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Oh I believe that there are many reasons why Xavier would not want UD in the NBE. I said that it was delusional to argue that that from an institutional standpoint UD is at a competitive disadvantage to Xavier because Xavier is a member of the NBE.
Ehhh... that's actually not what you said...

Xavier not wanting UD in the New Big East is a strategic decision relative to men's basketball only. You are delusional if you believe any different.
I don't know if you just don't want to believe it or what...

But, again, the reason Xavier does not want Dayton to be in the Big East has nothing to do with men's basketball. Dayton and Xavier were in the same league for 18 years - how were those 18 years for UD basketball and Xavier basketball?

It's much larger than that. It's a strategic institutional decision.

Now UD leadership would love an invite to the Big East partly for men's basketball. But the real driver is much larger than that as a University wide strategic thing. Try to get in front of some of the people at UD and have a conversation with them - I have. They are good people and have UD moving in the right direction, but I think you might be surprised with what you hear.
 

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Ehhh... that's actually not what you said...



I don't know if you just don't want to believe it or what...

But, again, the reason Xavier does not want Dayton to be in the Big East has nothing to do with men's basketball. Dayton and Xavier were in the same league for 18 years - how were those 18 years for UD basketball and Xavier basketball?

It's much larger than that. It's a strategic institutional decision.

Now UD leadership would love an invite to the Big East partly for men's basketball. But the real driver is much larger than that as a University wide strategic thing. Try to get in front of some of the people at UD and have a conversation with them - I have. They are good people and have UD moving in the right direction, but I think you might be surprised with what you hear.
For at least the fourth time and the last time, I am in agreement with you that UD see's the NBE as a better fit institutionally. There is no argument from me. There never was.

My point was, and still is, that The University of Dayton is not in a competitive disadvantage with Xavier because of Xavier's inclusion in the NBE. The facts that I provided support this.
 

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I'm going to chime in on this...JAF is 100% right in his assertion X in NBE and UD not does not put UD in a competitive disadvantage to X. UD is a school in far more demand than X, find some 17-23 year olds and they'll explain it and actually it's as simple as visiting their campuses. In addition UD's endowment affords them to pursue better faculty and students with $$'s.

From X and Butler standpoint...there is no doubt UD in NBE would only further enhances UD's position but excluding UD isn't going to change how prospective students matriculate.

I'm not saying exclusion is or has been exercised but rumors and people that say things like, "I'm connected and I know for a fact" are out there.
 

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I know the current TV money is much better in the Big East, but Dayton has surely gone to another level in the A10 since X and Temple departed. From a "get to the dance" standpoint, the Flyers are in a pretty damn good spot where they are.
 

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I'm going to chime in on this...JAF is 100% right in his assertion X in NBE and UD not does not put UD in a competitive disadvantage to X. UD is a school in far more demand than X, find some 17-23 year olds and they'll explain it and actually it's as simple as visiting their campuses. In addition UD's endowment affords them to pursue better faculty and students with $$'s.

From X and Butler standpoint...there is no doubt UD in NBE would only further enhances UD's position but excluding UD isn't going to change how prospective students matriculate.

I'm not saying exclusion is or has been exercised but rumors and people that say things like, "I'm connected and I know for a fact" are out there.
I polled some youngster's and they confirmed your theory. Some quotes:

"I chose Dayton because Archie puts his teams in a position to win"

"Dayton really impressed me with their victory over a top 15 team W&M"
 

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but there is little doubt in my mind from an institutional standpoint UD would very much like to be allied with peers like Nova, Georgetown and Marquette and other Catholic U's but definitely those 3 from the peer institution side. Though not being affiliated (conference wise) won't change UD's trajectory...our new President is a perfect fit for where UD is today and where it's going tomorrow. And an outside opinion on the basketball side from today's WSJ.

all this talk aside, I'm very confident about A10's trajectory as well...a lot of good young coaches have their programs on nice trajectories and going to make this league very good.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-much-is-your-college-basketball-team-worth-1459459516
 

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lol that article is a joke.

Villanova not listed? Yeah, okay.

South Florida listed somewhere? Yeah, okay.

And no, I get it's not just taking W/L into account, but there's no way South Florida has any ability to have a higher valuation than, like, almost any other bb program.

I get it; some fans want to chest pound or whatever. Go for it. Just don't expect everyone else to agree with cited examples like the wsj article.

EDIT: in the top 50, I mean.
 

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but there is little doubt in my mind from an institutional standpoint UD would very much like to be allied with peers like Nova, Georgetown and Marquette and other Catholic U's but definitely those 3 from the peer institution side. Though not being affiliated (conference wise) won't change UD's trajectory...our new President is a perfect fit for where UD is today and where it's going tomorrow. And an outside opinion on the basketball side from today's WSJ.

all this talk aside, I'm very confident about A10's trajectory as well...a lot of good young coaches have their programs on nice trajectories and going to make this league very good.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-much-is-your-college-basketball-team-worth-1459459516
How are Villanova and Georgetown peers to Dayton? Do you mean just b/c they are Catholic? Plenty of those in the A10.
 

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How are Villanova and Georgetown peers to Dayton? Do you mean just b/c they are Catholic? Plenty of those in the A10.
Yeah, I don't get that. Sorry, UD, but Villanova (maybe it can be argued in some ways) and Georgetown (nope, it can't be) are not really institutional peers.

DC, Philly, Dayton.

Hmmmmm
 

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chest pounding, dick waving? whatever but it's the WSJ doing the reporting not me. I would guess NOVA is absent because their attendance is way behind UD's and many of their home games are in a pro arena and the others in a small capacity arena
 

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chest pounding, dick waving? whatever but it's the WSJ doing the reporting not me. I would guess NOVA is absent because their attendance is way behind UD's and many of their home games are in a pro arena and the others in a small capacity arena
It's shitty reporting. It's based on some numbers a finance professor at IU-PU Columbus (where in Indiana is that?) threw together that's based on...wait, what? You can't create a market value for anything that is in a market that technically doesn't exist. It's like when Facebook buys Instagram or Whatsapp and everyone laughs at them and then years later Zuckerberg is wearing tshirts made of money. He bought stuff that others deemed crazy at that price because no market exists (or existed).

I'm just saying...
 

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It's shitty reporting. It's based on some numbers a finance professor at IU-PU Columbus (where in Indiana is that?) threw together that's based on...wait, what? You can't create a market value for anything that is in a market that technically doesn't exist. It's like when Facebook buys Instagram or Whatsapp and everyone laughs at them and then years later Zuckerberg is wearing tshirts made of money. He bought stuff that others deemed crazy at that price because no market exists (or existed).

I'm just saying...
Is someone claiming the reporting is 100% accurate? It's fluff piece...I don't have it pinned up on my bulletin board! But with every college basketball fluff piece 1 thing is consistent... the Flyers are always in every financial analysis as 1 of top non P5 in revenue because UD has owned a 13,000+ arena and sold almost 10,000 season tickets every year for 45 years.

Butler?

Revenue and value of the franchise...I would think UD is worth way more than 4X Butler...a lot more UD alums and people willing to plop down $$'s to watch the Flyers play.
 

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It's shitty reporting. It's based on some numbers a finance professor at IU-PU Columbus (where in Indiana is that?) threw together that's based on...wait, what? You can't create a market value for anything that is in a market that technically doesn't exist. It's like when Facebook buys Instagram or Whatsapp and everyone laughs at them and then years later Zuckerberg is wearing tshirts made of money. He bought stuff that others deemed crazy at that price because no market exists (or existed).

I'm just saying...
Columbus Indiana, home of Cummins engines. That is all I know about that city, I think its about 30 minutes or so south of Indy, but not sure.

I wonder how much of that list is tied to arena ownership? Does the UD basketball team get credit for income generated at the arena, outside of basketball use? If so, its easy to see why Louisville would be so high as they host a ton of big time concerts. Not that their basketball program isn't profitable, but certainly UK is a bigger brand, but their arena is much older, and while some concerts are held there (or at least were, not sure how often) the YUM center definitely gets the biggest touring acts.

Aside from that , Nova doesn't own the pro arena they play in (how often I'm not sure), which means they have to pay rent and don't get the profits, or as much of the profits as they could had the owned a 12,000 seat arena.

That's about the only reasons I could see for some of those teams. (northwestern, S Florida, so many SEC schools, etc...
 

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Yea Ored, not a good article to try to make any point about.

Arkansas, South Florida, Penn State, Missouri, Auburn ...... most valuable men's basketball programs?

The numbers from the professor from IU-Purdue Columbus don't even make sense. Talking about revenue from men's basketball alone near $80M for schools like Xavier and Dayton. Hell, their entire athletic departments don't generate $80M in revenue.

Just a very odd article
 

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but there is little doubt in my mind from an institutional standpoint UD would very much like to be allied with peers like Nova, Georgetown and Marquette and other Catholic U's but definitely those 3 from the peer institution side.
Let's play a game: What doesn't belong...

Georgetown...Villanova...Dayton

The sweater vest crowd thinks they all belong together.
 

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Yeah, I don't get that. Sorry, UD, but Villanova (maybe it can be argued in some ways) and Georgetown (nope, it can't be) are not really institutional peers.

DC, Philly, Dayton.

Hmmmmm
I would say that Georgetown is at a different level, and probably on par with Notre Dame in many ways. Marquette, DePaul, Seton Hall and St. Johns are similar to UD in size. Villanova is smaller and has a more selective process than UD, but not significantly more so.

I posted before that the A10 schools from an academic standpoint as a group are stronger than the NBE. GW, Fordham, Richmond and Davidson can hold their own with most colleges.
 

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I hate the offseason. This is almost as bad as the Bona board bringing up football every summer or complaining about a row of chairs...almost as bad.
 
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