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Hmm? Prediction isn't a human's strong suit, but this topic to me is interesting. I think when Kobe retires, he will be ranked among the top20-25 to EVER play this game, as the second best SG behind Air. So really a rephrasal would be, will LeBron rank among the top20 when its all said and done? If one were to say yes, then what would be required for that ranking?
 

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Its really hard to say, at this point I would have to say "NO" just because what Kobe has accomplished so far. Lebron though is just shining bright with promise...not potential but promise. At this stage of his young career Lebron has all the offensive tools and excells in making other people better. Statistically speaking, Lebron is already better than Kobe.

And obviously Lebron can only get better, If Kobe ends his career without winning a ring after the Shaq/Kobe Aftermath and Lebron wins championships without having a legit Superstar in his side then I would have to say YES, Lebron may pass Kobe as the best swingman next to MJ. Keep in mind that most of Kobe's accomplishments are offensive productions. If healthy, Lebron can easily overtake what Kobe has accomplished offensively with the exception of maybe the 81 pt outburst.

This is like a flashback of the great "whose better Larry Bird or Magic Johnson?" debate in the 80's.
 

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Keep in mind that most of Kobe's accomplishments are offensive productions.
Not true, he has a few scattered defensive teams to his resume as well, and he has a few notable defensive performances against certain great offensive players in this league. A few years back when he had more quickness he held Allen Iverson to no buckets in the second half of a game where he had 28 in the first, the comeback against the Magic when Tracy McGrady was going off with 30+ in the three quarters, and the sonning of Vince Carter earlier this season. Defensive plays? Blocks against Michael Redd, steals against the Rockets (Yao/Francis), the one play last year where he sprinted back against the Nugz to block an Andre Miller layup [granted it was his turnover that caused the fastbreak]. In regards to plays and times like these which demonstrate pure defensive skill and willpower, LeBron isn't as gifted on that side of that ball, although he does have tremendous anticipation for what the other team is trying to do in terms of shooting the lanes for steals.

Moving on to more general terms, one thing that gets left out, when talking about these two players is the difference of generations that they represent. Although Kobe didn't really come into his own until about 2000, about 4 years before LeBron, he still came into the league 7 years before him making him a mid-90s draftee. Maybe thats why the Tracy comparisons were so rabid/rampant. In totality though, he has nearly 600 [586 to be exact] games in NBA wear and tear on LeBron. As well conditioned as Kobe is, all that running, all that leaping, all that stress in the lane has an impact right through to an athlete's bones. Which serves to make it unfair to compare them, just as one wouldn't compare a mid90s Karl Malone to a freshly minted Tim Duncan.

Therefore I contend that they are from different eras, and personally thats why I feel more comfortable in comparing James to his draft counterparts in Wade and Carmelo. LeBron is newschool, and Kobe is more rugged in terms of NBA background. Kobe has been in the league a decade now, has recently reached his prime as a player, and really only has about five, six years at the most before he goes supernova. They really are at different points in their games. So to make the points equal, fastforward seven in the future to when James has been in the league for a decade. What will happen is not known, but its extremely doubtful that LeBron will end up being as accomplished as Kobe is now overall. But he has a chance to match him, for seven years from now is a long time indeed.
 

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sherako said:
Not true, he has a few scattered defensive teams to his resume as well, and he has a few notable defensive performances against certain great offensive players in this league.
I did say most, I never mentioned that he does not have any defensive acclamation. If he is to retire now and 10 years from now when people talk about Kobe the first thing that would come out of their mind is? "Scoring"...62 pts in 3 quraters outscoring the whole Maverics team, 9 consecutive 40 plus pts game, 35 ppg in a season, 81 pts in a single game you know "stuff of legend" as they may say, surely sportswriters will write how effective and dangerous Kobe was offensively during his time...that and he played defense too...see the point?.

Sure he is a great defensive player as history tells us, but his offensive barrage easily overcomes what he did defensively.



sherako said:
A few years back when he had more quickness he held Allen Iverson to no buckets in the second half of a game where he had 28 in the first, the comeback against the Magic when Tracy McGrady was going off with 30+ in the three quarters, and the sonning of Vince Carter earlier this season. Defensive plays? Blocks against Michael Redd, steals against the Rockets (Yao/Francis), the one play last year where he sprinted back against the Nugz to block an Andre Miller layup [granted it was his turnover that caused the fastbreak]. In regards to plays and times like these which demonstrate pure defensive skill and willpower, LeBron isn't as gifted on that side of that ball, although he does have tremendous anticipation for what the other team is trying to do in terms of shooting the lanes for steals.
Those are single games where Kobe stands out and demonstrate his defensive prowess, NO offense but if you ask any basketball fan, besides Laker/Kobe fans, I would bet that with the exception of the Kobe blocking Michael Redds shot last season or Kobe running down to block Andre Miller's shot eventhough we were ahead by many points in that game , most would have a hard time recollecting it any of his defensive plays.

I dont buy it when people say "Lebron is not gifted on the other end of the court" Lebron is athletically gifted, he has the capacity to improve as a defensive player, it does takes time for some players. Certain players will use weakness and build on it and becomes their strength. How would they respond to it is another question, and only Lebron can answer.

sherako said:
LeBron is newschool, and Kobe is more rugged in terms of NBA background..
Funny thing is Lebron plays more of an old school approach in the game playing team basketball, while Kobe asserts himself into the New School standard dominating mostly on scoring.
 

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I don't like when people say Lebron is greatly gifted on offense. I dont know if people will agree with me on this or understand what I'm trying to say but here goes. When Lebron, Wade and Carmelo came into the league it was as if David Stern went crazy to change the rules to allow those three guys easier oppurtunities to score, if you look at all of the rule changes over the past couple of years, they all help those 3 players tremendously. Do you guys think that Lebron would have had these same stats back if he was in the league in the 90's like Kobe, where there were lockdown defenders on nearly everyteam? Now I know Kobe has recently benefitted from these rule changes as well, but just try to imagine Kobe's stats if he were just entering the league right now out of high school, and everything about him basketball wise was the same as in 96, I'm willing to bet Kobe would be close to Wade and Bron's level just off of his athletic ability. Anyways I'm not sure if people are gonna understand what I'm trying to say, but to put it short, Lebron's offensive numbers are benefiting greatly due to he rule changes.
 

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thug_immortal8 said:
Lebron's offensive numbers are benefiting greatly due to he rule changes.
True..partially. NBA has changed rules, But like you said. Its as if "Stern went crazy to change the rules to allow those three guys easier oppurtunities to score" I dont buy that, my opinion. League officials changed it due to the recent delcine in scoring. Less Score=Possibly less fan base. Lets face it, a good scoring game is better than a good defensive game. At least thats what I think what majority of the NBA fan base wants to see.

Im not a Lebron fan, I love Kobe for the same exact reason that I hate Lebron, and hate Kobe for the same reason Lebron is loved. Thanks Kobe/Nike :) .......But this we cannot deny, Lebron's skill level is highly developed in only his 3rd year in the league. A few knack on him would be " No defense" or "Not as clutch as _______" insert favorite player here, can be improved overtime.. Surely and there's no doubt as of this point that Lebron is not on Kobe's level offensively and
defensively but I thinks its a bit of understatement and is misleading ourselves if we were to say that Lebron is not athletically gifted offensively.

Just to keep some facts straight, I am a Kobe fan eversince..... even before he even wore an NBA cap on draft night and shook Davd Stern's hand., and no I am not jumping the Lebron James roller coaster ride.

When some Laker fans back then were doubting Kobe, shooting airballs after airballs in the post season against Utah..I firmly believed he can be a great player...fast forward and im glad that he turned up to be exactly what I think he would be.

But guys Lebron James is just too damn good and its too early to close the book or judge who may be ahead than who even compared to what Kobe has already accomplished.
 

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sherako said:
Hmm? Prediction isn't a human's strong suit, but this topic to me is interesting. I think when Kobe retires, he will be ranked among the top20-25 to EVER play this game, as the second best SG behind Air.
Till now, i don't see why Kobe should be considered Top-20/25 All time.
And the second best SG will forever be Jerry West (i know some people consider him a PG, but he wasn't)

So really a rephrasal would be, will LeBron rank among the top20 when its all said and done? If one were to say yes, then what would be required for that ranking?
Lebron James can be the frabnchise player for a championship team (and for many, many years). Kobe (till now) was a great player who was alongside Shaq's Lakers, and when becoming the franchise player, not showing much.

I'd say the odds are favouring Lebron surpassing Kobe...
 

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Wait until Lebron got his first ring, then we could talk about whether he could surpass Kobe or not. So far, I do not see it. A ring is a ring, you don't judge whether Kobe got the ring because of Shaq or not. Shaq might not get the ring without Kobe also.
 

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Lebron James isn't even close to being the type of scorer that Kobe is, so when you say except for MAYBE the 81 outburst, that is completely wrong. How can you think that anyone right now can hang with Kobe Bryant right now when it comes to scoring, is beyond me.
 

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Lets just end this right now

Things to do For Lebron to pass Kobe:

1. Get to the playoffs
2. Dominate in the playoffs
3. Win a championship
4. Repeat steps 1 through 3 three or more times
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5. Win finals MVP
6. Win Season MVP

Lebron has about 17 more years left in him so He has plenty of time to accomplish those six things, which then and only then will he surpass Kobe.

End of thread.
 

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The One said:
Lets just end this right now

Things to do For Lebron to pass Kobe:

1. Get to the playoffs
2. Dominate in the playoffs
3. Win a championship
4. Repeat steps 1 through 3 three or more times
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5. Win finals MVP
6. Win Season MVP

Lebron has about 17 more years left in him so He has plenty of time to accomplish those six things, which then and only then will he surpass Kobe.

End of thread.
5 and 6 are a stretch...
 
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