[BallBiologist]

Kenny Thomas has no clue what he's talking about. He doesn't even watch MAGIC GAMES.. He just probably reads stats and records.

He was getting on McGrady's back about how he shouldnt be a starter and how Baron Davis should've had his place instead.

He said that McGrady shouldn't be considered to have a good season because of the 19 game losing streak?? He was putting up the #'s doing all he could to help the team win the game but the team was just bad...

How does what team you are on affect if you should be an allstar or not?

 

[Johnny Mac]

Kenny Thomas plays for the 76ers.

I agree though, Tmac is better than Baron Davis. I've said this before, players dont win games, teams do. If Tmac draws a double team and kicks it to an open man 20 times a game, and the guy makes 5 shots, thats 10+ points. If the guy makes 15 shots, than 30+ points. That could easily be the difference in many many games. Tmac isnt doing anything different, its just his team is making the shots. Him being an all star shouldnt depend on whether his team makes shots.

 

[R-Star]

TMac doesnt deserve to start, or be mentioned in MVP talks. When you have a 19 game losing streak, it doesnt matter if you have a bad team around you. Theres plenty of teams out there as bad as the Magic who won games. Dont even try to tell me the Lakers squad minus Shaq, Malone and Kobe who won some games is even close to the Magic. He doesnt deserve to start, give it to Baron.

 

[ToddMacCulloch11]

Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
TMac doesnt deserve to start, or be mentioned in MVP talks. When you have a 19 game losing streak, it doesnt matter if you have a bad team around you. Theres plenty of teams out there as bad as the Magic who won games. Dont even try to tell me the Lakers squad minus Shaq, Malone and Kobe who won some games is even close to the Magic. He doesnt deserve to start, give it to Baron.

:yes:

 

[Johnny Mac]

If Duncan or KG played with a bunch of high school players, their team would lose by 30 every game. That makes them less of a player how?

 

[MLKG]

I don't really think Baron Davis deserves to start....

I don't have a problem with McGrady starting. You can't call a guy on a loosing team an MVP, but you can call him an all-star.

 

[jvanbusk]

Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
TMac doesnt deserve to start, or be mentioned in MVP talks. When you have a 19 game losing streak, it doesnt matter if you have a bad team around you. Theres plenty of teams out there as bad as the Magic who won games. Dont even try to tell me the Lakers squad minus Shaq, Malone and Kobe who won some games is even close to the Magic. He doesnt deserve to start, give it to Baron.

Agreed.

Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
If Duncan or KG played with a bunch of high school players, their team would lose by 30 every game. That makes them less of a player how?

How can you assume that? McGrady isn't even in their league this year. I wouldn't call the Magic players high schoolers either. Granted they suck and most of them shouldn't be in the league.

 

[Johnny Mac]

Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
How can you assume that? McGrady isn't even in their league this year. I wouldn't call the Magic players high schoolers either. Granted they suck and most of them shouldn't be in the league.

How can I assume that? Are you kidding with that?

The point of the analogy was, Your teams roster 2-12 shouldnt decide how good the guy whos #1 is.

If the exact same Tim Duncan of right now, was playing with a bunch of kindergardeners and ends up with the worst team in the league, then hes not as talented? Theres no logic in that. Hes the same player.

 

[chapi]

maybe the problem is that Duncan makes his Teammates better and T-Mac makes his stats better ??

 

[jvanbusk]

Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!


How can I assume that? Are you kidding with that?

The point of the analogy was, Your teams roster 2-12 shouldnt decide how good the guy whos #1 is.

If the exact same Tim Duncan of right now, was playing with a bunch of kindergardeners and ends up with the worst team in the league, then hes not as talented? Theres no logic in that. Hes the same player.

Bad analogy then.

McGrady is not playing with high schoolers. He's playing with professional athletes. There's some talent on that team, not much, but some.

McGrady isn't as good, because the team has absolutely no success. Whereas if you put any of the other top 5-10 players on that team, I think they'd have much more success. Of course that's speculation, but I think it's fair to say.

 

[Johnny Mac]

If anyone thinks the Magic would have won anymore with Baron Davis, they deserve to be knocked out. There is no GUARD in the league that could have done any better than Tmac in the same situation.

Give me any legitimate reason why that wouldnt be the case.

 

[chapi]

from all the guards only 2 would have better succes with the magic and thats Iverson and Kidd. but i think this team with KOBE/PIERCE/LEBRON would have done exaxtly the same, as their now...

 

[Sánchez AF]

well..

maybe the problem is that Duncan makes his Teammates better and T-Mac makes his stats better ??

:yes: Duncan makes better his teammates and t-mac only think in shoot shoot and shoot again t-mac use 30 - 35 shoot p/game that's why he scores 30 ppg every night and Duncan use 10-20 some nights 25 but with less shots he scores 25 or 28 and 15 rebounds and t.mac don't do that

 

[Minstrel]

Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!

McGrady isn't as good, because the team has absolutely no success.

The team has "had" plenty of success. This is the first season with McGrady, I believe, that they wouldn't be making the playoffs. They certainly made it the past two years.

So, it has nothing to do with McGrady...something else is throwing this team off. If it were McGrady, they wouldn't have had success the last two years.

Whereas if you put any of the other top 5-10 players on that team, I think they'd have much more success. Of course that's speculation, but I think it's fair to say.

Just as fair to say as if you put Duncan on the team in place of McGrady, the Magic would be even worse. Total speculation has no real validity. Fun to say out loud, but pretty worthless except to express what you would like to see happen. Not what would happen.

McGrady has been far superior to Baron Davis as a player. There's no way Davis ought to be starting.

 

[R-Star]

Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
If anyone thinks the Magic would have won anymore with Baron Davis, they deserve to be knocked out. There is no GUARD in the league that could have done any better than Tmac in the same situation.

Give me any legitimate reason why that wouldnt be the case.

Please dont ever tell me I need to be knocked out John the Delerious Kid. I fint it funny that you refuse to answer what I said about the injured Lakers squad. Is a Lakers squad without Malone, Shaq or Kobe better than the Magic?

 

[Minstrel]

Originally posted by <b>chapi</b>!
from all the guards only 2 would have better succes with the magic and thats Iverson and Kidd.

Kidd would have had much less success than McGrady. Kidd needs talent to pass to, he can't take over a game himself.

McGrady has been playmaking all season and his teammates have missed easy shots and even layups. If that's all McGrady could do, the Magic might not have any wins.

Fortunately for them, he can also carry them with his scoring and all-around game, which he's done, which is the only reason they have even the wins they have.

 

[Naliamegod]

Re: well..

Originally posted by <b>Carter182</b>!


:yes: Duncan makes better his teammates and t-mac only think in shoot shoot and shoot again t-mac use 30 - 35 shoot p/game that's why he scores 30 ppg every night and Duncan use 10-20 some nights 25 but with less shots he scores 25 or 28 and 15 rebounds and t.mac don't do that

It isn't like T-mac has much CHOICE when it comes to shooting. Atleast Duncan has some guys who can shoot wide open.

 

[Johnny Mac]

Nobody is saying Tmac is as good as Duncan either. If it came down to Duncan vs. Tmac, its a no brainer. My analogy was simply to prove that team success should not decide how good one single player is.

There is not a guard in the league who could have done better than Tmac has, with the same team. Thats what were talking about right, who should have started as an eastern guard over Tmac? NOBODY.

 

[Johnny Mac]

Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
Please dont ever tell me I need to be knocked out John the Delerious Kid. I fint it funny that you refuse to answer what I said about the injured Lakers squad. Is a Lakers squad without Malone, Shaq or Kobe better than the Magic?

I watch every Laker game on FSN and KCAL. Slava, George and Rush are better than any player on the Magic beyond Tmac.

They only won two games without Kobe/Malone/Shaq

Not to mention you completely overlooked the aspect of coaching.

 

[jvanbusk]

Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!


The team has "had" plenty of success. This is the first season with McGrady, I believe, that they wouldn't be making the playoffs. They certainly made it the past two years.

So, it has nothing to do with McGrady...something else is throwing this team off. If it were McGrady, they wouldn't have had success the last two years.

I was speaking of this year. Why does this have nothing to do with McGrady? From watching Magic games, it has alot to do with McGrady. During the beginning of the season he lacked a killer instinct in the 4th quarter. I'm not arguing that the talent around him isn't pathetic, because they are, but that doesn't give McGrady a free ride to be one of the top players in the league.

Just as fair to say as if you put Duncan on the team in place of McGrady, the Magic would be even worse. Total speculation has no real validity. Fun to say out loud, but pretty worthless except to express what you would like to see happen. Not what would happen.

McGrady has been far superior to Baron Davis as a player. There's no way Davis ought to be starting.

Fair enough, although I do believe Duncan would dominate the Eastern Conference, due to the lack of size. But it goes both ways just as you can't say that the team would <b>definately</b> be better, like I pointed out originally, you can't say that they would be the same or worse with other top players like the original poster claimed.

I don't see how it's fair to say that McGrady has been <b>far</b> superior to Davis. Davis is putting up great numbers on a winning team. Unless of course, you buy into stats meaning everything in which case Ricky Davis (who now doesn't even start for the Celtics, a losing team) would have been one of the best players in the league last year.