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Hey guys, I was just wondering how you guys would feel if PP got traded? Let's say for Vince Carter or someone of that calibre?
 

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I am all for trading Pierce (for a better player. No loyalty in Celtics Nation anymore) but not for Vince Carter.

The guy gets hurt way too much.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
Let's see first if Pierce changes his game under the new regime.
The only change I see now is more 3s....:-/
If our new coach made the offense....well you know the rest.
 

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I can't believe i'm hearing this!

this thread is sickening and disloyal to celt's fans everywhere...trading PP would not only be a travesty, it would be worst than the list of mistakes that the ainge regime has already made.

PP has been loyal and has been playing thru these horrible changes that has forced him to pick up the slack and be everything for the C's. He's the only player in the NBA to lead his team in points, rebounds, and assists...

plainly put he IS our team, even more than T-mac who has the same problem as pierce, but does have a very good drew gooden and a half decent vet in Howard, and they barely have double digit wins...Iverson has glen rob and we'll throw in eric snow for good measure.... vince has rose, marshall, and Bosh....PP has Jiri welsch, blount, and mccarty yet we're just under .500...

my point is that PP is a Jewel, if we can get a scoring big man, or a scoring somebody, or even a PG we'll be right back in the conference race...

to trade PP IS A DISQUSTING SUGGESTION, PERIOD.
 

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Re: I can't believe i'm hearing this!

Originally posted by <b>princeb</b>!
this thread is sickening and disloyal to celt's fans everywhere...trading PP would not only be a travesty, it would be worst than the list of mistakes that the ainge regime has already made.

PP has been loyal and has been playing thru these horrible changes that has forced him to pick up the slack and be everything for the C's. He's the only player in the NBA to lead his team in points, rebounds, and assists...

plainly put he IS our team, even more than T-mac who has the same problem as pierce, but does have a very good drew gooden and a half decent vet in Howard, and they barely have double digit wins...Iverson has glen rob and we'll throw in eric snow for good measure.... vince has rose, marshall, and Bosh....PP has Jiri welsch, blount, and mccarty yet we're just under .500...

my point is that PP is a Jewel, if we can get a scoring big man, or a scoring somebody, or even a PG we'll be right back in the conference race...

to trade PP IS A DISQUSTING SUGGESTION, PERIOD.






Everyone should read this post, and put it in the books. After you read this post and thoroughly memorize it, this thread should be stickied to refer to anytime someone brings up trading our franchise player, thank you.
 

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Why should they keep him? Pierce obviously cant carry this team by himself, so time to try something new. The C's are going nowhere but down this year.
 

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There's no reason to even entertain the thought of dealing Pierce. He's got diverse talents, few weaknesses, is locked up long term, is clutch, can carry a team, and is just starting to become more of a vocal leader now that Toine is gone.

I dunno, maybe I'm a sucker, but I trust Danny in the direction he's taking the club. Maybe they'll get a coach who'll force Pierce in to the post, then run motion off of the double teams he'll draw. I mean, PP is a -thick- player, and should be able to out muscle just about every single SF on the block. Let Jiri give him the entry pass so as to avoid the same-side double, and run Ricky toward the hoop, Blount at the high block.

This offense could work so much more fluidly if they just drew up plays that revolved around Paul posting up.

Am I wrong?
 

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Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
Why should they keep him? Pierce obviously cant carry this team by himself, so time to try something new. The C's are going nowhere but down this year.






I'm not even going to argue. The mention of himn being traded shuldnt even be a mention.
 

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Originally posted by <b>adamatic</b>!
There's no reason to even entertain the thought of dealing Pierce. He's got diverse talents, few weaknesses, is locked up long term, is clutch, can carry a team, and is just starting to become more of a vocal leader now that Toine is gone.

I dunno, maybe I'm a sucker, but I trust Danny in the direction he's taking the club. Maybe they'll get a coach who'll force Pierce in to the post, then run motion off of the double teams he'll draw. I mean, PP is a -thick- player, and should be able to out muscle just about every single SF on the block. Let Jiri give him the entry pass so as to avoid the same-side double, and run Ricky toward the hoop, Blount at the high block.

This offense could work so much more fluidly if they just drew up plays that revolved around Paul posting up.

Am I wrong?






You are right. Nice post.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Richie Rich</b>!








I'm not even going to argue. The mention of himn being traded shuldnt even be a mention.
Why not argue for your opinion then? I dont see why your so against the idea of trading him. Leading you to two years of so-so play makes him untradable?
 

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Originally posted by <b>adamatic</b>!
There's no reason to even entertain the thought of dealing Pierce. He's got diverse talents, few weaknesses, is locked up long term, is clutch, can carry a team, and is just starting to become more of a vocal leader now that Toine is gone.

I dunno, maybe I'm a sucker, but I trust Danny in the direction he's taking the club. Maybe they'll get a coach who'll force Pierce in to the post, then run motion off of the double teams he'll draw. I mean, PP is a -thick- player, and should be able to out muscle just about every single SF on the block. Let Jiri give him the entry pass so as to avoid the same-side double, and run Ricky toward the hoop, Blount at the high block.

This offense could work so much more fluidly if they just drew up plays that revolved around Paul posting up.

Am I wrong?
I do agree that you would be much better off with him playing in the post. But with that being said we've been saying that for a long time, and it doesnt look like hes going to change his game any time soon.
 

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Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!


I do agree that you would be much better off with him playing in the post. But with that being said we've been saying that for a long time, and it doesnt look like hes going to change his game any time soon.
Well, for what its worth, there was no way he was going to change his game under Obie. No question about that.

I'm optimistic though.

I'm also pretty optimistic about this team's ability to play defense, not this season, but in the next few years. Banks is an absolute ball hound. Wasn't he the WAC Defensive POY? Once he learns what he can and can't get away with as far as the officials go, he'll be a great on the ball defender. Davis too. Yeah, he needs to be more disciplined on the weak side, but that can be learned.
Pierce is solid. Jiri is a great on the ball defender, though still needs to feel out the refs. Hunter will be good, especially on the boards. Raef and Mihm should be adequate at the five spot. Still not sure about Perkins. And hopefully they'll use their mid level this offseason and go after a PJ Brown style PF - defense and boards. Swift, Thomas, Keon Clark come to mind.

Take that nucleus, add in some draft picks and a prime time FA when Vin's money comes off and BAM we are the Kings of the Eastern Conference. A running team, with good shooters, big men who can pass the rock, a deep front court, and good on the ball defenders. Sure, the Kings analogy is a big time stretch, but IMO that's what Danny eventually wants this team to be like.
 

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damn

Originally posted by <b>adamatic</b>!


Well, for what its worth, there was no way he was going to change his game under Obie. No question about that.

I'm optimistic though.

I'm also pretty optimistic about this team's ability to play defense, not this season, but in the next few years. Banks is an absolute ball hound. Wasn't he the WAC Defensive POY? Once he learns what he can and can't get away with as far as the officials go, he'll be a great on the ball defender. Davis too. Yeah, he needs to be more disciplined on the weak side, but that can be learned.
Pierce is solid. Jiri is a great on the ball defender, though still needs to feel out the refs. Hunter will be good, especially on the boards. Raef and Mihm should be adequate at the five spot. Still not sure about Perkins. And hopefully they'll use their mid level this offseason and go after a PJ Brown style PF - defense and boards. Swift, Thomas, Keon Clark come to mind.

Take that nucleus, add in some draft picks and a prime time FA when Vin's money comes off and BAM we are the Kings of the Eastern Conference. A running team, with good shooters, big men who can pass the rock, a deep front court, and good on the ball defenders. Sure, the Kings analogy is a big time stretch, but IMO that's what Danny eventually wants this team to be like.
And I thought Philly fans were bad...wat a joke
 

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As Big John said a while ago, Michael Redd and Toni Kucko (sp) for Paul Pierce is a pretty good deal. Michael Redd is a scorer and one of the best shooters in the NBA. He can handle the ball better the Pierce and he plays good defense. Toni has a big contract going off the books and we can get a nice player in FA for him. (Carlos Boozer)
 

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Originally posted by <b>Celts11</b>!
As Big John said a while ago, Michael Redd and Toni Kucko (sp) for Paul Pierce is a pretty good deal. Michael Redd is a scorer and one of the best shooters in the NBA. He can handle the ball better the Pierce and he plays good defense. Toni has a big contract going off the books and we can get a nice player in FA for him. (Carlos Boozer)
I'm not sure what the big deal is about Redd. He's a better shooter than Pierce, but that's about it. I wouldn't mind having Kukoc as a veteran leader, but I wouldn't want to give up Pierce for that.

People seem to forget how well Pierce has played before this year. He's been unstoppable at times. If he wanted to score, he could score. If not from the field, then from the line. People say it's because Walker was playing with him. That may be partially true, but after Walker left and all these trades happened, Pierce's style of play changed. In the past, if he drove to the basket, he would finish somehow. Now, he looks to pass more often than not. It's a good skill to have, but his aggressiveness has diminished. I think that has to do with the personnel surrounding him, and OB's coaching. Pierce was made the leader by default, but he's not a leader. That's not his fault. He's trying, but it's just not in him. The best player on the team doesn't necessarily have to be the leader. Eric Williams was better suited to that, but now he's gone. Pierce is not yet comfortable with his teammates. In the past, even if there were trades, there was still a core of 7 or 8 guys who remained intact. Now that Baker's gone, there are more former Cavs on the team than past Celtics.

But despite all the changes and poor coaching, a lot of Pierce's numbers are still going up. Who's to say that with a stable nucleus of players and a better coach that Pierce won't return to his old form? I don't think continually changing personnel and getting rid of the star player will help this team now or in the future. Pierce needs to adapt and work on a lot of things to fit in to the new philosophy, but he doesn't need to leave for the team to be successful. With the departure of OB, maybe he'll be more open to change.
 

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The two big deals about Redd are (1) even though he isn't as individually skilled as Pierce, he may fit better into an uptempo offense, and (2) he makes $3M per year in contrast to Pierce's $11M. That would give the Celtics another $8M to spend on someone else. Also Redd is signed at $3M for two more years while Pierce will be getting the maximum increases.

But don't worry, Pierce fans. Milwaukee might have done the Redd/Kukoc deal two months ago but they would never do it now. Redd is playing too well, and Kukoc gives them great cap flexibility just in time for the free agent signing period.
 

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Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
The two big deals about Redd are (1) even though he isn't as individually skilled as Pierce, he may fit better into an uptempo offense, and (2) he makes $3M per year in contrast to Pierce's $11M. That would give the Celtics another $8M to spend on someone else. Also Redd is signed at $3M for two more years while Pierce will be getting the maximum increases.

But don't worry, Pierce fans. Milwaukee might have done the Redd/Kukoc deal two months ago but they would never do it now. Redd is playing too well, and Kukoc gives them great cap flexibility just in time for the free agent signing period.






Sorry John, we are not Pierce fans, we are die hard fans and do not want to trade our franchise player for a non franchise caliber player. Get over it, we aren't winning anytime soon, Pierce will be here forever, and people advocating trading him and not building around him are out of their mind, right now we are struggling because our team is ridiculously out of wack, it's like a freak show, injuries, trades, alcoholism, coaching changes, and you wanna trade our star? Please.
 

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Yes, Pierce will probably be here forever. Ainge will never be able to trade him for what most Boston fans would perceive to be equal value.

The Magic (TMac), Sixers (Iverson) and Raptors (Carter) have the same problem. Along with the Celtics, these teams are dog and pony shows with only one dog. They will never win, because any good NBA coach can construct defenses to neutralize a single player.

But the fans idolize these players. "How could we possibly trade our franchise player!!" they scream, citing ppg averages and a whole bunch of statistics that mean nothing. Why is it surprising that Pierce averages 23 ppg? He has the ball on 80% of the Celtics possessions and usually takes 20+ shots a game.

Look at the Patriots. They have no single outstanding receiver or running back. Brady spreads the offense around-- if a guy is open, that's where he delivers the ball. Teams like that are very difficult to defend. It's no different in basketball. The Auerbach Celtics never had anyone close to the league lead in scoring. They just had 6 guys averaging in double figures. Plus a rebounder, of course, to get them the ball.
 
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