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Discussion Starter #1
im not a huge cavs fan so i dont know their roster.. but heres my guess
Wagner
Miles
Ricky Davis
Boozer
Diop
--
Ill give them 17 wins... and a really good chance of gettin lebron
chris mihm is a bust!!! langdon is goin back to alaska.. trepaigner is nbdl at best..
lookin at that lineup...
Wagner will get 20 a game
miles ( the only!!! hs guy to average less his second year then first) will average 12 at best.. he has no j..
ricky will average 15
boozer might have 8 or 10
and diop 10 - 12
OUCH.. If i was john Lucas id start drinking now
 

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C - Z
PF - Carlos Boozer Jr
SF - Miles
SG - Davis
PG - Wagner
 

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Fellas!

Carlos Boozer MIGHT end up being a steal for a second-rounder, but THE DUDE WAS A SECOND-ROUNDER, he probably won't even touch the FLOOR for this team! And DaSagana Diop is still LIGHT YEARS AWAY from being able to contribute for even the WORST team in the LEAGUE (I'm talking about the Cavs here, of course, now that Andre Miller has been shipped off)--the team is pretty much OBLIGATED to give him a LITTLE PT, but he's too raw to get more than 10 minutes/game!

The starting lineup looks like this:

PG Dajuan Wagner (32 min/game)
SG Ricky Davis (32 min/game)
SF Lamond Murray (14 min/game at SF, 16 min/game at SG)
PF Darius Miles (20 min/game at PF, 12 min/game at SF)
C Zydrunas Ilgauskus (24 min/game)

Key reserves:

Jumaine Jones (22 min/game at SF)
Chris Mihm (14 min/game at C, 8 min/game at PF)
Tyrone Hill (20 min/game at PF)
Bimbo Coles (16 min/game at PG)
DaSagana Diop (10 min/game at C)

End of the bench:

Carlos Boozer
Harold Jamison
Nick Anderson

I'm sure the team would like to replace Lamond Murray with Jumaine Jones in the starting lineup, but they have Murray signed for FOUR MORE YEARS--they need to play him at LEAST 30 minutes/game and PROBABLY MORE if they want him to pad his stats, THEN he can get dumped on somebody (ANYBODY!)--THEN Jumaine Jones can get the starting SF job and way more minutes!

SERIOUSLY, this team needs to do everything it can to find a taker for Murray--they're stuck with Ilgauskus, but Murray has a pretty reasonable contract, SOMEBODY will give them some bum (or bums) with just one year left on his (or their) contract(s) for him! Possibilities include:

1) to the Lakers for Tracy Murray
2) to the Spurs for Antonio Daniels and Amal McCaskill
3) to the Hornets for Stacey Augmon and Jerome Moiso
4) to the Pistons for Mikki Moore and Brian Cardinal

REGARDLESS--this Cavs team SUUUUUUCKS! 17-65 sounds about right!
 

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Another trade possibility with the Spurs...

How about this one:

Lamond Murray, Tyrone Hill, and Nick Anderson to the Spurs; Steve Smith, Antonio Daniels, Cherokee Parks, Stephen Jackson, and Amal McCaskill to the Cavs

Seven of the eight players involved in this deal will be free agents after next season--Murray's contract is the only contract that lasts for more than one year.

Murray would be an upgrade over Steve Smith at SG, Tyrone Hill (if healthy) gives the Spurs yet another nice veteran inside presence, while Anderson will sit at the end of the bench in what will be his last season in the league. Here's the Spurs after this deal!

Spurs Starting lineup:

PG Tony Parker (32 minutes/game)
SG Lamond Murray (30 minutes/game)
SF Bruce Bowen (24 minutes/game)
PF Tim Duncan (20 minutes/game at PF, 16 minutes/game at C)
C David Robinson (32 minutes/game)

Key reserves:

Malik Rose (16 minutes/game at PF, 12 minutes/game at SF)
Speedy Claxton (16 minutes/game at PG)
Emmanuel Ginobili (18 minutes/game at SG)
Tyrone Hill (12 minutes/game at PF)
Danny Ferry (12 minutes/game at SF)

End of the bench:

Nick Anderson

The Cavs would be in slightly better shape, too, since they were pretty short on backcourt depth before the deal, PLUS now they can give more minutes to Jumaine Jones and Chris Mihm AND give some minutes to Carlos Boozer (if you're going to SUCK, you may as well develop yr young guys, see what they're made of!).

Cavs starting lineup:

PG Dajuan Wagner (32 min/game)
SG Ricky Davis (32 min/game)
SF Jumaine Jones (32 min/game)
PF Darius Miles (16 min/game at PF, 16 min/game at SF)
C Zydrunas Ilgauskus (24 min/game)

Key reserves:

Chris Mihm (16 min/game at PF, 12 min/game at C)
Antonio Daniels (16 min/game at PG)
Steve Smith (16 min/game at SG)
Carlos Boozer (16 min/game at PF)
DaSagana Diop (12 min/game at C)

End of the bench:

Bimbo Coles
Harold Jamison
Cherokee Parks
Amal McCaskill
Stephen Jackson

When you take away Lamond Murray, you're certainly saving some money, but you're getting even WORSE--from 17-65 to about 15-67!
 

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Quit putting Darius in pf all the time. Hes a sf/sg who can play pf if he needs too but doesnt have the strength to hold it down as the starting role. Look for him to average around 18 next season too, since he will be the go to guy. Dude's stocks going to go through the roof.
 

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If the Cavs start DMiles then he will be there best or second best player (next to wagner) and R-Star is right, he is not a PF!
 

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My 2 cents..

PG - Wagner
SG - Davis
SF - Miles
PF - Boozer
C - Illgauskas

6th man - Lamond Murray (he'll probably get a lot starts too)
7th man - Tyrone Hill (probably be a starter at beginning of season)
8th man - DeSegana Diop (develop him!)
9th man - Jumaine Jones (will get a couple starts)
10th man - Chris Mihm (can pay PF or C)
11th man - Bimbo Coles (Juanny's only back-up at PG)
12th man - Nick Anderson

IR 1 - Matt Barnes (back and forth with Anderson)
IR 2 - Harold Jamison (who knows? he is a PF and that can only help him on this team)
IR 3 - Theo Dixon (I think they'll sign him)
 

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Cavs line-up

PG - Wagner(not a pg, but he is short so oh well)
SG - R Davis (averages won't go up much because wags can't distribute like miller)
SF - Miles (Murray is on his way out)
PF - Hill (if not traded that is...he will play hard because he needs a contract next year; has been working out all summer with Z)
C - Ilgauskas (If he doesn't break a foot)

Around midseason, Boozer will probably take over the starting PF job because the cavs want to get him minutes and experience since next year he is probably the starter by default. If Hill is traded before the season starts, Boozer is the cavs lone true power forward, Jones just doesn't cut it there, he is too small. Also look for Diop to see MUCH more action than last year since he has gotten himself into good shape and will not be injured as much. I sure as hell hope the cavs don't do the murray-hill-mihm trade with SA, because then I am not so sure we win a game all season, because Miles cannot play PF, he is too skinny. With wagner, davis, and miles all looking to make the highlight reel, i wouldn't be surprised if we see one of them tackle another to get the ball sometime during this upcoming season.

This cavs team will SUCK, and this is coming from a true cavs fan(one of the last on the planet i think, we should be put on the endangered species list).

I would also like to add that i did not like this recent trade of miller, because i thought a lineup with miller and davis starting with wagner backing up both of them would be a pretty good team in the near future(with davis eventually moving to SF and wagner starting at guard). I don't really see Miles being that great because it seems to me all he can do is dunk, at least that's all I've ever seen him do. He is yet another playing just looking to get onto sportscenter. Even if Miller left after this year, at least wagner would've had him here for a year to teach him a thing or two about being a true point guard in the nba. I really hope the cavs do land LeBron, because if they don't, their whole "plan" would be screwed, or so it seems.
 

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Oh and i forgot

17-65 might be pushing it guys, i don't know that this team wins more that 12-15 games, especially if Z goes down to injury again.
 

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Originally posted by R-Star
Quit putting Darius in pf all the time. Hes a sf/sg who can play pf if he needs too but doesnt have the strength to hold it down as the starting role. Look for him to average around 18 next season too, since he will be the go to guy. Dude's stocks going to go through the roof.
Darius Miles CANNOT play shooting guard, PERIOD!

Everything I've read seems to point to the Cavs moving him to power forward. If all you can do is dunk and block shots--like Miles--then you're much better off at PF than at SF. Miles doesn't have a jump shot, he really doesn't need to ever stray more than about 10 feet from the basket in order to be effective--so why play him at SF (or SG!)? AND, keep in mind that this is the Eastern Conference--he'll be fine at PF over there.

And FELLAS! Carlos Boozer is presently this team's ninth man AT BEST! He's not going to start over either Tyrone Hill or Jumaine Jones (or DARIUS MILES)! Jones played PF all last season--sure, he was undersized, whatever, but he still played there! Boozer is presently looking at about ZERO MINUTES/GAME playing behind Miles, Hill, Jones, and Mihm (who should also play some PF)!

By the way, as The Bowski correctly pointed out, Dajuan Wagner isn't going to be a good distributor next season. In FACT, while he will certainly make a lot of Sportscenter highlight reels (like Miles), he is FOR SURE the WORST "distributor" in the league among ALL STARTING POINT GUARDS. Philly learned that Iverson couldn't play PG, Cleveland will learn the same next season.

In other words, Dajuan Wagner is going to take a LOT of shots, a LOT of BAD shots, he's not going to "make his teammates better." And yes, Darius Miles is really athletic, he has a lot of "upside"--but he is NOT going to average 18 points a game next season! NOT GOING TO HAPPEN! Here are Miles' stats from last season:

27.2 minutes/game
48.1 FG%
15.8 3Pt%
62.0 FT%
9.5 points/game
5.5 rebounds/game
2.2 assists/game
2.0 turnovers/game
0.9 steals/game
1.3 blocks/game

As you can see, the dude has NO RANGE (in case you didn't already know), but he is a fantastic dunker and shot-blocker. What NEEDS to happen is this: he needs to beef up, get stronger, put on about 15 pounds this offseason. His future is at power forward in the Eastern Conference--he was too small for that position in the West (PLUS he played on the same team as Elton Brand, obviously)--PLUS the Cavs really need an inside presence. ALSO, I don't understand how he's going to suddenly go from 9.5 points/game to 18 points/game--that's a pretty big leap there! Don't forget that Dajuan Wagner isn't the ONLY Cav who will be jacking up a ton of shots--if the team re-signs Ricky Davis and plays him 30+ minutes/game, THAT dude will be jacking up a ton of shots, too! I think Miles should average about 13-14 points/game next season, mostly on dunks and putbacks.
 

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Cavs Lineup...

<img src="http://media.nba.com/media/cavs/insideheader2.jpg">

C-Zydrunas Ilguaskus 12.9ppg 6.3rpg 1.57bpg
PF-Tyrone Hill 8.2ppg 10.8rpg
SF-Darius Miles 16.3ppg 7.1rpg 1.12spg 1.63bpg
SG-Dajuan Wagner 21.3ppg 3.7apg
PG-Rafer Alston 10.3ppg 8.7apg 1.71spg
 

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Boozer will play

Roby, Boozer is most likely the cavs' backup pf. John Lucas hates Mihm, and loves Boozer, so who do you think will get the minutes. As i stated in my previous post, Boozer will probably get the starting job by midseason; not because of talent, but because they want to get him time. By then, Ilgauskas should be hurt, and Mihm and Diop will be splitting minutes at center, and the cavs will not be worried about getting into the playoffs, so they will just play the young guys. Oh, and if you are wondering about lamond murray, he will be traded before the season starts, so Jones is our backup sf and won't see much time at pf this season. Miles is a SMALL FORWARD, and will play there, he is too damn skinny to bang down low. If he and jones are on the floor at the same time, he may guard the power forward, but it shouldn't be for too long.
 

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RobyG

Thats funny Robby, because he started a few times at shooting guard last year and played the 2 just as much or more than he played the 4. Care to respond or just agree that your wrong?
 

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Oh, and about Miles Roby if you can't understand why he will go from 9 to 18 its this easy. Number 1 he will have around 10 more minutes a game, at the least. Number 2, hes gone from the 4th or 5th option on a team to the 1st or second option, that will mean hes taking way more shots, thus giving him more points.
 

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PG Wagner
SG Davis
SF Miles
PF Hill
C Zilgauskas

16 wins.

I could see Miles playing PF if they don't trade Murray. But if they do trade Murray for McDaniels or some other PG this will be a team which was among the tops in 3pt % last year, going to having absolutely no weapons from beyond the arc. Wagner doesn't shoot particularly well from out there, though he's not shy about trying. Davis didn't do much from outside either. They'll be stuck with Jumaine Jones popping most of their 3 pointers? Ugh.

That's why I could see them signing Lubos Barton. He shot well from out there in the summer league

Wagner - 11.0 ppg, 29 mpg
Davis - 13.5 ppg, 31 mpg
Miles - 14.5 ppg, 32 mpg
Hill - 8.0 ppg, 28 mpg
Z - 12.0 ppg, 28 mpg

6 Daniels
7 Jones
8/9 Boozer/Mihms
10 Diop
11 Coles
12 Anderson/Barnes

IR - Barnes/Anderson
IR - Jamison
IR - Barton

Expect Daniels and Coles to get lots of minutes at PG to allow Daddy Wags to play at 2. Davis can play some 3 and Miles can play at 4 a bit if necessary. If Ilgauskas plays the whole year and plays SIGNIFICANT minutes and if Miles has a McGrady-esque 3rd year, you could be looking at 20-30 wins. If/when Diop/Ilgauskas go down, then, once again, they'll be screwed. They will be looking at Chris Mihms playing a LOT of center and no one wants to see that.

Mihms and Boozer will be an interesting battle. Anyone know what Mihms has been doing in the offseason? He's a bust right now but if he's dead set against playing a true PF game then he'd have to develop an outside jumper that opposing players would need to respect (i.e. beyond 15-16 feet). Then he might be worth some decent minutes. My guess he will be the first guy to spell Hill but with Chris you can usually tell what kind of game he has on a given night in the first few minutes. If he's not up to par, then sit his white arse down and give those minutes to Boozer.
 

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Originally posted by Matches10

Wagner - 11.0 ppg, 29 mpg
Davis - 13.5 ppg, 31 mpg
Miles - 14.5 ppg, 32 mpg
Hill - 8.0 ppg, 28 mpg
Z - 12.0 ppg, 28 mpg
59 PPG for the whole starting line-up??? What will the bench average? Shaq and Kobe will definitely get that, Pierce and Walker will probably average that, and Jordan and Hamilton could be close (if both stay healty).
 

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I guess you're right about the averages.. They are a little low but I'm envisioning a lot of up-and-down nights. Wagner will definitely have his 20 point nights here and there.. Same with Miles and Davis, but there will be many night where many of them are cold.

But they're low-end expectations.. If I'm allowed to be optimisic:

Wagner: 13 ppg
Davis: 17 ppg
Miles: 17 ppg
Hill : 9 ppg
Z: 15 ppg

There's 71 points from the starters. I'd expect about 9 a night from Jones, 7 from Mihms and 6 from Boozer off the bench. < 5 from Diop, Coles, and the rest.

But there will be plenty of nights where Wagner scores 4.

If they don't trade Murray then it will be very interesting. You can't not start him, especially since he's their only 3-point threat. You probably would see a lot of Miles at the 4. A lot of good scorers out there then but not much in the way of defense and a lot of pressure on Miles to rebound against the larger PFs in the league.
 

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PG: Wagner
SG: Davis
SF: Miles or Murray
PF: Boozer? Hill?
C: Ilgauskas or Diop, hell maybe even Mihm
 
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