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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
This was Telfair's breakout performance, with 27 points, 7 assists, and 6 rebounds. He made some phenomenal plays under the basket, turning impossible situations into spectacular lay-ups, and he displayed a confidence that is remarkable for a 20-year-old point guard.

Telfair showed exactly why John Nash drafted him, and why he is going to be a star in this league. All you doubters can start writing your retractions now.
 

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Talkhard said:
This was Telfair's breakout performance, with 27 points, 7 assists, and 6 rebounds. He showed exactly why John Nash drafted him, and why he is going to be a star in this league. All you doubters can start writing your retractions now.
Yes, he played very well today. He had a very Stephon Marbury-like game.

All in all, I'd rather see 18 pts and 12 assists than 27 pts and 7 assists.
 

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I'm a huge Telfair fan, but someone has to play devil's advocate... As was always countered with Damon, look at what Telfair gave up (to Stephon) at the other end: 27 pts and 8 assists. Telfair's game was more efficient -- less attempts and more rebounds -- but they basically cancelled each other out. Granted, Marbury is one of the most talented PG's in the league, so negating him is no small feat, but Telfair needs to outplay the competition before we can annoint him a star.

Dan
 

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The bottom line you can tell Bassy was just doing what the coach told him to do earlier in the season just being a setup point guard , thats not his strength and I guess Nate noticed that . Sebastian is a scoring point guard with great on court vision .
 

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dkap said:
I'm a huge Telfair fan, but someone has to play devil's advocate... As was always countered with Damon, look at what Telfair gave up (to Stephon) at the other end: 27 pts and 8 assists. Telfair's game was more efficient -- less attempts and more rebounds -- but they basically cancelled each other out. Granted, Marbury is one of the most talented PG's in the league, so negating him is no small feat, but Telfair needs to outplay the competition before we can annoint him a star.

Dan
I agree with this post 100%.
 

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dkap said:
I'm a huge Telfair fan, but someone has to play devil's advocate... As was always countered with Damon, look at what Telfair gave up (to Stephon) at the other end: 27 pts and 8 assists. Telfair's game was more efficient -- less attempts and more rebounds -- but they basically cancelled each other out. Granted, Marbury is one of the most talented PG's in the league, so negating him is no small feat, but Telfair needs to outplay the competition before we can annoint him a star.

Dan
Mabury had a excellent game also nobody can guard that man 1 on 1
 

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I can accept the fact a 20 year old matched all star Stephon Marbury point to point and assist to assist. Give him time, dfensive awareness comes with time in the league.
 

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Woops yeh thats what i meant better defender my bad.One thing i noticed though it when Jack is in the offense seems to stagnate and when Bassy is in it goes really nice.
 

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To be fair, Jack didn't really get much of an opportunity to show what he could do against the Knicks. It's unlikely that he would have played as well as Telfair did, but still a possibility.
 

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dkap said:
I'm a huge Telfair fan, but someone has to play devil's advocate... As was always countered with Damon, look at what Telfair gave up (to Stephon) at the other end: 27 pts and 8 assists. Telfair's game was more efficient -- less attempts and more rebounds -- but they basically cancelled each other out. Granted, Marbury is one of the most talented PG's in the league, so negating him is no small feat, but Telfair needs to outplay the competition before we can annoint him a star.

Dan
I don't see how that follows logically. Does that mean Marbury is not a star because he didn't "outplay" Telfair, only negated him? Or if Marbury and Kidd played each other and negated each other, would neither be a star? I would say that if Telfair "negates" other stars and outplays non-stars, that would make him a star. Which he isn't yet, but I would say he had a star performance today. His defense isn't great, but it's not Stoudamire-bad. Marbury is simply gifted.
 

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Telfair was very, very good today. I've never been convinced that Jack is (or will be) better than Telfair, but as one who has questioned (and continues to question) picking him with the 13th pick last year, I wanted to chime in and give him some props.

I prefer to have a very good pass-first PG to a very good shoot-first PG, and Telfair was definitely closer to the latter today. With that being said, I'd prefer ANY very good PG to any other lesser PG... and these kinds of games, given his age and his experience level, bode very very well for Sebastian's future in the NBA as an above-average (and perhaps much more) player.

Ed O.
 
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Fork said:
Yes, he played very well today. He had a very Stephon Marbury-like game.

All in all, I'd rather see 18 pts and 12 assists than 27 pts and 7 assists.

The one thing that I have observed about Telfair, the one thing he is special at already, is passing the ball and setting up his teammates. Normally you have to get the young guys to understand that's what a good point guard does. In Telfair's case he already gets that. Almost to a fault in the sense that he had forgone his offensive game so much that everyone was just sagging off into the passing lanes. Sebastian going out and establishing himself as a serious offensive threat is the best thing he can do right now in my opinion. Even if he does lose some assists in the short term. Once the oppponents have to respect all parts of his game, then we'll have a true all star at the point.
 

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Does that mean Marbury is not a star because he didn't "outplay" Telfair, only negated him?
I wasn't thinking about it that way, but sure. At this point, I'm no longer sure that Marbury should be regarded as a star in the league. All-world talent, but extremely average impact on the team's success, and he's had a lot more average games of late than he used to.

However, the point I was trying to make is that Telfair hasn't really outplayed anyone yet, not for a complete game. His 27, 7, and 6 today was given as evidence of a star in the making, but it was a big game that lacked impact because he gave up just as much. If he got those numbers while giving up something like 8 points and 4 assists, then that would be huge.

Dan
 

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This is where assist numbers can become deceptive.

Before today's game, Jarret was the team's leading assist man while playing less minutes than Telfair. However, Telfair runs the offense better and is good at getting players involved. His ability to drive into the lane is far better than Jack's and so far, Telfair's been the better shooter (to my surprise).

As I've said before, I believe it's nice to have contrasting point guards on the same team because they can each change the tempo of a game and they each bring different strengths to the floor. Give them some time to season and get some much needed experience and I think we can have a great point guard tandem for a good long time with Telfair running the show as our starter and Jack coming in as the high energy, momentum changing combo guard who can come in and make some big plays down the stretch.

As Blazer fans, we should feel lucky that we're in this kind of situation.
 

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dkap said:
I wasn't thinking about it that way, but sure.
Fair enough. Then there are almost no stars, because very few guys do more than negate the other great players they play. Tim Duncan did no more than negate Amare Stoudemire in the Spurs-Suns 2005 playoff series, for example. And vice versa.

However, the point I was trying to make is that Telfair hasn't really outplayed anyone yet, not for a complete game. His 27, 7, and 6 today was given as evidence of a star in the making, but it was a big game that lacked impact because he gave up just as much.
I disagree. I think negating another tremendous player is a huge impact. When Duncan and Garnett negate each other, for example, that's a tremendous accomplishment for both players. It doesn't mean that neither player had an impact because of what they gave up.
 

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one good thing - a few more games like that for telfair and blazers won't be utterly all-starless for a change - WOOOO telfair vs. paul in rookie/soph game!!
 

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Then there are almost no stars, because very few guys do more than negate the other great players they play. Tim Duncan did no more than negate Amare Stoudemire in the Spurs-Suns 2005 playoff series, for example. And vice versa.
But that's negating a proven star, in addition to outplaying anyone inferior. So far, Telfair hasn't accomplished that second piece, so he's done nothing yet to stand out above the pack.

I disagree. I think negating another tremendous player is a huge impact.
Certainly against top tier players, but if you don't maintain that same level of play against lesser talents, I'd say that makes you pretty average. Telfair is getting better as the season progresses, so it's reasonable to assume he'll start outplaying guys not quite at Marbury's level before long, but until he actually does so, it's premature to heap accolades of stardom on him. Right now, he's basically a mismatch specialist -- too quick to guard but not able to hold someone in check at the other end -- and that basically means a wash at the position night in and night out if it continues. The rest of our team isn't good enough to consistently outplay their counterparts, so we need Telfair to do more.

Dan
 

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dkap said:
But that's negating a proven star, in addition to outplaying anyone inferior. So far, Telfair hasn't accomplished that second piece, so he's done nothing yet to stand out above the pack.


Certainly against top tier players, but if you don't maintain that same level of play against lesser talents, I'd say that makes you pretty average. Telfair is getting better as the season progresses, so it's reasonable to assume he'll start outplaying guys not quite at Marbury's level before long, but until he actually does so, it's premature to heap accolades of stardom on him.
I agree with you. But I don't think anyone is calling him an NBA star, yet. As far as I'd go is that he played like a star today...he negated New York's star. The impact is that New York didn't win because of Marbury winning his match-up...it was up to the rest of the team. If Randolph and Miles had shown up, especially on the boards, I think this was a very winnable game and that was due to Telfair's performance.
 
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