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Say Cheese
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Discussion Starter #1
from espn.com:
Call it a statistical quirk, a mildly interesting coincidence or something even less important than that. But for the 17th consecutive NCAA Tournament, this fact remains inviolate:

In odd-numbered years, all four No. 1 seeds advance to the Sweet Sixteen. In even-numbered years, a No.1 goes down early.

(Those who picked Pitt/Pacific to knock off Washington in the second round probably wish we'd mentioned this last week and spared your bracket the damage. Sorry.)

This being 2005, they're all in. Illinois, Washington, Duke and North Carolina will now attempt to make history by all advancing to the Final Four.

There are statistical absolutes at either end of the tournament. No No. 1 seed has ever lost in the first round, but four No. 1s have never won four games apiece.

If it happens this year, we could have the best of times in St. Louis.

A Duke-Carolina Final Four game? Somebody sedate Billy Packer. Even taking (some) of the overarching rivalry hysteria out of that potential matchup, it would be one heck of a 2005 rubber match, after the first two games this season went down to the wire.

Washington-Illinois could be a potential classic, as well, with six fast and fearless perimeter players going at each other. Between Dee Brown and Nate Robinson, there would be plenty of short-man gusto on the court. And it would be a great validating moment for Bruce Weber and Lorenzo Romar, two coaches who have admirably handled their first seasons as true national curiosities.

But you know it's not going to happen. It never does.

So instead of blue-skying about a dream scenario in St. Louis, let's look at this from the pessimist's perspective.

Here are the worst things that could happen to the tournament from this point on:

1) Wisconsin wins it all
Offensive basketball is set back four decades. Bo Ryan becomes an even bigger know-it-all. And those uniforms, with the numbers visible from Mars and no names on the back ...

Wasn't there a resolution passed in 2000, after Dick Bennett's squad scored 41 points in a national semifinal, prohibiting the Badgers' return to the Final Four? Even with a different coach, Wisconsin is still hard to watch, having scored more than 64 points just once in its last nine games.

Enjoying the Wisconsin-North Carolina State game Friday will be a chore. First team to 50 might win that one in a catatonic Carrier Dome. And if the Badgers do win, it could derail a possible North Carolina-N.C. State regional final, which would be fun simply for all the pressure heaped on the Tar Heels.


2) Duke-Kentucky III is pre-empted by Utah-Michigan State
Everyone remembers the two regional final classics of the 1990s – the Christian Laettner shot in 1992 and the less-heralded Kentucky comeback in '98. What people don't remember are the other times post-Laettner that the selection committee unsuccessfully tried to pit the Blue Devils and Wildcats.

In 1994, Duke was a No. 2 seed and Kentucky a No. 3, but the Wildcats were stunned in the second round by Marquette. In 2001, the committee outdid itself, pointing the two toward a regional final in Philadelphia (site of the '92 game), but USC upset Kentucky in the Sweet 16.
Whole Article

This article just feeds into my point of an ESPN bias towards the Big 10, and other parts of the country besides ACC country in general, looking for the better ACC matchup in NC State vs. UNC:

"And if the Badgers do win, it could derail a possible North Carolina-N.C. State regional final, which would be fun simply for all the pressure heaped on the Tar Heels."

Wow, what a travesty should the Badgers win. I am sure people will be up in arms in Wisconsin wins, because there will be "less pressure" on UNC if the higher seed advances....ok?

On hoping Michigan State and Utah not advancing:

It would be another swell matchup this time around. Failing that, CBS would take either of the two as regional-final consolation prizes. It likely would be less pleased by Utes-Spartans.

Utah does have Andrew Bogut as a drawing card, and Michigan State does have Tom Izzo. But Ray Giacoletti could spend all day on a street corner in Austin without being recognized as the coach of the Utes, and the Spartans' players have an odd dearth of charisma.


Since when should the NCAA tournament go by what matchup would have the higher ratings? That is the anti-NCAA tourney mantra. I hope Utah and Michigan State both advance just to piss this guy off.
 

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I agree with you, except that I think he's right so I guess I don't agree with you.

Wisconsin and Michigan State are very boring teams. I'm not saying they aren't good or aren't worthy, but they are blah. Julius Hodge has been a big name in college basketball for two or three years now, and after reading his quotables in that other thread, how could you possibly root against him?
 

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Say Cheese
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Discussion Starter #3
TheATLien said:
I agree with you, except that I think he's right so I guess I don't agree with you.

Wisconsin and Michigan State are very boring teams. I'm not saying they aren't good or aren't worthy, but they are blah. Julius Hodge has been a big name in college basketball for two or three years now, and after reading his quotables in that other thread, how could you possibly root against him?
LOL...good point on Julius Hodge...he became one of my favorite players ever after reading that artice....
I just think this guy's reasons to root against teams are way off-base, and is another indicator of an ESPN bias against anything not ACC. He doesn't like Wisconsin because they don't have names on the back of their jerseys? Please. Also, Michigan State is a very exciting team, Shannon Brown is one of the most exciting players in the game, imo.....
 

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I want to see Utah - MSU

And UNC vs. an instate rival is more exciting than UNC vs. Wisconsin, although I will be happy with UNC vs. anyone, because that means we win Friday. Big rivalry, in an elite 8 game? I think most people would rather see that. I think the guy is right, in that a Kentucky - Duke game has much more history, tradition, and appeal to most people. I don't like ESPN, but I think you are just reaching for things to fuel your holy-war against them.
 

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Say Cheese
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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
JuniorNoboa said:
As HG said, you are really reaching right now.
I guess it is reaching a bit...... :biggrin: I am just mad at the coverage of this tournament. UW-Milwaukee still hasn't seen any noterity, they haven't even been praised much for their efforts, and Wisconsin is just being completley overlooked right now by ESPN....it is just a disgrace IMO for the "World's Sports Leader" to turn a blind eye during the biggest stage in NCAA basketball. UW-Milwaukee and Wisconsin have both overacheived greatly this year, they both have great stories to tell, and if they lose this round, they will have gotten almost no publicity for their efforts.

ESPN is too busy prasing Vermont's effort to give UWM any recognition. The only time they even mention them is when they talk about how bad they are going to lose to Illinios.
 

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Nobody wants to hear about Wisconsin. Milwaukee, Madison. Don't matter, no one cares. No offense, it's just how it is in the public eye.
 

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Say Cheese
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Discussion Starter #8
TheATLien said:
Nobody wants to hear about Wisconsin. Milwaukee, Madison. Don't matter, no one cares. No offense, it's just how it is in the public eye.
I agree, those teams aren't going to get the big ratings, but if ESPN is the self-proclaimed "World Leader in Sports", I expect them to show almost everything when it comes to the NCAA tournament. Hell, we know every detail that comes out of the Super Bowl. I know that UWM or Wisconsin isn't the most popular team around, but this is the sweet 16, there are 4 days in between games to report, and I have heard almost nothing on ESPN about either team.
 

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What great story does Wisconsin. They are just a 6 seed that has been on the sweet 16 stage quite frequently, and has been in a final four recently. It's rather Blah to me (it would be like Syracuse being in the sweet 16 - what story is there?) Same with Michigan St, there story is blah.

As for WM they deserve some attention - and I have heard Pearl on Rome, ESPN Radio, so I think they are getting attention.

Now West Virginia is a story. They are from a big conference, but they are never on this stage.
 

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Say Cheese
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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
JuniorNoboa said:
What great story does Wisconsin. They are just a 6 seed that has been on the sweet 16 stage quite frequently, and has been in a final four recently. It's rather Blah to me (it would be like Syracuse being in the sweet 16 - what story is there?) Same with Michigan St, there story is blah.
Wisconsin has storylines...How about losing the reigning Big Ten Player of The Year and possible NPOY in Devin Harris...not alot of people thought they would be a top 16 team without Harris. Also, Shariff Chambliss is a feel good story, through the injuries he has battled through, and through his process to become a Badger....I think that they could give us a little something, anything....instead they just bash us and call us boring!!!

Michigan State is an above average, exciting team that should be in the sweet 16, and if they beat Duke, I think that whoever they play, it would be a good game, so I don't see why as Big 10 fans we should apologize if they advance. Rememer the UK-MSU game @ Ford Field? I don't know of anyone who would object to another game like that.
 

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Who cares.. Wisconsin is boring.. Michigan State is boring.. Illinois is boring.. The whole damn Midwest is boring..

Highly unlikely I know but would this season have ended boring if somehow Wisconsin won the National Title? Would love to see ESPN try to promote this baby and give em credit..
 

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I've often found that boring teams create more exciting games.
While Loyola Marymount scored on average 122 points in 1990, the UNLV / Ball State game was a much better game of basketball than the Las Vegas / Marymount game. Why? Cause there was a chance at the end.

Butler plays 'boring' basketball. But I love watching them play.
And yes, Duke and Kentucky has more history. But I think that whoever wins will be the better teams and the better games.

Oh? And the best stories of the tournament always come with the smaller teams. And, while casual basketball fans are less likely to tune in to a game that has Utah and Michigan State than Duke Kentucky--they're more likely to become involved in the game because neutral parties can pick a side and not feel dirty about it.
 

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Winconsin winning it all would be about the most boring thing that could ever happen.
 

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Fortunately this is all a moot point, no team from Wiscy will win the title. I think they are the 2 weakest teams left in the tournament. I mean I never say never, but its pretty close.
 

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So i guess nc state is shown no love. Sorry guys but hodge will not allow a loss. I agree about what u said about the article. I do live in big 10 country though lol.
 

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No JN and Heinz. DHarrisPhan isn't reaching, how would you guys like it if a senior writer at ESPN named Pat 'I'm a ******' Forde said it would be a joke if your team made it to the final four. He isn't reaching by any means, if anything he's (DHarrisPhan) being cool about it. I'm so sick of people like this and ******s like Roy Williams, yes Roy Williams stated Wisconsin's style of basketball "isn't basketball" back when Dick Bennett was the coach of the final four team in 2000. I'm sorry Roy, I guess we should recuirt players that run up and down the floor and never play defense. I feel so bad for upsetting the legend who's never won a national ****ing championship.
 
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TheATLien said:
Nobody wants to hear about Wisconsin. Milwaukee, Madison. Don't matter, no one cares. No offense, it's just how it is in the public eye.

Nobody wants to hear about the Atlanta Hawks either...
 

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HogsFan1188 said:
Winconsin winning it all would be about the most boring thing that could ever happen.

You know what wasn't boring? Wisconsin 65 - NCSU 56

:clap:
 
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