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Discussion Starter #1
RLucas has been stating and restating that Curry doesn't show up for games before Jan. 20. Of course I think he's right, but here's some support for this position:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...lsbits,1,419968.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines

Curry's first two seasons have featured a disturbing trend in which he plays inconsistently until near the All-Star break and then finishes like an All-Star.

<B>Coach Scott Skiles even once derided Curry's strong finish from last season, saying it came in "<FONT COLOR=ff0000 SIZE=+2>meaningless games</FONT>."</B>
 

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I think has a lot to do with him finally being in shape at this point of the season. If he reports to training camp in this kind of shape he could play this way all season, or at least have a much better chance of doing so.
 

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Ok, i have been hard on Eddy, and his Small forward stats.

Be that as it may, this thing where Eddy gets stronger as the season goes on is pretty positive to me. If he ever gets into shape to begin balling in October, watch out, we could have a real small forward :laugh:

alright i'll stop.:rolleyes:

seriously, this is a good thing. If he gets into shape early on......
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Originally posted by <b>7thwatch</b>!
I think has a lot to do with him finally being in shape at this point of the season. If he reports to training camp in this kind of shape he could play this way all season, or at least have a much better chance of doing so.
A huge difference between Curry and Shaq is that Shaq had a teammate who not only wanted to be the best player in the NBA, but who worked his tail off to become the best player in the NBA (that'd be Kobe). When you have a teammate of that caliber working so hard in the offseason, that teammate can challenge or encourage a guy like Curry to work hard in the offseason.

We don't have a guy like Kobe, or at least didn't in the past offseason. Jamal played EBC ball. Rose had already become the best player he'd ever be. Pippen was given a pass to get himself in shape at his own pace. Chandler suffered from his esophogus problems much of the summer (and maybe sore back, too). Hinrich was drafted and then got that awful virus that laid him up for weeks. And so on.
 

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Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
RLucas has been stating and restating that Curry doesn't show up for games before Jan. 20. Of course I think he's right, but here's some support for this position:
Thats a fact (Curry not showing until late in the season) not an opinion.
 

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I actually think that Skiles and Pax is right............to an extent. It is physical and being in shape. But I actually think its more mental. This kid seems so laid back and he plays with no sense of urgency to start the year in 3 years in the league. Its like he needs a wake up call, and he tends to get it in Jan. Even his rookie year, he was an average NBA starting Center, as a 19 year old no less, on around the first week of Feb. Last year he was the second or third best Center after the last week in Jan. The last 2 weeks, he is back to being the 3rd best center. the trick is getting him to believe in November that its Jan. Maybe the could have a ton of snow around the Berto Center brought in. Put Jan on his palm pilot, celebrate Xmas in October, whatever. Just get this kid to believe its Jan, when its actually Nov. I think he needs to be in shape. But trust me when I say its all between the ears with this kid
 

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Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!



We don't have a guy like Kobe, or at least didn't in the past offseason. Jamal played EBC ball. Rose had already become the best player he'd ever be. Pippen was given a pass to get himself in shape at his own pace. Chandler suffered from his esophogus problems much of the summer (and maybe sore back, too). Hinrich was drafted and then got that awful virus that laid him up for weeks. And so on.
the previous year Kobe played in the EBC too
 

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Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!


Kobe also spent almost all his waking hours in the gym honing his skills.
except apparently that week he spent in ny at the EBC, but back to kobe he isn't that kind of guy in L.A. he doesn't have a close relationship with his players and rarely speaks to them when the season ends.

He doesn't encourage or challenge his teammates at all for offseason conditioning ..if anything that guy is the often lazy shaq

http://www.insidehoops.com/streetball-kobe-bryant-rucker-park-071802.shtml
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The Lakers do see themselves as Shaq's team. This is true.

A major cause of the feud between Kobe and Shaq is that Kobe practices so much and Shaq plays (off the court) too much for Kobe's liking. Kobe and Shaq have had a number of on-court arguments about why Kobe won't pass the ball to Shaq late in games. Kobe's response is "If Shaq would PRACTICE his free throws, he wouldn't be a liability if he gets fouled at the end of games."

In fact, the amount of time Kobe spent practicing, even alone, during his first few seasons is WHY he's not close to his teammates. He's motivated to prove to everyone he's the best player in the NBA, year after year, and "for 48 minutes" (that's a direct quote from Bryant).

Now when Shaq shows up for summer camp 50 pounds overweight and suffering from minor nagging injuries to boot, Kobe has every right (in his mind) to complain about the situation.

Kobe wants to win the ring. He knows he needs Shaq to be in tip-top shape to get that ring.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I've posted one reason why I think Curry doesn't play well until after Jan. 20th. Here's another.

There's a sort of vicious circle in action here. Curry goes off late in the season. The press and pundits talk him up in the offseason. Opposing teams prepare for him in the offseason or training camp. He's unable to play well against defenses stacked against him, so he looks bad. Then the season becomes a wash and opponents take us lightly (and rightly so, according to K.C. Johnson). And Curry is then able to play better.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...hnson,1,2499925.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines

<B>There has been a lot of talk about the Bulls fading in the fourth quarter. Could it be that other teams don't play hard against the Bulls until the fourth, knowing that they are better? Also, I know home cooking is a big advantage, but do some teams talk themselves into being lousy road teams? --Les, Manteno, Ill.</B>

I think the former thought is more realistic than the latter. It's not like the Bulls talk themselves into playing poorly on the road. They do sometimes sag when things don't go their way because there is such a culture of losing. But I've seen less of that on this trip, on which they actually have played well since the Portland game onward. But, yes, certainly, the Bulls are in a lot of games because teams take them lightly. And then when the fourth quarter comes around, teams get interested.
(Houston BLEW US OUT last night, but didn't have the killer instinct to close us out. The game should never have been close, if Houston didn't take us too lightly, as KC suggests. My $.02)
 

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Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
I've posted one reason why I think Curry doesn't play well until after Jan. 20th. Here's another.

There's a sort of vicious circle in action here. Curry goes off late in the season. The press and pundits talk him up in the offseason. Opposing teams prepare for him in the offseason or training camp. He's unable to play well against defenses stacked against him, so he looks bad. Then the season becomes a wash and opponents take us lightly (and rightly so, according to K.C. Johnson). And Curry is then able to play better.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...hnson,1,2499925.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines



(Houston BLEW US OUT last night, but didn't have the killer instinct to close us out. The game should never have been close, if Houston didn't take us too lightly, as KC suggests. My $.02)
if this is a trend its a one season trend ..was anyone really pilling up on curry to start last season? no , he didn't warrant that kind of consideration ...his breakout of the previous year was something close 10 points agame for a couple of weeks. as opposed to nearly 19 a game points for a couple of months., there was a huge difference as he was supposed to be a number one option this season ...not really last year at all when he was to be a cog in the machine
 

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I used to get hammered for making the "meaningless games" comments. I still think it is true, but I also think it is because he can't handle the pressure of being THE guy yet. I don't know if he ever will, but he might be a great second or third scoring option. It is just a shame the other aspects of his game do not appear to be progressing like it should.
 

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I think we all would agree that Curry's disturbing trend of taking half the season to get in shape is ridiculous. That is a given and a standard we should expect and coaches and GMs should demand of their players. Curry doesn't want to admit that the heavier workouts are helping to improve his play, but he should, it is pretty obvious to everyone else, and he seems to be in denial of the lazy label.

This last offseason the eye was somewhat of an excuse. But it wasn't the prior year and won't be this summer, when I have confidence that Skiles and Paxson will push him hard to work on his body and his game. I am convinced Skiles can teach if he has a willing pupil. My perception of the offseason goals for Curry and maybe Crawford and Chandler have been modest workouts and some streetball type pickup games with other pros and better college players. I don't believe that is appropriate.

Those games tend to be all flash and little substance. Particularly with Crawford you spend a summer playing a flashy game lacking in fundamentals, and them come to camp trying to get that out of your system and having to relearn fitting into the system.

The fans, Skiles and Paxson should all hold the three C's, the key to the future, to high expectations this offseason. In essence if Crawford and Chandler are not significantly bigger and stronger and have not worked on improving a specific fundamental part of their game they should be called out and ripped by all concerned.

In essence one of two scenarios will play out, they will be held to a much higher standard by Skiles and Paxson, it will not be considered optional, and they will in my opinion be expected to work on their body and game more at the Berto center, and less on their own, and in pickup games. In Curry's case of course losing weight would be on the agenda.

I understand that these things are technically optional, but they are also routines that separate the dedicated star players who care from the also rans. Many players in addition to physical workouts, develope another move, work on their free throw shooting, or with staff and coaches on areas of weakness.

They will either comply with that stronger emphasis from Skiles and Pax or ignore them and go their usual way. The answer to that question may be more important than many other issues this summer because most agree they only go as far as those players take them. To a certain extent we will know what kind of a season next year will be before a single shot is taken in camp, just by measuring the offseason committment from the three C's.

I believe Skiles and Pax are appropriate in taking a hard love approach to motivating them to be dedicated mature professionals, and I would probably wait before unloading them. If they don't cooperate this summer, however, it is time to give up on them, but they would at that point be devaulued assets that probably would draw little in return. Their market value will move one way or the other this offseason, it is up to them.
 

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Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!


He went one day and played in 1 game...
you honestly believe he went across country in the morning and was back at home by the bedtime?

kobe is a hard worker but i assure you if he wanted to work out he could have found a gym in new york city
 

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Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
I've posted one reason why I think Curry doesn't play well until after Jan. 20th. Here's another.

There's a sort of vicious circle in action here. Curry goes off late in the season. The press and pundits talk him up in the offseason. Opposing teams prepare for him in the offseason or training camp. He's unable to play well against defenses stacked against him, so he looks bad. Then the season becomes a wash and opponents take us lightly (and rightly so, according to K.C. Johnson). And Curry is then able to play better.
:yes:

The same story with his buddy, Jamal. Jamal scores mostly when the opposing team is neglecting his presence or encouraging him to do that because of breaking the cohesiveness of the Bulls.

However, I do believe Jamal is absolutely worse the money he been paid !

We need to put more money on the table to see a different Jamal.
 
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