanford, Wash St and Oregon St into the Big 12, they can pay ONE $750 million contract and save a quarter of a billion dollars.


The Pac-12 needs to invite TCU, Baylor, Houston, SMU, Oklahoma State and Kansas.

The PAC12 has no leverage now that UCLA and USC aren’t in the equation. The current TV revenues aren’t nearly close to what you mentioned. The PAC12’s current contracts with Fox and ESPN is $3 billion paid out over 12 years or $250 million annually. The BIG12’s is $200 million annually.

The BIG 12 plus those six schools from the PAC12 would be much more formidable in both football and basketball. It wouldn’t garner a +$1 billion TV deal like the B10, or anything close to it, so I see it more that those schools are scrambling for the best deal just to remain relevant vs. maximizing TV revenue. The PAC12 is fucked with the LA schools.

 

[Rich93]

And Jaf wins post of the day with actual contract numbers put into the context of P12 losing USC and UCLA.

 

[Community Bank 3Pt Tee]

On the subject of how this all affects basketball, and the idea of there being multiple tournaments, I'm not at doomsday for a couple of simple reasons.

This is football driven, obviously. There is considerable brand power within college basketball of schools who, both literally and figuratively, are haves in NCAAB and have-nots in NCAAF. Some are FBS schools who will be elbowed aside by realignment, some are schools who do not have FBS programs. The latter, of course, includes everyone in this conference aside from UMass.

The football have-nots who are basketball haves must band together to hold their ground to make sure that when the dust settles from the nonsense, their basketball chops don't get elbowed aside into a 1/1A situation. There is enough brand power there amongst these type of schools to do it. The NCAA relies heavily on the NCAAT for its annual financial nut. It needs it. I suppose a case could be made having 2 tournaments would allow them to keep it in some form, but history (see: NCAAT vs NIT) suggests otherwise.

As long as the schools in that category retain power behind a movement to keep their rightful competitive place in NCAAB, there is hope for hoops to come out of this in some form that is still recognizable. Oddly enough, NIL can help here. The fact that you can essentially be paid to play now takes some wind out of the sails of the idea of a full breakout, where players become employees of the schools in super conferences wholly unaffiliated with the NCAA.

As far as our schools our concerned, win now and build your brand as much as you can, so that you're included and considered on the right side of all of it when some basketball focused ripple comes of all of this.

It's a weird and dirty thing to think of Villanova or UConn or etc as a potential friend to our NCAA futures, but the shoe fits nowadays.